Double Bass Spirocore Stark

[LouisF]

I think (or at least I think I heard) that when Yuri Temirkanov was music director of the Baltimore Symphony he had the whole section switch to Starks. Again, I don't know if it's true. But I was a visiting professor at Loyola during his time there and heard the orchestra in a couple of Russian programs and it (and this may be the hall not the strings) was the most direct, up front, in your face bass section sound I've heard in the US.

Also, I've played both Starks and Jargar fortes and the Jargars have much less apparent tension in the feel of the left hand and a little slower to start under the bow. They are warmer (in that supposed "gut like" way) and much less direct in sound.

 

[stefaniw80401]

Dominant GDA with a stark E on the bottom.

Hey Chris, have you tried Dominant solos at orchestra pitch? I think part of the arco scratchiness of regular Dominants is the stiffness/tension of the string. I wonder if that would be less of a problem with Dom solos at orchestra pitch?

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Hey Chris, have you tried Dominant solos at orchestra pitch? I think part of the arco scratchiness of regular Dominants is the stiffness/tension of the string. I wonder if that would be less of a problem with Dom solos at orchestra pitch?

Never

Never had them on my bass, but played them on someone else’s once. I found them too light, but I didn’t try to bow them.

 

[Selim]

Hey Chris, have you tried Dominant solos at orchestra pitch? I think part of the arco scratchiness of regular Dominants is the stiffness/tension of the string. I wonder if that would be less of a problem with Dom solos at orchestra pitch?

I had them on for about a week, maybe 6 years ago. A lot of fun to bow and very easy and I don’t remember any scratchy sound. But the pizzicato didn’t have enough bottom end for me.

I still have that set - I thought I’d keep them for when I get too old to use regular gauge strings!

 

[foilracer]

Thanks! I’m biased, but I think that tension can be heard as a kind of “directness” if the strings are struck in a certain way. That sound is a large part of why I like tense strings. I think it’s probably why they amplify so well, too. Ultimately the Starks were a bit too much, but I learned a lot from playing them for a couple of years.

OK...so ten weeks ago I chose Helicore Arco heavy for 90% arco....they seem just right. Has anyone found similar success with Flexocore Stark arco? (Flexocore 92 stark)? Soon I'll try the stark Flexocore for myself...any other Arco comparisons here?

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

I don’t have any recordings that I know to exist without a lot of digging, but I had a 1900ish German roundback strung with 92 Starks for a while. It sounded huge and smooth.

 

[stefaniw80401]

I don't think Pirastro makes a Flex92 stark extended-E string...I could be wrong...I've been tempted to try D'Addario Kaplan starks, but the Kaplan lights sound great arco -- i.e. "immediate" response -- for the most part. The benefit being that they're not too bad pizz.

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

The 92 Stark long Es were discontinued years ago. I heard Ken Smith bought them all.

 

[stefaniw80401]

The 92 Stark long Es were discontinued years ago. I heard Ken Smith bought them all.

That's right -- I remember that now.

 

[clclark]

The 92 Stark long Es were discontinued years ago. I heard Ken Smith bought them all.

I bought a bow from him a few years ago. While there, I remember him telling me that was his favorite E string and how disappointed he was that Pirastro discontinued it. In all fairness, when he saw I had spiros on my bass he told me I should get some real strings.

 

[JBarz]

I had some 'bass bucks' saved up at Gollihurs, so I made the leap and got a Stark E - and I couldn't be more pleased! Like everyone mentions in this thread, it's just like everything I've always loved about the Spiro Mitt E (long my standard go-to E string), but just more of it. More beef, more resonance throughout the whole instrument, more pop, more zing, more charm. My NS La Scala just seems happier, in lack of a better word. I'm running Stark E, 3/4 Spiro Mitt A, and Stark Perpetual D and G. The new Stark E really balances out the set - I don't have to hit the E string a little softer than the rest to avoid fingerboard noise anymore - and everything is coming out a lot more clearly across all strings, especially in thumb position and up. I am looking forward to it breaking in!

 

[james condino]

......it's just like everything I've always loved about the Spiro Mitt E (long my standard go-to E string), but just more of it. More beef, more resonance throughout the whole instrument, more pop, more zing, more charm......

+1....on the right bass.....

 

[Sam Reese]

My Stark G is playing well with EAD Spiro Mitts. @zootsaxes is saying exactly what I was thinking might happen if I swap out my Mitt E for a Stark. Tempting. Thanks for the info.

 

[bassically_eli]

My Stark G is playing well with EAD Spiro Mitts. @zootsaxes is saying exactly what I was thinking might happen if I swap out my Mitt E for a Stark. Tempting. Thanks for the info.

Stark G and Stark E with Mittel A and D? And all the same scale length? Seems a little unusual, but if that's what works for you and your bass then great. Are you sure you don't want to try a full set of Starks?

 

[bassically_eli]

So I've been following this thread for a while now, but I'm still confused about how the Starks bow compared to the mittels and weichs. I have noticed that weichs seem to be not so uncommon among arco/classical players. I believe Xavier Foley uses weichs, and I absolutely love his sound. I play arco maybe 30% of the time (on gigs anyway), but that number is increasing lately because that's part of playing that I really love. The vast majority of my practice is with the bow. Point is, I really don't know what direction to head in with my next string purchase. I'm pretty sure a Stark E would be an improvement over the Mittel. But what about a whole set of Starks? Will they be harder to bow? Should I be thinking about mixing in some weichs?I 'm currently using 3/4 Mittel E and A with Obligato D and G on an Engelhardt ply.

Not to mention the various gut/synthetic gut options ....

 

[Sam Reese]

@bassically_eli I'll probably stick with the 3 Mitts w/ Stark G for a while (everything's new).

 

[AGCurry]

... what about a whole set of Starks? Will they be harder to bow? Should I be thinking about mixing in some weichs?

I found mittel harder to start with the bow than weich, so I assume stark would be harder to start than mittel. Purely my experience and assumption.

 

[sean_on_bass]

So I've been following this thread for a while now, but I'm still confused about how the Starks bow compared to the mittels and weichs. I have noticed that weichs seem to be not so uncommon among arco/classical players. I believe Xavier Foley uses weichs, and I absolutely love his sound. I play arco maybe 30% of the time (on gigs anyway), but that number is increasing lately because that's part of playing that I really love. The vast majority of my practice is with the bow. Point is, I really don't know what direction to head in with my next string purchase. I'm pretty sure a Stark E would be an improvement over the Mittel. But what about a whole set of Starks? Will they be harder to bow? Should I be thinking about mixing in some weichs?I 'm currently using 3/4 Mittel E and A with Obligato D and G on an Engelhardt ply.

Not to mention the various gut/synthetic gut options ....

I find many solo arco players use strings geared toward that, which are usually lighter string sets. They might not use them if they were doing sectional playing. In fact, many have spoken that there can be issues blending a Spiro player into a section with other string sets.

But back to weich vs stark. Weich are way less tense and will "budge" easier which mean the string will be easier to get started. The Starks may require different bow pressure and speed to achieve the same. Starks will likely shine when it comes to raw power though. Weichs will "choke" out at a certain intensity of playing while Starks will keep going.

This all assume yours bass actually likes the high tension of the Stark vs Weich. Some basses can't handle it and will choke out in a different way. Sometimes it's more about finding the right string for the bass in question that gives a nice balance without making the player work extra hard. You never know what a bass can handle until you try. Personally, Starks on my ply bass were a bit overboard. They sounded good/thick, but the lack of playability threw the system out of balance. You're bass may handle it better, or worse. Fortunately Spiros come in a wide range of tensions so you can find the right set for your bass.

 

[Sam Reese]

The Stark G starts fine. It's no big effort to get good and easy tone out of it arco. Sometimes I wonder why it's such a big difference for other people. I dunno...if you didn't tell me the strings were Weich, Mittel or Stark, I would approach them the same way as always and play the string how it is telling me to approach it. Between temperature, humidity and which way the wind is blowing- I have enough to think about playing double bass.

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

Starks have to be basically laying on the fingerboard, at least for me. I ran a set on my first bass, an overbuilt Hofner ply, and that was a killer gig setup, even for slapping.

The late Paul Warburton ran full sets of Starks on his five-strings so I suspect more basses can handle their tension than might seem immediately obvious.