Subway 215 vs. Subway 212, sonic differences ?

[Parzival]

I ran 12s for a very long time, last rig with a pair of GK neo 212s. Can confirm a single 212 will be sufficient for a one cab solution. When I jumped to Mesa I went with the 215. My reasoning was not tone, it was the 215 will move a smidge more air than the 212 "just in case".

Do not regret that move, and would also point out the 215 has built in tilt back casters and handle that make it super easy to move. You wont go wrong either way though.

The 215 is great. A plus is folks always think I’m working way harder than I am lugging it around. I’ll be lifting the cab on or off the stage before or after a gig and folks will run up and say, “oh my gosh, let us help you!”. I just say nah, I got it and easily move it around. They think I’m Superman.

 

[Laklandfan]

Yes, that's kinda what I'm saying.

Here's how I think of it...the 12 is more old school, rounder sounding. It's a P-bass.

The 15 is more modern..clearer and punches you in the gut...rattles your pants more. It's a Dingwall.

Can confirm Dingwalls sound great through the 15. I’ve let bass players sit in and they were shocked that a 15 was clear and punchy, they liked it even though they were “10s guys”. Fun fact, p-bass also sounds good.

 

[AB Nate]

212- More in the low mids, thicker overall.

215- Deeper, clearer, more articulate, can get louder, more snappy.

.

this is my experience also.

I’ve had a few of these cabs at overlapping times including 2-115,1- 215, 2-210s and have have kept the 212,210and 112.

The 215s are beast. As described above. Never was into 15s until subway came along.

for my wants I kept the 212 over it as it has that quicker low mid punch.

With the WD800 and some darkglass and Dingwall’s, clarity and articulation are a non issue.

I don’t/didn't need big sound. Thick
, punchy and clear yes, BIG not really. Can I do BIG with the 212? Heck yeah.
I actually pair it with the 210 as my favourite combo for now.


I know it’s an old thread and I’m a bit late to the party…..

 

[Nodak Savage]

I have both. The 2x12 is easier to transport, takes up slightly less stage space, can get loud, and is very articulate.
Two 1x15's (which is what I have) are easy to transport, can get louder, can get lower (in frequency), and it very articulate.

If my wife held a gun to my head (again) and made me choose - I would stick with the 15's. But I love the 2x12. (I know, not very helpful). I have to agree with mmbongo - you can make the 15's sound like the 12's, but the 2x12 will not do what two 15's will do.

Curious how one would make the 215 sound like the 212. Just cut some bass or run the HPF on the d-800+ higher? I have the 215 currently and use to run a 115 - 210 stack. I honestly wish I never got the 215 and kept what I had. It's too dark and feel like my tone is completely buried at times.

 

[agedhorse]

Where are you running the tweeter on the 215?

What amp are you using and what settings?

What bass and strings?

 

[Nodak Savage]

Where are you running the tweeter on the 215?

What amp are you using and what settings?

What bass and strings?

D-800+, Schecter SLS with Fishman Fluence, Tech 21 DP-3X through front of the head. I turn my tweeter off, as I did with my previous cab due to the DUG pedal having a cab sim out of the XLR that applies a high cut and I want it balanced out on my end compared to FOH. I’m thinking my main issue might be I just have too much boom with the two 15” and maybe need to cut bass or crank the HPF. I usually keep my HPF on the head at 11 o’clock.

 

[agedhorse]

Now, what you have going on is that without the tweeter turned up you have essentially 2 high cut filters happening. Either disable the cab sim on the pedal or turn the tweeter up to where it's balanced. The Cab Sim assumes extended high frequency range of the speaker, that's the whole point of this feature.

The Subway 215 is NOT a dark cabinet by any stretch.

 

[Nodak Savage]

Now, what you have going on is that without the tweeter turned up you have essentially 2 high cut filters happening. Either disable the cab sim on the pedal or turn the tweeter up to where it's balanced. The Cab Sim assumes extended high frequency range of the speaker, that's the whole point of this feature.

The Subway 215 is NOT a dark cabinet by any stretch.

I understand what you’re saying. My cab isn’t getting the high cut from the pedal though as it’s only applied out of the XLR to the FOH. I’m 1/4” into the front of the head and the pedal doesn’t apply that filter on the 1/4 out. I believe the reason why the pedal was designed this way was because Dugs cabs do not have tweeters and he wanted FOH to get the same sound he was getting through his cab. That’s why I turned it off so it would be equally balanced to what’s coming back through the monitor. Maybe I overthought that whole concept.

I don’t want to get sidetracked on the whole pedal thing, all I know is I run everything the same as I did with my 210 115 stack and seems once i deleted the 210 and started using the 215 I have to crank more volume to hear myself. I honestly thought I’d have to do the opposite. Which brings me to think maybe I just have too much sub Sonic lows now.

Always appreciate when you chime in.

 

[agedhorse]

Try this with the tweeter set to the 12:00 position as a start. Then, maybe roll off just a little of the bottom end.

 

[rodl2005]

I own both the SW212 and SW215. The difference in size is minor enough I'd recommend just going with the driver size you want. If it makes any difference, the SW215 is the one I use for gigs 100% of the time. Built in casters make it much easier to move than the SW212, and I have yet to think "Gee, if this cab was just a bit shorter......" when setting up.

I own both the SW212 and SW115. If I wanted a one cab can do it all between the two, I would go with the SW212. The SW 12"s may be voiced a bit punchier than the 15"s, but I cant imagine anything other than a s*** eatin grin when you hear either cab for the first time. You will, DEFINITELY, find all the usable tone you need in either option.

The built in casters and handle would be a major factor in grabbing the 215 for me. That's just ridiculously handy imo.

 

[rodl2005]

Where are you running the tweeter on the 215?

What amp are you using and what settings?

What bass and strings?

And also, especially as it's a small in height/size, if you're standing close to it, a lot of the sound might be blowing past yr knees. They can also sound more bassy this way too

Can make a good difference either pointing it at yr ears or raising it up to said level

 

[PolkaHero]

Just played my first gig with the 212 after using the 215 for several years. Definitely not as much thunderous bottom end but it's still a formidable cabinet. I stacked my Bergantino CN212 on top of the Mesa so I was probably hearing more of the Berg cab than the Mesa 210 I stack on top of the 215. The Berg tweeter can get really annoying, had to turn it completely off.

 

[Nodak Savage]

Try this with the tweeter set to the 12:00 position as a start. Then, maybe roll off just a little of the bottom end.

Thank you @agedhorse I'm going to give that a shot tomorrow night. Playing a room that typical gives me more issues than any other I typically play.

 

[HowieD72]

Thread revival!

Incoming 215. Why? Because of the thunderous bottom end, and I'm getting an amazing deal on one, and..... because I love my Genz-Benz heads and Andy is with Mesa. So, i couldn't ask for a better combo IMO.

Sonic difference, i don't know, I've never tried the 212. But i know with the 215, I get fresh air included. Why? Because I don't have AC in my practice space of 3m x 3m so I need the windows and roof to open by themselves

 

[Al Kraft]

Just played my first gig with the 212 after using the 215 for several years. Definitely not as much thunderous bottom end but it's still a formidable cabinet. I stacked my Bergantino CN212 on top of the Mesa so I was probably hearing more of the Berg cab than the Mesa 210 I stack on top of the 215. The Berg tweeter can get really annoying, had to turn it completely off.

I have a CN212 and while it is a great cab for heads like the Walkabout or Tone Hammer that could use some bottom end taming from a cab, it is nothing like even a single SW115 in terms of large natural low end IME. I'm not surprised at what you experienced as I would have expected the Mesa SW cab combo to be a more complementary pairing.