swr workingman 15 combo with horn speaker wiring question

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by mattera51, Mar 1, 2019.

  1. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    hello!

    I've had this box sitting in my basement for a while. got it used just to have next to the drum set..

    recently began using it and the horn is snapping, there are no highs and the low end is not tight at all.

    I pulled it apart and noticed that the person I bought it from had done some really terrible wiring work on it internally.

    I can't find a speaker wiring diagram for this combo anywhere online. just the schematics which are useless to me.

    Anyone here know if there's a certain way to wire the horn into the speaker?

    I can't tell if the horn needs replacement or if it's wired incorrectly..

    all help appreciated!

    Photos of the wiring would be great!
     

    Attached Files:

  2. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Inactive

    The schematic should be all you need to wire up the speaker system.
     
    Jeff Scott likes this.
  3. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    normally that might be true but I have no idea how to read it.
     
  4. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Inactive

    Can you post it here so we can walk you through it?

    Or better yet take both to a tech and get him to do it. Shouldn’t cost too much.
     
  5. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    I appreciate it!

    here is the schematic (photo attached) I found for it. I don't know if this is the board?

    If it includes the woofer and tweeter then I'm lost.

    I'm not doing the wiring in the amp. just the speakers.

    1x15 & horn.

    when I pulled it apart (photo's attached) it looked wrong. the thick black wire wasnt even connected to anything.

    So i pulled the horn out, ordered a new one and reatatchd the woofer for now. sounds decent.

    it's working fine but when the new horn arrives I don't know if I just attach the positive and negative or if the positive and negative need to be connected together.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    I found this on Fender's site.

    Should help figure out which wires go where.

    obviously, pos & neg to the woofer.

    the horn wire goes to pos on the horn, then the neg goes to the woofer but pos or neg.

    then do the woofer pos & neg get connected to each other for full range?

    horn has Screen Shot 2019-03-04 at 1.00.03 PM.png Screen Shot 2019-03-04 at 12.59.48 PM.png
     
  7. Soporific

    Soporific

    Jan 4, 2009
    Irvine, CA
    I've disassembled my Workingman 15 and found the horn appears to only have one wire connected to it. The black is connected to the 15" and the horn. The 15" has a white wire as well and then there is a green wire that is connecting to nothing. The black is connected to the positive labeled tangs on both speakers.

    I don't believe the horn has ever been connected and I've never had a problem switching between modes on the horn - at least the tone gets more defined with horn switched on anyway. It doesn't make sense to me only having one wire connected and as I tried to connect the green wire it was tighter than a snare drum, removing and reinserting the horn wire was just as tight. i.e., it didn't just fall off from what I can tell.

    The reason for disassembly is that I'm trying to put in a 1/4" (6.5mm) speaker jack/plug instead of the TT / Bantam (4.4mm) plug that is currently in place as I want to use it for a second cabinet for a guitar amp and finding an adapter seems to be an exercise in futility.

    Here's what the wiring looks like if anyone has any input. Thanks.

    SWR-wiring.jpg SWR-tt-bantam-plug.jpg
     
  8. Soporific

    Soporific

    Jan 4, 2009
    Irvine, CA
    Plugged it back in and the horn was definitely not working. Not sure if it ever did I guess. I also noticed the green going through a crossover block or whatever they are technically called before going to the primary amp output jack...Fixed.
     
  9. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    hey man. I did something similar.

    I cut the top off and cut a hole in the back and just use it as a 115 cab.

    disconnected the horn altogether..

    0FE8B3B9-EC9E-4F16-A34C-4D8BF0420EEA.jpeg C2835319-81C8-43E8-B773-ECAEEDDEAD4D.jpeg
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
    Soporific likes this.
  10. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
    The green wire connects to the tweeter positive terminal. I'm sure somebody thought that what they did was a good idea and "fixed it" by removing the wire, and I use the term fixed as in the example below... :banghead:

    Wow, I guess this is how speakers get fixed when you don't understand how they are supposed to work in the first place??? :eek:
     
    Jeff Scott likes this.
  11. Soporific

    Soporific

    Jan 4, 2009
    Irvine, CA
    I have both options now.

    I wired a speaker cable directly to the 15" and also reconnected the horn. I was able to run both cables through the original hole with some finesse.

    Now I'm interested to see what the horn sounds like when using it as a bass amp and also as a straight (no horn) cabinet paired with the JVM-410C (2x12 100W combo) I have. I'm hoping on my 7 string when the JVM is turned up the speakers stop hitting their extrusion limits and for the 15" to fill in the bottom and move some more air. Off to the warehouse for testing!

    SWR-dual-wire.jpg
     
  12. Soporific

    Soporific

    Jan 4, 2009
    Irvine, CA
    The black wire was still connected to the positive terminal on the horn so I connected the green to the negative figuring the green was just pulled by the original owner. It seems to be registering 16 ohms vs. 8 specified in the manual but the meter I have here is kind of dodgy. It's an easy swap though.

    I'm assuming it will just be out of phase if wired in reverse?

    Thanks!
     
  13. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
    It could be a 16 ohm tweeter.

    It could be that the tweeter connections are reversed, either intentionally or accidentally.

    Be sure the crossover is part of the tweeter circuit or you will destroy your tweeter.
     
  14. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    I'm sorry, are you referring to me not understanding how these work?

    To be clear, the transistors in the head were burnt so I cut the top off, firmed up all the joints and did a great job turning it into a stand-alone 115..

    It sounds fantastic..

     
  15. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
    Why not have the amp fixed? Then you would have had a full combo...
     
  16. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    cost.

    $7.50 for the jackplate & about an hour of work compared to $175 minimum here in NY to diagnose the problem. then more $$ to fix it.

    Also don't like combos. This was left at my house years ago.
     
  17. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
    Too bad you have techs that don't understand how the service business works...

    $175 minimum just to diagnose a service issue and give an estimate is absurd. You don't have an amp problem, you have a service shop problem. Here is my area you could have gotten it fixed for less than that, and fixed right. Wow.
     
  18. mattera51

    mattera51

    Mar 1, 2019
    NY
    Everything is more expensive in NY...
     
  19. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
    I suppose, but that's kind of ridiculous. Then again, parking your car is kind of ridiculous too...
     
  20. If you are not comfortable troubleshooting the electronic problem then I strongly suggest that you take the amp to a qualified technician who does. Then confronted the numbskull who sold it to you like this.
     
    agedhorse likes this.