Steve Albini explains why he hates Steely Dan

[HelpImaRock]

I'm not a fan of anything after The Royal Scam, but this tracks:

Invalid Link Removed

 

[J-Mags]

Ohhh, so there’s an Oregon, Wisconsin, and Steely Dan killed his father there. I’m sure the police would like to know about that!

I don't know why people are so mad at Albini when Steely Dan is the Wisconsin Father-Killer!

 

[Wood and Wire]

I imagine another factor is that Albini charges major label artists considerably more for his time as a nominal producer. The few whales they get every year probably help support the independent artists that pay listed rates.

No, he doesn't : everyone pays the same rate, and he doesn't claim points off the back end.

As a consequence of this ethic, there are times when there is a shortfall, and the studios running costs & staff wages have to be covered by Steve playing poker (he's very good at it).

 

[Doug4321]

Back on topic, Steely Dan is all right. Billy Joel and Supertramp, no!

This is a cool song that has made a comeback lately.

 

[GregC]

Ora-gone is a town in Wisconsin, not far from Madison. Spelled Oregon, of course. Is there a town somewhere called Will-ah-MET?

It still sounds to me like the backup singers on "Show Biz Kids" are singing "Laugh Swedish, laugh Swedo-wish." I try very hard to avoid that song.

 

[Grinderman]

It still sounds to me like the backup singers on "Show Biz Kids" are singing "Laugh Swedish, laugh Swedo-wish." I try very hard to avoid that song.

Never heard it or of it. Based on that description though, I hope I don't catch whatever it is.

Did I say "it" enough?

 

[Novarocker]

This thread is hilarious, but not nearly as funny as that Twitter thread.

I only happened to stumble across is because Steve Jenkins, a monster bassist and fan of the Dan, happened to post about funny it was.

Enjoying Steely Dan’s music and laughing out loud at some of the funnier bits in that Twitter rant aren’t mutually exclusive.

I think Steve Albini’s comments are hilarious, and I totally get what he is saying, he is certainly not alone in his assessment of Steely Dan. This is coming from somebody whom has great respect for music of Steely Dan and whom performs the band’s music regularly.

nothing wrong with him having his opinion or voicing his opinion, especially in such a funny manner.

i think agree, or not, he’s entitled to his opinion, as well as his right to share the opinion.

As a society, we need to learn how thicken our skin—not take ourselves, our own opinions as well those opinions of others so seriously. Let’s just laugh it off, and move on with our day.

Just sayin’.

Thank you both and all the others posting from this perspective. I concur and it still baffles me that so many people just get so flipped about anything and everything. The laziness is IMO kinda stupid from all the "never heard of him, but he sucks for insulting SD," when really Steve's just saying the overproduced nature is something he really doesn't like.

Hell if I read or heard the jazz dork hands (which is hilariously epic) I instantly would chalk up everything said as tongue in cheek, potentially valid but over inflated for the sake of a chuckle. Not even for ego, or clicks or anything, just someone trying to be funny but also say their point.

 

[knumbskull]

It’s funny that Steely Dan had such a revival among the young folks recently, especially the Aja album. I guess that’s one thing that both older and younger listeners (some of them) can agree on.

Not a comment on the quality of the music, just that of all the bands of that era and style, they seem like an unlikely choice.

Personally i like Can’t Buy a Thrill but i completely didn’t get Aja, even after a few listens. Whatever’s happening there, it’s not for me!

 

[Ekulati]

It’s pronounced Ory-gun, not Ora-gone.

Exactly. Ora-gone is the "East coast NPR listener who went to a good college yet still somehow has never been nor cared to venture west of the Hudson River" pronunciation.

 

[deff]

Exactly. Ora-gone is the "East coast NPR listener who went to a good college yet still somehow has never been nor cared to venture west of the Hudson River" pronunciation.

Wait... I though it was pronounced Ore..Uh Gun. Is it really pronounced Ore EE Gahn?

 

[WG Plum]

Exactly. Ora-gone is the "East coast NPR listener who went to a good college yet still somehow has never been nor cared to venture west of the Hudson River" pronunciation.

I went to college with a few such folks. They were lovely, but yeah.

 

[TyBo]

Thank you both and all the others posting from this perspective. I concur and it still baffles me that so many people just get so flipped about anything and everything. The laziness is IMO kinda stupid from all the "never heard of him, but he sucks for insulting SD," when really Steve's just saying the overproduced nature is something he really doesn't like.

Hell if I read or heard the jazz dork hands (which is hilariously epic) I instantly would chalk up everything said as tongue in cheek, potentially valid but over inflated for the sake of a chuckle. Not even for ego, or clicks or anything, just someone trying to be funny but also say their point.

I didn't find what Albini said to be offensive, it just didn't seem terribly funny, couldn't really tell for sure if that's what he was going for. It did seem to represent a sort of narrow minded outlook - if that itself was the joke, for me it was a misfire. I prefer a Chauncey Gardener view - "There are many flowers in the garden ... "

 

[Novarocker]

I didn't find what Albini said to be offensive, it just didn't seem terribly funny, couldn't really tell for sure if that's what he was going for. It did seem to represent a sort of narrow minded outlook - if that itself was the joke, for me it was a misfire. I prefer a Chauncey Gardener view - "There are many flowers in the garden ... "

Totally reasonable, I get that too. Nothing wrong with it. Understandable perspective, I can see how to some it wouldn't be funny.

 

[Paul New]

I s*** on Steve whatever his other name is.

 

[HelpImaRock]

Exactly. Ora-gone is the "East coast NPR listener who went to a good college yet still somehow has never been nor cared to venture west of the Hudson River" pronunciation.

No, it's just East Coast. No other qualifiers needed.

The most difficult for me has been Nevada. Neh-va-duh. Apparently, it's Neh-vah-deh.

 

[LBS-bass]

Hell if I read or heard the jazz dork hands (which is hilariously epic) I instantly would chalk up everything said as tongue in cheek,

For me it is "the not bald one" when neither of those guys were bald. It says "I'm not even attentive enough to know what they really look like."

I've said this elsewhere and I'll say it here for the record: There are lots of ways to record music. Albini's way is to attempt to make a good recording of what the band has created. He adds very little finesse to that process because the acts he records are better served by leaving things raw.

If anyone here seriously believes that SD's music would have been better served by that approach, I don't even know what to say. It wouldn't have. There wasn't even a band to record when Aja was produced. It was Becker and Fagen writing songs. They didn't have a band and they didn't tour and they didn't want to tour. To push that music out the choices they had were to record it the way they did or put a haphazard band together and record whatever happened.

Some music requires more production and some music doesn't. There isn't any right or wrong and we got great stuff from both of these techniques, IMO. I don't know why we have to dig in our heels over genres of music and actively dismiss anything that falls outside of what we've decided to limit ourselves to. I love the well-produced gems and I love the raw stuff too. I absolutely despise music that's overproduced, but high-fidelity in a recording in and of itself does not equal that.

 

[WG Plum]

I would probably find some enjoyment in Aja if it was even slightly less buffed. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I like their first four or so albums will enough (Any Major Dude is one of my favorite songs), and I just prefer their timbre, for lack of a better word. It's possible, however, that the jazz-lite/cocaine-yacht mannerisms of Aja and later SD would still miss me. I do agree that an Albini-produced SD album probably wouldn't work, but damn, I'd love to hear it tried.

 

[LBS-bass]

I would probably find some enjoyment in Aja if it was even slightly less buffed. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I like their first four or so albums will enough (Any Major Dude is one of my favorite songs), and I just prefer their timbre, for lack of a better word. It's possible, however, that the jazz-lite/cocaine-yacht mannerisms of Aja and later SD would still miss me. I do agree that an Albini-produced SD album probably wouldn't work, but damn, I'd love to hear it tried.

One of my bands plays Any Major Dude.

For me, the difference between their earlier stuff and the Aja and beyond era is less emphasis on guitars and more emphasis on jazzy chords coming out of the keyboard. I have a lot of thoughts about this, actually, which mainly revolve around Becker's contributions and my belief that he was pivotal in keeping Fagen out of the smooth-jazz trap. I will concede that they came close to that at times, and crossed a line at times. I abhor "Hey Nineteen" for that reason, and if that's the only SD song you ever heard then I don't blame anyone for taking a pass.

Becker was dealing with substance abuse issues by this point and I think his contributions were more limited, which gave Don a bit of a free pass to veer toward that territory. It's clear and obvious in the solo work he did that did not involve Walter, versus the stuff he did that Walter produced.

The ironic thing is that Walter's own solo material is pretty awful. Both of those guys needed each other in order to quell their worst impulses.

 

[yodedude2]

thanks tb, now this popped (pooped?) up on my stream. did someone already post it? i checked out after p.1 ...

also, NSFW-vulgarity:

Donald Fagen Defends Steely Dan To Friends

"It's no Dire Straits, I'll give you that"

 

[HaphAsSard]

thaks tb, now this popped (pooped?) up on my stream. did someone already post it? i checked out after p.1 ...

also, NSFW-vulgarity:

Donald Fagen Defends Steely Dan To Friends