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Solder noob help

#23
C.Linton said:
One other thing that I personally recommend using is soldering flux paste. Learning how to use that properly will make soldering TONS easier. It may involve a little extra cleanup, but it's worth it, IMO.
Click to expand...

Good solder will have a rosin core already, which provides adequate flux for a single well-heated joint (at least on a PC board!). The main concerns with using external paste are:

1) You might accidentally get acid-based flux! This will destroy whatever you're working on, as it's intended for soldering metal parts together, not electronics. Be very sure.
2) As a beginner, you will inevitably get too much on a joint, which can interfere with the integrity of the connection you just made. I can't count the number of connections I've repaired over the years where merely heating the joint caused excess flux to literally boil out in big drops.

And as far as a gun goes: they're better for experienced technicians, because they are meant to generate a LOT of heat quickly, and can easily damage small electronic components. With a properly sized pencil iron, you can hold it against the joint for as long as you reasonably need to, without fear of frying something. Save that gun for soldering star grounds or big connectors.

Just a few things I've learned in 40+ years of watching pros at work and building lots of stuff myself.... ;)
 
#24
GregDunn said:
Good solder will have a rosin core already, which provides adequate flux for a single well-heated joint (at least on a PC board!). The main concerns with using external paste are:

1) You might accidentally get acid-based flux! This will destroy whatever you're working on, as it's intended for soldering metal parts together, not electronics. Be very sure.
2) As a beginner, you will inevitably get too much on a joint, which can interfere with the integrity of the connection you just made. I can't count the number of connections I've repaired over the years where merely heating the joint caused excess flux to literally boil out in big drops.

And as far as a gun goes: they're better for experienced technicians, because they are meant to generate a LOT of heat quickly, and can easily damage small electronic components. With a properly sized pencil iron, you can hold it against the joint for as long as you reasonably need to, without fear of frying something. Save that gun for soldering star grounds or big connectors.

Just a few things I've learned in 40+ years of watching pros at work and building lots of stuff myself.... ;)
Click to expand...

+1

For the casual noob solder job I recommend the 40W RS pencil (a mere $10 or so.) Someone listed one above. A gun can get WAY too hot and even *I* have been known to scorch a part or two with one and I've been soldering for decades.

The gun, on the other hand, heats fast which greatly reduces the hassle factor...but you can pay the price. Best (and what I use) is a RS temperature controlled solder station. They heat to temperature very fast and eliminate that hassle of waiting for the iron to heat. I'd recommend one if you have the money.

Personally I wouldn't recommend flux of ANY kind for electronic soldering. Just use the rosin in the core of the solder. If the joint starts to oxidize just melt more solder (and hence flux) onto it. If you get too much solder there just pull it off with the iron tip and wipe it off on the wet sponge (what it's for). Note that acid flux eats electronics. It's for soldering metal. You DO NOT want to ever use it. But it's worse. If you buy electronic rosin flux (liquid) you may think you are OK but you are not. It has acid in it too! It's designed to drive off the acid when joints are heated thoroughly. Hence it's a bit tricky to use too. And finally there is electronic flux that actually IS acid! It's clear and commonly used with surface mount parts. This flux MUST be washed off with water after soldering. Obviously this isn't going to be practical for guitar electronics (except perhaps for a circuit board outside the instrument where components have been carefully chosen to withstand washing). Just leave flux alone! Use the flux in the solder core.

Finally there is a question of tips being eaten up. Note that copper tips work very well for soldering but the solder alloys with the copper and dissolves the metal of the tip eventually. Hence replacement tips is an issue. If you can buy a bunch when you buy the iron, do so! Iron plated tips won't alloy, but are harder to tin and eventually will break down and start to be eaten away. Once they start they will soon be doomed. Again if you can buy tips with the iron, even iron plated ones, do so.

Good luck!
 
#25
What bassbenj says. Tips don't last forever even when carefully maintained. Keep them coated lightly (tinned) with solder at all times to slow down the degradation of the coating. While this might seem to actually speed it up, what you're trying to do is not have to abrade the tip and re-apply solder frequently.
 
#26
Well, all I can say is that I personally have had nothing but good results using flux, and have run into more problems damaging the work when NOT using it. As long as I was careful and didn't get carried away with using huge blobs of it, The job went quicker and easier with it than without it. That's MY experience, anyway.
 
#27
I'm all about pencil irons. Had a big Weller gun, and hated it.

I don't agree regarding too hot irons. (at least not a little too hot.) Too cold irons burn parts. If the iron is good and hot, I can get in , get the joint soldered, and get out before the heat flows to the components. While a weak iron is taking forever to heat the joint, heat travels too nearby parts, melting insulation, and frying parts.

Too hot has its risks, but too cold is worse. IME
 
#28
C.Linton: if it works for you, fab. :) Just cautioning those who are only starting out.

ulrich: the problem is not the temperature, it's the thermal mass of the gun. That thing can dump a lot of heat into the surrounding parts in a hurry, whereas the pencil puts the heat right on the joint and doesn't spread it around. The temperature has to be about 800F regardless, or you're right - you will sit there all day and roast the part. So definitely the OP needs a sufficiently powerful iron. I just think it's safer to start out with a good, hot, but small iron till you're experienced.
 
#29
I used to make my own flux in the Navy. It was just hydrochloric acid and zinc powder - if I remember well.

What happens when you don't make it correctly, is that the acid remains acid instead of being 'killed' when you mix suficient zinc into it ad that's when corrosion happens.

'Killed' - flux is totally neutral, neither acid or alkali and won't hurt anything electronic.

Of course - the new Cal/EPA, Eco-fluxes are all user friendly and won't harm the yellow toad tree frogs so they might not even work anyway.

I still have a small vat full of genuine USN-approved flux that I guard carefully. It works fine if you can hold the upper end of a conversation with a ballpeign hammer.
 
#30
Ok so part arrived....So I am pulling out the old pot, stripping a bit of the wires insulation, and then putting the wires through the corresponding holes in the pot...I will have tinned (which is putting some solder on the tip of the pencil and the wires?) and then add a drop of solder on the board/tip of wire....Am I grossly wrong?
This is my impression after watching a bunch of videos and reading.
Please let me know if I am off somewhere.
I am going to attempt this tonight when i get home (in a few hours)
If im good to go I will be back with results!!
Excited!!
 
#33
FWIW, I had to abort my electronics swap tonight. I soldered the neck pickup lead to the blender pot with the kit OUT of the bass (the lug ends up on the bottom against the wood when it's in). I got the tone stack in there, then the remaining pots would't fit thru the holes. They're all smaller for some reason. Drat! In my earlier days I would have been tempted to try and ream them out right there. Instead, I unsoldered the pickup lead, used a braid to clean up the lug a bit, neatly repacked the new electronics and put away my toys. I'll have to start again later in the week, after I resize those holes.

Moral: Patience. It's easy to get excited and plow through something like this, but at what risk?

Not trying to lecture, just wanted to share my experience tonight, as it seemed relative.
 
#34
Ok so a little update...I soldered the wire back to the battery harness which came loose and now that is %100. I am having a little trouble "picking up" solder with the pencil. Sometimes a get a tiny bit which is really good and I have no problem. Other times it seems without warning I get a big bubble and it starts to smoke a little. Needless to say though it may not be perfect it works and I pretty happy. Now on to the second solder which was wiring in a new pot. I had to solder 6 wires to the little piece of pc board. For some reason it isnt work too well. The bass will play but if I adjust the pot (bottom one) beyond the very end of the range it cuts out and will not play. The top pot works ok i guess. I am going to make sure I got the right order for the wires and then pull and re solder them one by one tomorrow. I hope this will eliminate any potential problem, because otherwise I cant imagine what the issue would be...
More to come....
 
#35
CactusBass said:
Ok so a little update...I soldered the wire back to the battery harness which came loose and now that is %100. I am having a little trouble "picking up" solder with the pencil. Sometimes a get a tiny bit which is really good and I have no problem. Other times it seems without warning I get a big bubble and it starts to smoke a little. Needless to say though it may not be perfect it works and I pretty happy. Now on to the second solder which was wiring in a new pot. I had to solder 6 wires to the little piece of pc board. For some reason it isnt work too well. The bass will play but if I adjust the pot (bottom one) beyond the very end of the range it cuts out and will not play. The top pot works ok i guess. I am going to make sure I got the right order for the wires and then pull and re solder them one by one tomorrow. I hope this will eliminate any potential problem, because otherwise I cant imagine what the issue would be...
More to come....
Click to expand...

Solder will flow onto whatever is heated to a proper temperature, so if you hold the iron against the part too long, you'll heat the part and you won't be able to "pick up" a small piece with the iron. I'm not even sure why you're trying to "pick up" solder; just use a desoldering pump. Even the cheapo one from Radioshack, however much I despise it, would be more practical than trying to use your iron as a scoop. All IMO, but if you're going to continue doing electrical work like this, a pump would probably be a good investment anyway.

As for the problems you're having: if you can, posting pictures of your soldering work will help others critique your technique and find a solution. Apart from that, do you have a multimeter or even just a plain ohmmeter with which to check your connections?
 
#36
OK here are some pictures. I will try to make this all as clear as possible.
Also I found that on the other stacked pot a brown wire seemed to have come loose so I soldered it on to the only available place on that pot.
Here are some pictures...
This is the old pot that I reattached the wire to (middle solder)
http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt346/CactusBass/IMG_0185.jpg

Here is the new pot (i had a lot of trouble with the two inside ones on the series of 4 so
they basically merged into one big blob)
http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt346/CactusBass/IMG_0186.jpg

Now the bass still isnt working...I am thinking I somehow screwed up the order of the wires...Here is a picture The first (left to right) is the old pot and the second 6 wires go to the new pot. Not sure if this will be helpful, but I thought the order they are on the preamp may help determine the order to solder them into the pot. http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt346/CactusBass/IMG_0188.jpg

I am starting to think I got in over my head, but I am still willing to keep trying and do this **** right. PLease any additional help would be awesome!
Thanks
Ben
 
#38
Your guess is as good as mine as to how it should be wired up; try getting a hold of a wiring diagram for the preamp. I believe the manufacturer's website should have it as a PDF, otherwise you can consult Google for sites that offer schematics for that type of thing.

From what I can tell, the first picture looks all right except for the top and bottom joints on the left; it could just be the lighting, but they look like they could be cold solder joints. One thing to always watch for when soldering is cold solder joints - you'll know them by their dirty, cloudy appearance. They're not nearly as strong as a properly formed joint, and they often introduce unneeded resistance into the signal. In audio, this often translates into noise or a poor signal.

That second picture definitely could use a second pass, if at all possible. You can see which lead is supposed to be connected to which by the light green "paths." If two leads are not connected by the light green, and you connect them with solder, it'll create a short-circuit and it won't work properly. This reinforces the importance of a wiring diagram, though it is possible if you can carefully follow the intended signal flow.

Don't get too frustrated; the beauty of soldering is that, for the most part, you can easily reverse any screw-ups you make when securing a joint. It's not easy at first, but thankfully it doesn't take too much practice to get a handle on the technique.
 
#39
Did you somehow jump two runs on the circuit board together?

PC%20Blob.png
 
#40
Yes. I have now resoldered the boards both according to the schematic!!!
AND IT WORKS!!! (kinda)
One issue is that one of the pots when turned crackles and then drastically cuts volume.
Any suggestions?

(also I am proud to be in this copyrighted photo!!)
 

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