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Steve Bailey speaks on Warwick/Fender..

#41
Asomodai said:
Steve has opened a dialogue with the bass playing community because he started a thread.

I have asked him if he knows anything about past issues within the Warwick company and what his opinion is. I have no axe to grind, however people are so far having a go at me, when asking a valid question. I personally would love to buy Warwick, but from an ethical and moral point of view from what ex employees who are personal acquaintances have said, I couldn’t buy Warwick if these working practices are in place.

Asking Warwick this question directly would get no answer or a blanket "No", asking someone who knows Warwick intimately but does not "work" for them in a traditional sense, could get a more solid answer.
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Get real. You sniped him with a question that challenges his character. As if he has any way of knowing about the goings on at their German headquarters. Please do us all a favor and take this elsewhere.

I want to know more about this BASS. What do we know about the special neck profile?
 
#42
RCCollins said:
Get real. You sniped him with a question that challenges his character. As if he has any way of knowing about the goings on at their German headquarters. Please do us all a favor and take this elsewhere.
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In his post, he states "Warwick is a great “family company”"

So he must know whats going on in the German headquarters if he makes a blanket statement like that.

As I stated before.

"Steve is to a greater extent then any other Warwick owner, Representative of Warwick, so asking for an opinion on such things is valid."

And thats all I have to say on the matter.
 
#45
Ryan L. said:
Enough. If you have a problem with Warwick, take it elsewhere.
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I dont have a problem with Warwick personally, which is why I am asking Steve for an opinion, so I can base my own opinion. (Which is why I havent taken it elseware).

I have not personally accused Warwick of anything in this thread if you care to look through my posts.

Unless your saying "Personal concerns" are not allowed on Talkbass
 
#48
Asomodai said:
I dont have a problem with Warwick personally, which is why I am asking Steve for an opinion, so I can base my own opinion. (Which is why I havent taken it elseware).

I have not personally accused Warwick of anything in this thread if you care to look through my posts.
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No?


Asomodai said:
Would you care to comment on this then Steve?

(a totally uninformative post on the warwick forums)

I know personally of two former Warwick colleagues who told me of the ridiculousness that is the working practices at Warwick. Both told me of forced 11 hour work days and physical abuse from middle management. This was a fairly big issue on the German speaking instrument forums a fair while back. Warwick never denied the issues either.

Sorry for pointing it out, but the whole "Family" perception of Warwick somewhat irks me.

(Stern.de article "National President visits Warwick to investigate bad labor practice accusations")
(Financial News article "Warwick accused of slave labor")

Do you consider these things to be a thing of the past?
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:eyebrow:
 
#49
RCCollins said:
No?
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Two people told me of the working practices, that does not constitute as my "Opinion" or a "problem" with Warwick.

It irks me considering Warwick never denied it. For what its worth, I may be slightly biased as I have heard many negative opinions on Warwick, but then again you would be biased against them too if told enough about it, which is human. I wouldnt call "being irked" at a company, an attack.

I am asking Steve Bailey if he knew of these accusations, and if he knows if this is a thing of the past.

Your grasping at straws here mate. Go talk about the bass, which is what you want to do.
 
#50
Steve (fretlesssurfer),

I always appreciate a pro taking the time to participate here on TalkBass...Thank you so much for your input.

By the way, do you think that Jonas Hellborg would ever join us over here on TB?
 
#55
Asomodai said:
Two people told me of the working practices, that does not constitute as my "Opinion" or a "problem" with Warwick.

It irks me considering Warwick never denied it. For what its worth, I may be slightly biased as I have heard many negative opinions on Warwick, but then again you would be biased against them too if told enough about it, which is human. I wouldnt call "being irked" at a company, an attack.

I am asking Steve Bailey if he knew of these accusations, and if he knows if this is a thing of the past.

Your grasping at straws here mate. Go talk about the bass, which is what you want to do.
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Well it can't be as bad as working for an American company. Working in frickin Bangladesh isn't as bad as working here. Here you not only get yelled at by middle management and forced to work 11 hour days, but you get a free slot in the unemployment line at the end of it (after you've helped make some middle or upper management creep rich with your 11 hour days). At least in Germany they don't throw you away at the earliest, cheapest opportunity in some foreign country (at least I don't think they do) like they do here.

Warwick probably hasn't responded to the accusations because they're probably just BS started on some bulletin board somewhere and not really based on anything. That's likely why you don't find a lot of musical instrument company CEO's hanging out on lists and forums; they've got better things to do based on better sources of information.

As for SB, I think his leaving Fender and going to Warwick is great. His reasoning sounds spot-on to me and I bet the bass is going to be superb. We can "armchair" this all we want, but until we become endorsing artists of SB level, it's only going to be armchair judgment and that's all..

LS
 
#56
unclejane said:
Well it can't be as bad as working for an American company. Working in frickin Bangladesh isn't as bad as working here. Here you not only get yelled at by middle management and forced to work 11 hour days, but you get a free slot in the unemployment line at the end of it (after you've helped make some middle or upper management creep rich with your 11 hour days). At least in Germany they don't throw you away at the earliest, cheapest opportunity in some foreign country (at least I don't think they do) like they do here.

Warwick probably hasn't responded to the accusations because they're probably just BS started on some bulletin board somewhere and not really based on anything. That's likely why you don't find a lot of musical instrument company CEO's hanging out on lists and forums; they've got better things to do based on better sources of information.

As for SB, I think his leaving Fender and going to Warwick is great. His reasoning sounds spot-on to me and I bet the bass is going to be superb. We can "armchair" this all we want, but until we become endorsing artists of SB level, it's only going to be armchair judgment and that's all..

LS
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Considering Warwick sell cheaper chinese versions of their instruments, it's possible at somepoint in their past they let go some of their staff in Germany, to free up money for the chinese operation. I am sure the majority of companies in many industries would outsource to cheap labour if they thought they could get away with it.

True, if the accusations were confined to forums, then I wouldnt expect Warwick to defend themselves. However these accusations were published on respected news websites and possibly even print media.
 
#57
FWIW, I think Asomodai's question is totally valid, and I didn't take it as something that Steve, the OP, should or would be offended by. Steve isn't obligated to answer, but maybe he has some insight. Asomodai could have posed the question in a less challenging manner, but that doesn't make the question itself inappropriate.
 
#58
Asomodai said:
Considering Warwick sell cheaper chinese versions of their instruments, it's possible at somepoint in their past they let go some of their staff in Germany, to free up money for the chinese operation. I am sure the majority of companies in many industries would outsource to cheap labour if they thought they could get away with it.
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The general rule of thumb (so to speak ;)) in the US is the larger the company, the less concern it has about the origin (or quality) of its labor force and the less bound it is to obey labor laws, etc. When they get really really big, cheap is priority #1, educated and skilled is about priority #34,200 and American citizen living in America, well, that's pretty much priority #0.

So SB's comments about his relationship with Fender vs. the relationship to Warwick certainly stand to reason. Warwick is a 1000lb gorilla and Fender is an 866,999,666,999,000 ton machine. Well, turns out an 866,999,666,999,000 ton machine doesn't care much at all who or what it may grind up under its caterpillar tracks, but even a 1000lb gorilla still cares about and pays attention to his 800lb gorilla girlfriend, his other 700lb gorilla girlfriend and even his little 200lb gorilla kids.

True, if the accusations were confined to forums, then I wouldnt expect Warwick to defend themselves. However these accusations were published on respected news websites and possibly even print media.
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Like I said, their preference is surely going to be to go through other channels when it comes to accusations, particularly ones as grave as worker exploitation. I mean, if I were a CEO or other muckety-muck in some company, an online forum like TB would be the _last_ place I'd want to hash out some kind of personnel issue. So they may indeed be addressing whatever the grievance is, but certainly they're going to try to keep it as quiet as possible.

LS
 
#59
Asomodai said:
Steve has opened a dialogue with the bass playing community because he started a thread. So he is to expect replies and questions. He states Warwick as a family company, so he must know something about the working practices of Warwick if he makes a comment like that.

I have asked him if he knows anything about past issues within the Warwick company and what his opinion is. I have no axe to grind, however people are so far having a go at me, when asking a valid question. I personally would love to buy Warwick, but from an ethical and moral point of view from what ex employees who are personal acquaintances have said, I couldn’t buy Warwick if these working practices are in place.

Asking Warwick this question directly would get no answer or a blanket "No", asking someone who knows Warwick intimately but does not "work" for them in a traditional sense, could get a more solid answer.
Click to expand...
how the hell is steve supposed to know anything about that? how do you know that the employees in question weren't just irritating weasels who sucked at their jobs? you're totally taking sides here, and putting steve in the middle of something he knows nothing about or has no responsibility for like he's done something wrong. bet you never hammered p-nut or bootsy like this.
 

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