Double Bass Spirocores... dammit

[Kael]

For years I refused to use Spirocores. I was convinced they were either too high tension, too zingy for the mostly Americana work I was getting, etc. Well I broke down and put a S42 set on my bass a week and a half ago. Dang it I should've been using these the entire time. They don't feel any stiffer than the Superflexibles I settled on years ago and they sing out more which suits my style. They are still relatively bright, but given my bass is a chadwick, the strings have been dentenstioned and brought back up to tension 3 or 4 times which is helping to settle them in.

I admit it. I am yet another Spirocore convert evidently.

Pretty pointless post. Just wanted to admit my willful stupidity in public.

 

[BobDeRosa]

Assumptions can be horrible. Congrats for allowing yourself to experience reality. I look at non-Spiros when contemplating string changes, and then ask myself ... Why?

 

[TroyK]

I think a lot of us have been talked out of giving Spirocores a chance by things that are said about them. My first great jazz teacher told me not to use them because he wanted to work on arco. 15 years later they were on my bass when I studied with a classical bassist and she thought they were delightful.

I find Superflexibles (ironically) to be stiffer than corresponding Spirocores and not available in as many gauges.

I think of it this way now, every other string on the market could be thought of in terms of how they are like and how they are distinct from Spirocores or guts, especially in a pizzicato context.

e.g.- Superflexibles are similar to Spirocores, but supposedly more arco friendly.

Jazzers were said to be Pirastros equivalent to Spirocores.

Some strings are said to be "gut like", but usually not by people who have spent real time playing on actual gut.

I've been strictly Spirocores for over 2 years now after decades of mostly avoiding them. I won't say that I'll never try anything else, but I'm getting what I need out of them and I've never been on a gig where I regretted them, which I can't say about other strings that I may have liked at home. If I use different strings later, I'll be comparing them, favorably or unfavorably to Spirocores.

It doesn't hurt that I'm not watching the calendar and budgeting for their replacements.

 

[james condino]

I install around 75+ different sets of strings every year for other people. At the end of the day, I may vary the G string, but I cannot honestly remember when I used something other than Spirocore mittles (or occasional starks) on my personal basses. They just work; put 'em on and forget about strings for the next three years...

Some strings are said to be "gut like", but usually not by people who have spent real time playing on actual gut.

TRUTH!

 

[LouisF]

In the old days, when my hands were arthritis and tendonitis free, I played nothing but Spiro Starks on my Gagnon Maggini and New Standard Cleveland. The sound was floor shaking. Gradually went through Jargars, Passiones, Obligatos, Sensicores, Corellis etc etc as things got worse (because of the Starks? don't ask) until it came to guts -- raw guts -- and only guts.

It would be a much simpler world with only chocolate and vanilla, spiros or guts!

 

[the_Ryan]

I think a lot of us have been talked out of giving Spirocores a chance by things that are said about them. My first great jazz teacher told me not to use them because he wanted to work on arco. 15 years later they were on my bass when I studied with a classical bassist and she thought they were delightful.

I find Superflexibles (ironically) to be stiffer than corresponding Spirocores and not available in as many gauges.

I think of it this way now, every other string on the market could be thought of in terms of how they are like and how they are distinct from Spirocores or guts, especially in a pizzicato context.

e.g.- Superflexibles are similar to Spirocores, but supposedly more arco friendly.

Jazzers were said to be Pirastros equivalent to Spirocores.

Some strings are said to be "gut like", but usually not by people who have spent real time playing on actual gut.

I've been strictly Spirocores for over 2 years now after decades of mostly avoiding them. I won't say that I'll never try anything else, but I'm getting what I need out of them and I've never been on a gig where I regretted them, which I can't say about other strings that I may have liked at home. If I use different strings later, I'll be comparing them, favorably or unfavorably to Spirocores.

It doesn't hurt that I'm not watching the calendar and budgeting for their replacements.

I think within the past decade+ there’s definitely been a shift from the “you can’t bow spiros” mentality on the classical side. They are certainly more revealing of technical flaws than more arco-oriented strings (and even when broken in are extremely bright), and the orchestra gauges really won’t work on some basses, but those asterisks shouldn’t deter people from at least trying them.

 

[TroyK]

Agree and I'm not a section player. I am led to believe and don't doubt that one bassist playing Spirocores in a section of colleagues using Flexicores isn't likely to sit the way that anyone wants them to.

As to gauges, this took me a long time to sort out, but more there are gauges of Spirocores than any other string...by a lot. I think there is a gauge for every bass and bassist IF they want to be playing with Spirocores.

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/thomastik-string-gauges.1546140/

 

[Kael]

Pointless addendum, I totally fat fingered spelling detensioned and saved it. Now it is too late to edit and hide my grammatical shame. Eh, it can live on with my string shame in the initial post.

 

[the_Ryan]

Agree and I'm not a section player. I am led to believe and don't doubt that one bassist playing Spirocores in a section of colleagues using Flexicores isn't likely to sit the way that anyone wants them to.

As to gauges, this took me a long time to sort out, but more there are gauges of Spirocores than any other string...by a lot. I think there is a gauge for every bass and bassist IF they want to be playing with Spirocores.

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/thomastik-string-gauges.1546140/

I think they blend fine in a section, a lot of the harshness you can hear up close does go away when you're in front of the bass, and that harshness turns into clarity, especially on the low strings. The only reason I went from full weichs to BC GD, 3/4* weich A, and 4/4 weich long E was that I felt the G and D strings had a much thinner sound compared to the A and E and I wanted something with more bass and a little less treble on the G and D without sacrificing any power and clarity on the A and E.

*I actually can't remember if my A is a 3/4 or 4/4 string, I just went back to weichs after a brief detour with mitts (loved the power, hated the left hand fatigue and my bass definitely got grumpy with the much higher tension) and I just grabbed the least beat-up weich A in my stash.

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

The irony is that, as I heard the story, Spiros were formulated for dark-sounding, ancient Italian orchestra cannons. Jazz people liking them was just a twist of fate.

Spiro Mittels work great for thumpy roots lines if your left-hand muting technique is solid.

 

[CaseyVancouver]

I love my Spiro stark E in symphony, and even chamber playing. It is serious when needed.

The D and G are flex.

 

[jmpiwonka]

If you let the spiros age a bit they really smooth out.
Also, looking at that tension xls spreadsheet, i seem to remember that superflexibles are higher tension than the S42 spiros.

 

[Eli Brockway]

Some strings are said to be "gut like", but usually not by people who have spent real time playing on actual gut.

As my own little add-on to this point, I've said it before and I'll say it again: in terms of them amplifying every last bit of information you put into them, giving back everything you give them and more, Spirocores are the most gut-like string. Especially under the bow.

Some other strings might sound or feel closer to guts, but Spiros are the only ones that respond like guts.

 

[Kael]

i seem to remember that superflexibles are higher tension than the S42 spiros.

I'd buy that.

 

[TroyK]

As my own little add-on to this point, I've said it before and I'll say it again: in terms of them amplifying every last bit of information you put into them, giving back everything you give them and more, Spirocores are the most gut-like string. Especially under the bow.

Some other strings might sound or feel closer to guts, but Spiros are the only ones that respond like guts.

This is a very weird perspective...and I don't disagree.

We talk about Spirocores and Guts as being opposite ends of a spectrum, but I feel like they share something in common that is missing from a lot of strings.

 

[Jeff Kissell]

As my own little add-on to this point, I've said it before and I'll say it again: in terms of them amplifying every last bit of information you put into them, giving back everything you give them and more, Spirocores are the most gut-like string. Especially under the bow.

Some other strings might sound or feel closer to guts, but Spiros are the only ones that respond like guts.

This is a very weird perspective...and I don't disagree.

We talk about Spirocores and Guts as being opposite ends of a spectrum, but I feel like they share something in common that is missing from a lot of strings.

This has been my experience as well. Spirocore were originally designed to replace gut strings in an orchestral setting… well actually to update the Superflexibles according to the Thomastik website history. They weren’t adopted as a jazz string until later.
My biggest difficulty is adjusting to the diameters between low tension steel core and gut.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

I have a customer with a very nice old German bass who is always changing strings. Spirocores, Corellis, Perpetuals, Spirocores, Corellis, Spirocores…..
A few weeks ago he brought me his bass for a new bridge and I shorten his soundpost and flattened his fingerboard slightly. His jaw dropped when he played the bass with the Spirocores that were on it. He told me he loves his bass and the Spirocore Mitts. The best set of strings is a set of Spirocores AND a good setup. Do it right and forget about it.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

I’ll add that when I accept a bass for consignment it generally gets a set of Spirocores and all restorations get them too. Spirocores will reveal the qualities of an instrument and some strings cover up problems. When you get a bass that sounds good with them it’s a beautiful thing.

 

[Eli Brockway]

I’ll add that when I accept a bass for consignment it generally gets a set of Spirocores and all restorations get them too.

"Unless the person having it done sends me a set of gut strings and demands I put them on instead."

This is a very weird perspective...and I don't disagree.

We talk about Spirocores and Guts as being opposite ends of a spectrum, but I feel like they share something in common that is missing from a lot of strings.

It's really funny, because people will talk about them being wildly different—and they are!—but whenever they start talking about how each string responds under the bow or how much each string can give back what you put into it without choking out, they almost always say the same things.

Obviously the tension, diameter, and sound are going to be different, there's no way around it, but they're both extremely responsive (sometimes to the detriment of the player that isn't careful with what they're doing) and completely unfiltered in their sound.

Spirocores are the only steel string I'd readily play, but guts are always going to be it for me if only for the sake of my hands.

Although I would like to get my hands on a set of Lycons again.

 

[birgedb]

I have a few sets of guts and “gut copies” in my arsenal, and while I loved them at times, nothing beats the setup I have now for many reasons. I can tune the band with these strings after not tuning my bass for a week. I have dynamic control, can bow them, can slap them, can afford them… the biggest issue with my setup is me.