SX Stingray

[SnakeAnthony]

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Please tell me thats photoshopped . I don't think I could live with two companies putting out those ugly POS (sorry if I'm offending Bongo lovers, I just cant stand them). :scowl:

Edit: I think I'm gonna be stoned by EBMM lovers on this post. First my before hand post, now I'm insulting the Bongo. Haha. I'm sorry guys. They just aren't for me.

 

[IotaNet]

The Basslines MM system won't fit this bass (the 5 string - the 4 may be different) ... the pole pieces are way too off so you'd result in poor sound, uneven levels, etc ...

If that's the case, then the pup replacement for the purist will be the Nordstrand 5.2. They make a MM replacement specifically for narrow-spaced situations like this. I think it costs $139

 

[Minger]

Btw, when did Rondo move their warehouse to New Hampshire??

April.

 

[patrickj]

I take it back. The SD Basslines 5 pickup does work. The pole pieces aren't perfectly aligned, but each string is covered and there's negligible sound and volume/level issues.

You do have to shave down the inside of the pickguard still because the original SX pickup has 'ears', but after that it's a drop in replacement.

 

[IotaNet]

I take it back. The SD Basslines 5 pickup does work. The pole pieces aren't perfectly aligned, but each string is covered and there's negligible sound and volume/level issues.

You do have to shave down the inside of the pickguard still because the original SX pickup has 'ears', but after that it's a drop in replacement.

I hate to sound like a broken record on this but Nordstrand offers an excellent solution here.

They make several different flavors of MM pickups ... with ears or without ears, wide string spacing or narrow string spacing. There ought to be one that would be a direct "drop in" for the SX bass.

 

[jondog]

I just ordered mine today, my roomate has a real mm 5 in ash/maple so I'll be able to do a side by side comparison.

I'm a big SX fan but I live near rondo so I've always been able to handpick the best playing bass. Now w/ the warehouse move to NH I have to trust the return policy . . .

 

[WesC]

I gotta say--its only my opinion, ok?--but that really doesn't sound very Stingray-like to me. And the B-string is pretty indistinct and muddy. Not a terribly bad-sounding bass for the money, but I don't think EB has anything to worry about. I wouldn't play one.

Anyway, glad you like it.

First off, it's not a Stingray replacement or a clone. MM owners rejoice.
But it's a really damn good instrument for $180ish. And if you really want the Stingray sound and are cheap or poor, this will give it to you.

--snip--

30 seconds of noodling around. Haven't given it any sort of setup yet other than tuning. Bypass mode on my POD and everything is flat.

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[Smallequestrian]

Ok, for all of you arguing about this. Take something into consideration. EB doesn't care as much as many of you think they do about their product. Neither does Fender. Large corperations their size don't need good products, they just need to make money. If they think that they would make money off cheap POS basses, then thats exactly what they would put out. The thing is, they make their money by putting out decent quality basses (I'm not gonna say great quality basses. EBMM products probably have the best QC of any mainstream large scale production bass, but that doesn't make them outstanding. I have seen my fair share of issues.)

Leo Fender did care when he designed his Fender, Music Man, and G&L products, and each time he sold each company, it was his hope to get the best designed instruments possible out there. His dream was sadly not fufilled. EB and Fender just wanted to put out basses that would make money. Thats why they bought the companies from Leo. Because they were instruments designed well enough to still be good if they were put together like crap (I'm talking more Fender here. EB, as I said, has good QC). I personally don't feel that EBMM products are worth 1,500-2,000 dollars. I don't feel that the S.U.B. basses are worth what they cost (they are as low quality as any SX bass could be. I dont care if they are made in the US. That makes no differnce to me. Being on out soil doesn't make a bass holy. It can still be a crap bass). I don't feel that MIA series Fenders are even worth 1,200 dollars.

How big do you think EBMM is? How many employees do you think they have? I bet you'd be surpised. Not even close to an organization like Fender.

Wow, just how many $2,000 EBMM basses have you seen? You clearly have no idea of the pricing structure. $1,150 gets you most Stingrays or Bongos. $1,500 gets you just about any SR5 or Bongo 5 with decent options. Heck, even the 30th anniversay Stingray goes for $1750 max.

Also, what is low quality about the S.U.B.? Its put together as well as any SR, good fret work, tight tolerances. Other than cheaper wood and different finish type, there is nothing cheap about it. They still sound quite nice.

Musicman was a company that had trouble making money when Leo was running it. If a company like Ernie Ball hadn't bought them, there would be no more Stingrays. Most people would agree that the attention to detail and QC is much better on the current models than the older pre EB stuff.

Also, if Ernie Ball was a faceless corporation looking to maximize profits, they might not move manufacturing to Korea, but the sure as heck wouldn't still be manufacturing in San Luis Obisopo, CA, one of the most expensive places in the US.

EB and Fender just wanted to put out basses that would make money.

Yeah, because making no money is a real enabler on your route to making the best bass possible. :scowl:

BTW, did you know that Leo had lost some of his hearing by the time he designed the Stingray. In fact, the Stingray guitar was overall pretty horrible because Leo had such a hard time hearing treble, he had to keep boosting the treble response so it would sound "normal" to him.

 

[patrickj]

I gotta say--its only my opinion, ok?--but that really doesn't sound very Stingray-like to me. And the B-string is pretty indistinct and muddy. Not a terribly bad-sounding bass for the money, but I don't think EB has anything to worry about. I wouldn't play one.

Anyway, glad you like it.

Yeah, for $180 it's a nice bass. The sample was recorded flat with no amp/cabinet settings (also, I think I merged the DI signal and the processed signal from the Pod when I saved it in Audacity - doh). I've got a Stingray 4 atm as well and both sound pretty similar with the MM tone a bit more all-around defined, esp in clarity and presence. To my ears, the base mid-thickness/shape that makes the Stingray sound is there. YMMV $.02 etc

SXs have always had lousy B strings. Better strings/new bridges/nuts make them better. FWIW, I didn't think it was a bad B string. Much better than other SXs I've owned. It's as good as my BTB B string. *shrug*

So far I like it. It's a good sounding bass, it looks good, and it's cheap so I don't have to be as uptight when I'm taking it to venues.

Gigging with it tonight so I'll have a better idea of it's longterm usefulness.

 

[savit260]

Btw, when did Rondo move their warehouse to New Hampshire??

Do you know what town in New Hampshire they moved the warehouse to?

 

[truckin88]

I am pretty sure they won't let you view or Pickup in NH

 

[SnakeAnthony]

How big do you think EBMM is? How many employees do you think they have? I bet you'd be surpised. Not even close to an organization like Fender.

Wow, just how many $2,000 EBMM basses have you seen? You clearly have no idea of the pricing structure. $1,150 gets you most Stingrays or Bongos. $1,500 gets you just about any SR5 or Bongo 5 with decent options. Heck, even the 30th anniversay Stingray goes for $1750 max.

Also, what is low quality about the S.U.B.? Its put together as well as any SR, good fret work, tight tolerances. Other than cheaper wood and different finish type, there is nothing cheap about it. They still sound quite nice.

Musicman was a company that had trouble making money when Leo was running it. If a company like Ernie Ball hadn't bought them, there would be no more Stingrays. Most people would agree that the attention to detail and QC is much better on the current models than the older pre EB stuff.

Also, if Ernie Ball was a faceless corporation looking to maximize profits, they might not move manufacturing to Korea, but the sure as heck wouldn't still be manufacturing in San Luis Obisopo, CA, one of the most expensive places in the US.

Yeah, because making no money is a real enabler on your route to making the best bass possible. :scowl:

BTW, did you know that Leo had lost some of his hearing by the time he designed the Stingray. In fact, the Stingray guitar was overall pretty horrible because Leo had such a hard time hearing treble, he had to keep boosting the treble response so it would sound "normal" to him.

I figured I'd be bashed for that....

Look. EBMM is a corperation. Regardless of its sized compared to Fender, it is still a mainstream corperation.

2,000 was a generalization of the price range.

I personally find the S.U.B.s to be sub-par. Despite how it looks, I am a large EBMM fan. I love just about everything they put out, with two exceptions, the Bongo and the S.U.B. line. The Bongo is a personal issue, but I just find the S.U.B. line to be lack luster in all categories. I hate the finishes, and I've heard bad things about the finish quality. Basswood is such a crappy wood. I hate its sound and its dissapointing on these instruments. Maybe thats more of a personal thing with me too, but I've hated every S.U.B. that I've ever touched.

Where the factory is means NOTHING. I wish people would begin to understand that. If you fill the same factory with the same equipment and the same people, and you place it in Mexico, or Korea, or California, or England, or Indonesia, wherever, the results will still be the same. Thats why I don't focus on where its made. You can get quality from Korea that equals or betters some of the work we see here in America. EBMM could have their factory in the richest part of America, they could have it in Mexico. Its still gonna be the same product in the end.

I'm not saying that making money is bad, I'm saying that greed leads to greed. The more money people make, the more thay want to make. Take Fender for example. For a long time, they got away with putting out crap and still making money. Now they see that its not cutting it and they are boosting the quality of their products.

And no I did not know that about Leo. But that statement was a generalization of all of his products, from Fender to MM, to G&L.

 

[KPJ]

Where the factory is means NOTHING.

Cost of labor. Cost of government regulation. Location means a LOT!

 

[SnakeAnthony]

Cost of labor. Cost of government regulation. Location means a LOT!

Point. But what I ment was, if the headstock says 'Made In Korea' but it was made in an identical factory with the same people as it would have been in america, would that be a lesser bass? No it wouldn't. And don't assume that the people in Korea are somehow 'Less Capable' of making instruments than Americans. Large and Small companies all around the world still attempt to hire the best to do the job. But smaller companies have the advantage to oversee directly what goes down, compared to say Fender where it is on such a large scale that it cant be individually viewed. Perhaps this is why EBMMs QC is as good as it is (like I said, I dig EBMM and I wasn't attempting to put it down. But I stated what I feel is true about larger corperations).

 

[g00eY]

...Basswood is such a crappy wood...

Where the factory is means NOTHING. I wish people would begin to understand that. If you fill the same factory with the same equipment and the same people, and you place it in Mexico, or Korea, or California, or England, or Indonesia, wherever, the results will still be the same. Thats why I don't focus on where its made. You can get quality from Korea that equals or betters some of the work we see here in America. EBMM could have their factory in the richest part of America, they could have it in Mexico. Its still gonna be the same product in the end.

Bongos are made of basswood and they are super. too bad you don't like Bongos.

and, actually, where the factory is means A LOT in terms of quality. you see, the foreign countries such as Korea and Indonesia are used because they can hire people for a lower pay. obviously if you're doing that, then you're trying to save money. when you're talking about putting out mass produced instruments and saving money at the same time, you don't get good quality control. half of the instruments they put out generally play horribly when you pick them up. let's face it. US companies aren't going to move their factories, equipment, and workers to Indonesia cuz they know that if they do, they won't put out the same quality instruments. so i guess yea, you can occasionally get great quality instruments from foreign countries, but for the most part you're gonna get what you pay for.

 

[g00eY]

Point. But what I ment was, if the headstock says 'Made In Korea' but it was made in an identical factory with the same people as it would have been in america, would that be a lesser bass? No it wouldn't. And don't assume that the people in Korea are somehow 'Less Capable' of making instruments than Americans. Large and Small companies all around the world still attempt to hire the best to do the job.

too bad that's not how the world works.

 

[bovinehost]

Ok, for all of you arguing about this. Take something into consideration. EB doesn't care as much as many of you think they do about their product. Neither does Fender. Large corperations their size don't need good products, they just need to make money.

First, it's 'corporations'.

Second, and then I'll stop numbering things because it's annoying, it's apparent and obvious to anyone who's been to the EBMM shop in San Luis Obispo that you have no idea what you're talking about. None. Zero. Zip. Nada.

I don't often say that, because most of the discussions I have here are about opinions, but you state that EBMM cares less than we think they do? Wrong. Completely and totally FOS, my man. You can tell me you don't care for the Bongo or that you don't like the SUB or the Stingray isn't your cup of tea, and I think, "Okay, sure."

But now you want to tell me you know how little the Ball family and the hardworking engineers and others at EB care? They cared enough to save a company that was headed for oblivion, and they care enough every day to keep looking for ways to make the instruments better. You have no idea how much Sterling Ball (or his sons or the other people at Musicman) care about making good tools for musicians.

So - you're dead wrong, pal.

Or maybe you know more about the Ball family than I do? I'll give it a listen if you have some information.

Leo Fender did care when he designed his Fender, Music Man, and G&L products, and each time he sold each company, it was his hope to get the best designed instruments possible out there. His dream was sadly not fufilled. EB and Fender just wanted to put out basses that would make money.

Do you know why Leo Fender sold the company to CBS? Do you know what happened with Leo and MusicMan?

Thats why they bought the companies from Leo. Because they were instruments designed well enough to still be good if they were put together like crap (I'm talking more Fender here. EB, as I said, has good QC).

I can't speak to CBS' motivation, although I suspect it was to make money. Why not? But MusicMan was getting ready to disappear when the Ball family stepped in. If you're going to imagine things about these events and these people, you should at least do some work on your history.

I personally don't feel that EBMM products are worth 1,500-2,000 dollars. I don't feel that the S.U.B. basses are worth what they cost (they are as low quality as any SX bass could be. I dont care if they are made in the US. That makes no differnce to me. Being on out soil doesn't make a bass holy. It can still be a crap bass).

Now you see? Those are opinions! Badly formed and not reasoned very well, but opinions nonetheless.

I do feel that SX basses could be better put together, and have more attention to detail, what what is important is the price.

Is that what's important? That makes a lot of sense.

Look. EBMM is a corperation. Regardless of its sized compared to Fender, it is still a mainstream corperation.

You mean with a chairman of the board and shareholders and stock and all that? Hmmm.

Basswood is such a crappy wood. I hate its sound and its dissapointing on these instruments.

Now you're on solid ground! Wait - hold on - maybe not. Basswood is a perfectly good tonewood, it's just not very pretty...so where does all your wood knowledge come from? School me if you can!

And no I did not know that about Leo. But that statement was a generalization of all of his products, from Fender to MM, to G&L.

There is so much to learn.

You better get started.

Jack

 

[pilotjones]

While I fully support the idea that it's possible to make a great instrument in any country, there's a fault in the concept of this statement:

If you fill the same factory with the same equipment and the same people, and you place it in Mexico, or Korea, or California, or England, or Indonesia, wherever, the results will still be the same.

--namely that it isn't the same people, in purchasing, production, QC, maintenance, or management; and it may or may not the same equipment.

Without meaning to imply better or worse, consider: even if you managed to find a way to magically move a US factory and every one of its people to Singapore, they wouldn't produce the same product. Lives would be different, so the product would be different. Likewise with the reverse move. Only industrial robots don't "care" where they are, and even so, their output is still affected by their input materials, the quality of their programming, and by their human-supplied maintenance program.

 

[SnakeAnthony]

Ok. I was wrong on most of what I said. Sorry for my hot headedness. I get to saying lots of things I shouldn't based upon my own opinions, not fact...

Sorry again guys. And I know I can't spell. I didn't pay attention in 3rd grade

 

[bovinehost]

Look, I was being a little high and mighty on my response, and I apologize for that.

My only point here is that the guys at EBMM, whether you love the basses or hate 'em, are really dedicated to making good tools for us.

Now Fender.....who knows?

Jack