• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join freeLog in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

So...Would you take the Gig?

Do you take the gig?

  • Heck no! You don't need no disrespect!

    Votes: 1 0.6%
  • No. The band has soured on the venue. Any issue and it will be your fault for booking it!

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes. Be a professional and play the gig and earn future gigs because we're good.

    Votes: 157 99.4%

  • Total voters
    158
Lots of great advice so far! I'm glad I'm not way out of line on this.

...In the future, only give the details necessary for the gig (time, location, pay, dress, material, etc.). Booking is hard enough, and no need to introduce unnecessary details for people to potentially whine about.

This! Lesson learned the hard way...which is usually how lessons are learned! Thank you!
 
  • Like
Reactions: electracoyote
IMO, most club owners #1 focus is $ and could care less about the band or music....if someone passing gas in a microphone draws a huge crowd, guess who they will book. The whole thing about getting less because your a 3 piece is just a tactic to pay you less.

I'm used to the "less pay for less heads" tactic. This was the opposite and why I shared it with my bandmates. He was encouraging to add another member to be a bigger band...which would ultimately get us more money in other situations where they do employ a headcount to determine pay. Either way, just another tactic and nothing more.
 
In the city where I used to live, certain rooms had Union requirements for how many musicians were hired to play the room certain nights. Although we were a quartet, depending on room size, or if it was a Saturday, in some you "had" to hire 1 extra guy, some 2 musicians, or you couldn't play the gig.
We always had a cadre of people who could cover, it could be a percussionist, could be a flute player to add a few solos throughout the night. We made our living as musicians, so flexibility was key.
 
Dude your bandmates are soft if that cheesed them off lol. I can sort of see where he's coming from, but I'd be more concerned about whether your gear takes up the stage or not (like do you guys have half/full stacks or little 1x12 combos and a 4-piece drumset). Still seems kinda random of him to ask that though, I doubt any patrons complained about that before lol
 
More_Cowbell_with_Will_Ferrell_on_SNL___Vide.jpg

I'll show up with a wig, proper dress and my "instrument" for no charge.

Problem solved.
 
TL:DR Booking agent slighted the band based on size and now the band doesn't want the gig.

As the primary person who books our gigs, I spend a lot of time finding places, making contact, establishing rapport, and then negotiating for the best possible outcome on both sides. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. The other guys in the band have asked me to start pushing into a larger metropolitan area to see if we can expand our footprint and get into better venues. So, I've spent several months finding the appropriate venues, sending out teasers, follow-up calls with the venue, more follow-up calls/emails with the venues, all in an attempt to get that lucrative booking person's contact info. It takes a ton of time and when one finally bites, it's pretty exciting.

Anyway, I've also learned through booking gigs that many venue managers, booking agents, bar managers, etc. do their darndest to talk you down, belittle you, come up with reasons why they shouldn't pay what I'm asking, etc, etc. They have a vested interest in managing the expenses on their end of the equation so I understand it's how they choose to negotiate...and, I must say, I've gotten pretty good at not taking any of it personally. Most of the time, the resulting gig goes great, we end up with future bookings, and my bandmates are none-the-wiser.

...Until last night. I've been courting a metro area bar, known for booking mid-to-upper tier bands (we're a low-to-mid tier band, depending on the night but that's another thread!). In the conversation/negotiation, he hesitated once he found out we were a trio and actually asked me if we ever considered adding a fourth member. When I asked him why that would matter, he said they have a fairly large stage and trios and duos look pretty small on the stage. At that point, many things run through my head but I tell him that we've played many large stages (which we have) but we've yet to be told we come off as small or that our sound doesn't fill the room (we can be, uhm, LOUD!). He get's past it and we set up a tentative date for in October. Tentative because of how he wants to structure the comp, which is what concerned me so I wanted to discuss with the other guys.

Now, what comes next, has me completely bamboozled. I get ahold of the other two guys via text and tell them what's what. They're excited as it's another metro bar and are ok with the price. I then, for some reason, tell them about the comment on adding a fourth member and the guy being concerned about filling the stage. For some reason, this sets them both off and they go all in on what a d-bag this guy is and who is he to say that yadda yadda yadda. Up and to the point where they say they don't want to do the gig.

Now I'm p'd off. So I called them soft if that comment was enough to offend them. I also reminded them that, as the person who's doing 99% of our bookings, I hear all sorts of things from booking agents, bar managers, owners, etc. and it's part of how they negotiate the price down but if this comment has them so defeated that they feel they couldn't play the gig, I'll tell the venue we're a no go on the date and close that door and let the months of effort go to waste.

What would you do? Let it sit for a couple days until they get over themselves and reconsider or shut the door knowing it will be an uphill battle regardless?
Grab another guitarist, a back up singer, a percussionist or something and make that paper!
 
TL:DR Booking agent slighted the band based on size and now the band doesn't want the gig.
What would you do? Let it sit for a couple days until they get over themselves and reconsider or shut the door knowing it will be an uphill battle regardless?

These guys don't get business. I'd talk to them about it, let them know that this is pale compared to the rejection you get in the course of your work, and convince them to do the gig.

Depending how far away it is, if they balk, I'd let them know you're going to find a sub because "gigs beget gigs". It's a lot of work to find the gig, and it's not a big deal. It doesn't displace their spot in the band as first call musician, but you are going to do the gig with some other musicians in time who are happy to fill in.

This will create some healthy competition for their positions, preserve you the gig, and set you up to book gigs with barely checking with musicians in the future. Use these setbacks to strengthen your own position.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jamvan and JRA
do the gig, make some stage props and develop an act to include the audience in some way.
Make a big sign with your band name.
Put side banners next to the amps with a sweet logo.
run back and forth on stage between vocal verses.
Call all your friends, borrow all the 4×12 guitar cabs, 4x10 and 115 bass cabs and build a wall! You can still run your combos with mics behind it!
 
A. Take the gig, tell your guys to get on the team.
B. Get a wall of amps backdrop.
C. Get a life sized cutout of the star that most represent your genre.
D. GAIN WEIGHT! My three piece grosses about 650 excluding instruments. We cam fill a lot of stage!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jamvan
I know that we all like to talk trash about club owners (god knows I've seen my share of jerks) but over my years of life experience (61) I've learned not to jump to conclusions. Perhaps the guy has booked a trio or two in the past that didn't quite cut it in his club. That doesn't necessarily reflect on you and your band, but he may be cautious based on experience, so your approach seems reasonable to me - show him what you can do. He may have his own reasons for being cautious, but it sounds like he's giving you a shot at it.

I've played in trios and in 5-piece cover bands doing similar material, and without question the 5-piece (with keys and 2 guitars and 4 vocalists) puts out a bigger sound, looks better on stage, and overall puts on a better show (not necessarily louder). Lets face it, its show business as well as making music.

Your band mates need to thicken their skin a bit - kudos on you for doing all of the hard work in getting your band to this point, but as others have said from now on it sounds like it'd serve you better to keep much of the drudgery of booking on a "need to know" basis. Good luck on the gig - knock them dead!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jamvan

Latest posts