SWR's declining popularity

I think the "quality sound in smaller and lighter packages" development has a lot to do with this, and it prompted me to attempt to sell my Goliath III a few months ago. I love the sound, but dislike the weight. Alas, with the declining popularity, I didn't get a single inquiry. I had intended to switch over completely to G-K Neo cabs (I have a Neo112 for rehearsals and small gigs) for easier portability (and the killer sound of 12's), but I'm not sure I'll take the plunge if I can't sell the Goliath.

I've been waiting for SWR to join the others with an innovative, lightweight line of cabs, but they don't seem to be in any hurry.

 

I agree with your observations as a whole. It appears SWR is going after the higher volume entry level market leveraging thier name and reputation. I can't disagree with thier expanded market direction and objectives, BUT it would be cool to see more refined advances on the pro level.

I doubt they will change anything though, why screw up a good thing. Witness all the big name chains and musician's catalogs that feature SWR gear. Ride that pony to the bank, hopefully and Steve Rabe got a good deal on the back end for future %.

 

I disagree.

SWR seems to be doing fine. Their gears flys out of mega-stores and mega-online-shops.

Your average forumite is not your average player.

Your average forumite is not playing a Fender. However, go see a local band, and 80% or more of the time you will see them holding some sort of Fender. More likely than not, they will also be playing through some non-boutique rig (Peavey, SWR, Eden, Hartke, etc.).

I still see more SWR Goliath cabinets than any other 4x10" cabinet, at least in my area.

 

I really think the Fender buyout was the final nail in the coffin for their declining popularity. I still think it's great sounding stuff, but sold my 900/GIII rig a couple of years ago when the neo stuff hit the market.

Also, their original lower line (the Workingman stuff) was not even in the same league (IMO) as, for example, the Eden Nemesis stuff. Finally, the new 'pro' products (750x) etc. seemed to be positioned directly against Ampeg and the 'rock' market versus their original 'hi fi' funk sort of marketing vibe. It's pretty hard to battle the Ampeg boys (and girls) on their home turf.... just my 2 cents

 

I think the first post hit the "nail on the head". 1] They have competition 2] Their competition nails the "SWR sound" better then SWR. 3] They have had almost no innovation 4] Their catering to the low end of the market has killed their high end resale 5] To some extent their "sound" (Hi-fi sizzle) has fallen out of favor, definitely in the pop market (Where boomy is in) and in the R & B market (as vintage sounds become more of a force). Not to say some people still don't want that sound it's just not the "Holy Grail", or a "grail shaped beacon"!

As far as the workingman, the 12 was a cool amp initially, but the competition has caught up. The new low end stuff doesn't even compete well against low end competitors. Hartke, GK, Nemesis, and Crate all seem to make better value stuff. The good news is theirs some pro SWR stuff, sitting on shelves that you could probably get a good deal on!

 

Yep, all entry-level gear flies out of those stores, just like Peavey - not what SWR used to be . . . unfortunately.

I'm entertained by your thought that Eden isn't considered boutique gear . . . their heads sure are in my neck of the woods . . . just goes to show you how perceptions differ

 

I would think SWR's staple is selling the Goliath, Goliath Jr., and Son of a Bertha. They seem to be competively priced. Their heads are running into the same problem everyone else's are; a glut of feature-filled, powerful, cheap imports. $2,000 for an SM-900 or $300 for an Ashdown MAG-300?

Eden is pretty widely distributed; easy enough to buy it off of Musician's Friend. I see it less often than SWR and Ampeg stuff, but I wouldn't say that makes it boutique.

In addition to a SWR head on top of a Goliath, two very standard setups you see in my neck of the woods are a SWR SM-500 on top of an Eden 210XLT and an Eden WT-series on top of an SWR Goliath. The other rig I see a lot is the "Hartke Stack of Doom", the 3500 amp on top of a 4x10" and 1x15". I usually cringe (personal preference)

A lot of the backlines in Manhattan are SWR; a lot of Workingman 15 combos, SM-400 or SM-500 heads, lots of SWR Goliath IIIs that look like they have been run over by a train, and one Super Redhead that I have never seen in use at the C-Note on Avenue C.

 

In my scene, by far the most popular setup is SWR 2002/4004 head atop Workingman's 4x10 and 1x15 cabinets.

When I lived in Miami, a lot more people used Ampeg/Mesa gear. I guess people out here (Albuquerque) are cheap.

 

I think the reason they seem less popular is because there are more choices available however this perception would be from a TalkBass point of view. Many bassist that don't hang out on TalkBass don't know anything about Bergantino, Epifani, Schroeder, Avatar, etc.

 

Agreed, I'm also from Hoboken (11th & Garden) and the rehearsal studios we use are primarily Eden WT's and SWRs Goliaths in various combos. I see mostly Hartkes out gigging in NYC and Jersey Shore areas. I love my pre-Fender Super Redhead and find it very capable handling small-med sized rooms using my 4 strings but lately I've been favoring less sizzle & a more Ampegish sound.

 

I think Vision was originally pointing out that based on retail sales of the newer higher end units, and the very low resale value of the older stuff, that the sheen is a little off this brand... due to a number of reasons commented on above. That doesn't mean that there aren't a ton of 900's and GII's and III's still cranking out there!

 

Exactly. The vast majority of the world has never heard of that stuff because it's not sold in the vast majority of places.

 

Exactly! I've been waiting for someone to make this point as I was reading. TB is a wonderful thing for bassists and boutique manufacturers alike. Every time I buy a piece of used gear or meet another bassist I ask if they are a member of TB. So far I haven't come across anyone yet. And do you know what gear these people are using? GK, Fender, SWR, and Peavey. Had I come to TB a long time ago I would have saved my money for somehting like EBS or Bergantino instead of spending on a Goliath III - which is something I regret. TB offers a wealth on information that really isn't available anywhere else.

 

Valid point... except it still doesn't explain the very low and declining resale value out in the 'non TB general market'. Don't misinterpret my comments, I still like the stuff! But you sure don't see the new ones as backline out there much with the pro's any more, and the resale is very poor.

 

Low resale value for high-end gear does not just effect SWR.

I have seen Bergantino HT322 cabinets sell for $600 and less on eBay. You can find deals on Aguilar cabinets left and right on bassgear.com and ebay. People give away Ampeg cabinets on eBay (saw a SVT410HE go for $200). I have seen Ampeg SVT3-Pros go for under $300 on eBay. I recently purchased a beat-up Son of a Bertha for $150.

Part of this has been a surge in affordable alternatives at your local super-store; Behringer's 410 is $200 new, as is and Hartke's VX410. Buying new is now cheaper than buying used, and since a lot of people who buy used are beginners, some of them would rather have something new than something used.