• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Subtle or over the top?

#62
El Beardo said:
I don't think "supporting the song" and "being subtle" have to be the same, it just depends on the situation. I've never felt limited and actually enjoyed writing a bass line that is from my heart and supports the song in some way(no, not just the guitard)
On the other hand if I'm writing a bass line by myself there is nothing to add to so it's a different story and I just play whatever comes out. I use the same theory when using effects, playing styles, etc. If it's from my heart, sounds good and helps the song(which of course is subjective) then I'm happy.
Click to expand...

No, not the same, of course, but I'm talking about more than supporting music, sounding good, and playing from the heart, I'm talking about making music all on your own (I suppose you might say "like a guitar player would"), as part of a song or as the meat of the song or as the song, anything goes. Anyways though, I've heard people make the argument that subtlety is key in a supportive role, I'm just saying there's a much bigger picture than that. I suppose I could even make the argument that bass "supports the song" better if you can actually recognize the song from just the bass, but I won't bother.

But to expand on my ideas, it's common to hear something about expressive bass playing like, "that sounds like a guitar". Never mind that I'm playing outside of the range of a guitar and down into the bass range. Never mind my chords are voiced for bass and sound drastically different than a guitar would, with more thickness and different connotations, painting pictures you couldn't as effectively paint with a guitar. People think it sounds like a guitar if it simply sounds like something on it's own, or steps outside of the boundaries of simply supportive. Even sometimes when the bass is actually playing something musical in it's own right, there's strict ideas that it must sound "like a bass", whatever that means. How can sounds made with a bass really sound like anything other than a bass? Just because it's not what you're used to within some narrow boundaries defining "bass" doesn't mean it's anything other than a bass. Anyways, that's enough ranting for today.
 
#63
I've long given up worrying about what other people think about what I do. I do some experimental stuff on my own, and if people want to comment that it doesn't fit in with what a bass should sound like, they can eat me.
 
#67
Mark Olson said:
Hahaha yeah! If you set up that myspace let me know! I'm always intrigued to hear another bass player's approach to music and expression and whatnot. It's inspiring for me when someone thinks of something I haven't thought of haha!
Click to expand...
If I inspire any other musicians to do things they might not have been able to do before, then I'm doing something wrong. In all honesty, this little project is, as Chris Rock says, "Keeping it real...real dumb."
 
#68
I see! But as much as I'd like to say what I have not thought of is limited, it is definitely limitless. You never know! I find a lot of value in a lot of recordings, if not what I'd like to achieve on my own, what I don't want to do! All I can really do is listen, and learn. Whatever the lesson may be.
 
#69
I don't use many effects. But, since no one has mentioned compression,,

For compression, very subtle. 90% of the time the bass doesn't go through the P.A. Before sound check, I try to get a decent sound for the room with eq. Then I walk onto the floor, hit notes all over the neck, slide around, etc, and invariably some notes sound louder than others there than they do while standing in front of the amp. So I use the (dual-band) compressor to help even them out. That's where your comment "If you notice them, they're too much" comment applies. If I notice the compressor kicking in, it's too much.
 
#70
donstrenz said:
I don't use many effects. But, since no one has mentioned compression,,

For compression, very subtle. 90% of the time the bass doesn't go through the P.A. Before sound check, I try to get a decent sound for the room with eq. Then I walk onto the floor, hit notes all over the neck, slide around, etc, and invariably some notes sound louder than others there than they do while standing in front of the amp. So I use the (dual-band) compressor to help even them out. That's where your comment "If you notice them, they're too much" comment applies. If I notice the compressor kicking in, it's too much.
Click to expand...
From my opening post:

"As most of my gigs are oldies gigs, naturally I'm not using a Nocto Loco or anything, but when I kick them on, I want people to know they're on, with the exception of compression, which I quit using a year ago."

So I did mention compression, but since I agree 100% with you, I figured it didn't apply to this thread. But it is worth noting.
 
#71
Nyarlathotep said:
[rant]

You know. I hate the whole "support the song" argument/reasoning. It seems redundant and just a cop out if it sucks. Personally I just CREATE music.

Do I support what I create? Of course. If I didn't I wouldn't create it in the first place :p If it sucks, it sucks. Im not gonna put the responsibility for why it sucks totally on the song. Which is basically what you can do with that phrase. "That song sucks" -> "well, I was just SUPPORTING the song, so its not my fault"

Its kindof like saying that you cannot control a fear. Most people who say that just don't seem to want to take responsibility or control of their lives.

[/rant]

Anyways. I do sortof agree tho. Most people wouldn't use a boost->higainfuzz type setup if they want to create a love song. Well, I might, but most likely not.....
Click to expand...

+1. Plus, the song doesn't exist independently of the parts that go into it. You're not supporting anything, you're part of something.
 
#74
Nyarlathotep said:
[rant]

You know. I hate the whole "support the song" argument/reasoning. It seems redundant and just a cop out if it sucks. Personally I just CREATE music.

Do I support what I create? Of course. If I didn't I wouldn't create it in the first place :p If it sucks, it sucks. Im not gonna put the responsibility for why it sucks totally on the song. Which is basically what you can do with that phrase. "That song sucks" -> "well, I was just SUPPORTING the song, so its not my fault"

Its kindof like saying that you cannot control a fear. Most people who say that just don't seem to want to take responsibility or control of their lives.

[/rant]

Anyways. I do sortof agree tho. Most people wouldn't use a boost->higainfuzz type setup if they want to create a love song. Well, I might, but most likely not.....
Click to expand...

You would HAVE to think differently if you were actually playing with a band.
 
#76
RCCollins said:
You would HAVE to think differently if you were actually playing with a band.
Click to expand...

Right on! And might I add that playing with a time signature can also be handy for getting your point across. Not that I don't dig or haven't played free jazz, but yeah, a time signature can help. :D

But really, in all my years playing music, many of which as a professional musican, I've heard the "That song sucks" -> "well, I was just SUPPORTING the song, so its not my fault" argument absolutely zero times. No matter how terrible the song was.
 
#79
Subtle for me...but that doesn't mean Imperceptible...to me it means Sharpening things up a bit without having the effects take over...

I also think the "subtle Vs. over the top" effects argument is really about the style of music you are playing, and having the common sense to know your place in the song...
 
#80
It all depends on the style and what kind of gig I'm playing.

If I'm supporting a singer/songwriter, I'll sometimes kick in some subtle overdrive if it fits the song, and I always make sure I keep the bottom end intact as much as possible.

When I'm playing in my own band (alternative rock/experimental), pretty much anything goes. I can be more upfront with my tonal choices.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back