Struggling to find a high F string that works

[jzucker]

Currently playing an Ibanez SR506, six-string bass with the low end bart pickups/preamp. Tuning E-F tuning...

I use a set of EXL-170 6 string bass strings (.123 - .032) but I throw out the Low B string and then add a high F string. So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.

The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings. I guess if I had a pickup with adjustable pole pieces the problem might be solveable. I suppose I can try angling the pickups but I was wondering what others do...

 

[jzucker]

i switched back to the plain string. I'd rather have it be too loud, at least I can control that through how hard I strike the string...

 

[michael_t]

So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.

The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings.

Which .022 wound have you tried?

 

[jzucker]

Which .022 wound have you tried?

d'addario nickel plated, actually a guitar string.

 

[jzucker]

this is the exact wound string.

https://www.amazon.com/DAddario-NW022-Nickel-Electric-Guitar/dp/B000EENG9E

I've also had a similar experience on guitar where I tried to use one of these as a G string on a guitar. Apparently, there is not enough magnetic material to get good output on the daddario .021 or .022 wound strings, regardless of guitar or bass...

 

[michael_t]

d'addario nickel plated, actually a guitar string.

I suggested the GHS Boomer .020w in another thread of yours. It's hard to say at this point if it's going to solve your problem, but at least it's designed as a bass string.

Link Removed

 

[jzucker]

I suggested the GHS Boomer .020w in another thread of yours. It's hard to say at this point if it's going to solve your problem, but at least it's designed as a bass string.

Link Removed

OK but I don't think it matters if a string is designed as a bass string or not. The fact that I tried the same brand and guage .022w daddario on my guitar a few months back and it also had very low output tells me it's not specific to bass or guitar. I will try that GHS string though.

 

[jzucker]

by the way, for anyone who wants to experiment with guitar strings for their high C and F strings on bass, these ferrules work great in a bass bridge...

https://www.amazon.com/Golden-Age-Flush-Fit-Guitar-Ferrules/dp/B01NALAH6G

 

[jzucker]

ok, i ordered some of the GHS strings to try

 

[HaphAsSard]

Currently playing an Ibanez SR506, six-string bass with the low end bart pickups/preamp. Tuning E-F tuning...

I use a set of EXL-170 6 string bass strings (.123 - .032) but I throw out the Low B string and then add a high F string. So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.

The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings. I guess if I had a pickup with adjustable pole pieces the problem might be solveable. I suppose I can try angling the pickups but I was wondering what others do...

Output is probably a complex function of contrasting factors: a higher magnetically-active mass (likely to be unequal between core and winding material, just to complicate things) should increase it, but it translates to decreased motion inside the magnetic field; conversely, less mass should on paper present to the pickup less to work with, but its resulting lower tension lets it move more (string attack being equal). I'm not sure which trumps which. Even the data you've gathered is inconclusive, regarding whether mass matters more than width of motion: the two plains shouldn't be *both* 25% louder the C, but if they are, the two factors (more meat less swing, and vice versa) appear to compensate each other; the wound 022 should have about the same mass as the 020p, and be more flexible than the latter, but its winding apparently performs less well than the inherently all-steel plain.
You could try a single GHS .022", either a Progressive or a White Bronze:
Singles - Progressives
Singles - White Bronze
The winding for both is in Alloy 52 and should be louder than the NPS in the D'Addario XL. The White Bronzes also come in 020.

 

[jzucker]

Output is probably a complex function of contrasting factors: a higher magnetically-active mass (likely to be unequal between core and winding material, just to complicate things) should increase it, but it translates to decreased motion inside the magnetic field; conversely, less mass should on paper present to the pickup less to work with, but its resulting lower tension lets it move more (string attack being equal). I'm not sure which trumps which. Even the data you've gathered is inconclusive, regarding whether mass matters more than width of motion: the two plains shouldn't be *both* 25% louder the C, but if they are, the two factors (more meat less swing, and vice versa) appear to compensate each other; the 022 should have about the same mass as the 020p, and be more flexible than the latter, but its winding apparently performs less well than the inherently all-steel plain.
You could try a single GHS .022", either a Progressive or a White Bronze:
Singles - Progressives
Singles - White Bronze
The winding for both is in Alloy 52 and should be louder than the NPS in the D'Addario XL. The White Bronzes also come in 020.

how do you think the tone will be integrated into the NPS set i'm currently using?

 

[HaphAsSard]

how do you think the tone will be integrated into the NPS set i'm currently using?

I've no direct experience with Alloy 52. According to what I seem to remember from having read about it, perhaps a touch less zingy when new, yet less broken in, more lively later? I dunno. Personally, I tend to accept that strings across a set sound different.
(...To a point: I can't deny I've frequently found myself cussing at a poorly integrated, overly dead low E....)

 

[jzucker]

I've no direct experience with Alloy 52. According to what I seem to remember from having read about it, perhaps a touch less zingy when new, yet less broken in, more lively later? I dunno. Personally, I tend to accept that strings across a set sound different.
(...To a point: I can't deny I've frequently found myself cussing at a poorly integrated, overly dead low E....)

thanks, just ordered some of these...

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Currently playing an Ibanez SR506, six-string bass with the low end bart pickups/preamp. Tuning E-F tuning...

I use a set of EXL-170 6 string bass strings (.123 - .032) but I throw out the Low B string and then add a high F string. So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.

The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings. I guess if I had a pickup with adjustable pole pieces the problem might be solveable. I suppose I can try angling the pickups but I was wondering what others do...

Found this one

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Currently playing an Ibanez SR506, six-string bass with the low end bart pickups/preamp. Tuning E-F tuning...

I use a set of EXL-170 6 string bass strings (.123 - .032) but I throw out the Low B string and then add a high F string. So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.

The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings. I guess if I had a pickup with adjustable pole pieces the problem might be solveable. I suppose I can try angling the pickups but I was wondering what others do...

But, this guy says .016 - .020 is good for F.

 

[jzucker]

the .020p sounds great, not strange at all. It's just too loud. I like the sound of the d'addario nickel wound a little better but the volume difference it a dealbreaker.

 

[2F/2F]

I would first lower the wound F string as low as it will go while remaining playable, and also tilt that side of the pickup up a hair or two.

Then, I would slowly move the other strings upward to further balance them with the F.

You will need to adjust to higher action, but that is not a deal killer of an issue, and it is likely to make your bass sound even better over all, once you get used to it.

 

[jzucker]

I would first lower the wound F string as low as it will go, and also tilt that side of the pickup up a hair or two.

Then, I would slowly move the other strings upward to further balance them with the F.

You will need to adjust to higher action, but that is not an issue, and it is likely to make your bass sound even better over all, once you get used to it.

it's already pretty low. About 2.5mm at the 12th fret. Don't want to go any lower. I'm not going to raise the action on the other strings. I do a lot of solo playing and the low E is about 3mm at the 12th fret. The rest of the strings graduate slightly lower toward the higher string. Tilting the pickup is going to have the adverse affect of raising the volume of the D G & C strings so that won't really work. The only thing that would work pickup-wise would be something with adjustable pole pieces...

 

[JES]

Try a thinner plain steel. You will get a bit less output.

 

[ixlramp]

So far I've tried .020 to .022 plain and recently tried a .022 wound.
The issue is that with the plain strings, the high string is about 25% louder than the other strings and with the wound .022 it's about 25% quieter than the other strings.

I have used very thin strings, including plain steels, on my bass guitars for many years. I also found plain steels rather harsh and loud at first. My solution for F was to use a smaller gauge like .016p (next to a .025w C), less mass reduces volume and the lower tension mellows the tone for a better tonal blend with the wounds (as well as being more playable).
The fact is .020p and .022p are heavy and high tension strings for F, and a solid rod of metal that thick is very stiff and therefore quite inharmonic.
Some high Fs are .018p which is a far better gauge choice, more flexible and far better tone.
I have found that a step-down in tension from wound to plain seems to help.
I suggest trying several plain steel strings in smaller gauges, starting with a .018p.

I suppose I can try angling the pickups

I recommend trying that if you use a wound F, i always have to do this myself.
The quietness of a wound F is just the continuation of the inevitable decrease in volume across the wound strings, so tilting pickups is logical.

But, this guy says .016 - .020 is good for F.

'This guy' seems to be me =)