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that elusive rickenbacker growl

azwhofan

azwhofan

Oct 17, 2007
913
397
Arizona
#1
I have a 2002 Ric 4003V63 with horseshoe and toaster pups. I'm having an impossible time getting that famous Squire growl from the bass, and am wondering if anyone here can help me decipher what I'm doing wrong.

I'm using an Eden navigator preamp, Mackie 1400i amp and Eden D410T.
I have replaced the stock capacitor - cannot remember the value right now, but it is one that has the recommended capacitance.

I've tried dialing in every kind of eq combination possible. I've tried lowering and raising the pups, all to no avail.

is it the power amp? Should I be using a tube power amp?


Also, any thoughts of putting in a piezo aftermarket pup to bring out that growl? I once played a Tobin that was co-designed my Mr Tobias. It had 3 piezo's implanted in the head and neck, and it just screamed of classic Squire/Geddy growl.

thanks in advance for your suggestions.
 
#2
azwhofan said:
I have a 2002 Ric 4003V63 with horseshoe and toaster pups. I'm having an impossible time getting that famous Squire growl from the bass, and am wondering if anyone here can help me decipher what I'm doing wrong.
Click to expand...

I humbly suggest that the only thing you're doing wrong is expecting that every Rick 4001 (or 4003) can get that Chris Squire tone. I was a major Chris Squire (and, to a lesser extent, Jon Camp) freak when I was a teenager and so went on a quest to find me the "perfect" Rick 4001 with that classic twang.

I've probably played 20 different 4001s over the years. Out of those 20, one of them came pretty close to Squire's tone.

Most of the others were astonishingly far off the mark.
 
#3
Hoover said:
I humbly suggest that the only thing you're doing wrong is expecting that every Rick 4001 (or 4003) can get that Chris Squire tone. I was a major Chris Squire (and, to a lesser extent, Jon Camp) freak when I was a teenager and so went on a quest to find me the "perfect" Rick 4001 with that classic twang.

I've probably played 20 different 4001s over the years. Out of those 20, one of them came pretty close to Squire's tone.

Most of the others were astonishingly far off the mark.
Click to expand...

And I humbly ask what in your opinion caused those Ric's to be so far off the mark?
 
#4
I get growl out of my 4003 on any amp, and I use flats. I regularly use an Eden WT-405 with 2x10s Ampeg, and it sounds amazing.

But I can advice:

-The Navigator is a soft-sounding preamp to me (had one).
-Equally, the Mackie 1400 is not the most warm and responsive amp (I actually had a Navigator with the Mackie combo, and it was never that great of a sound.) Getting an Ampeg pro head wouldn't hurt.

-If you are not already, try playing with a pick and roundwound strings.
 
#8
If you're trying to get the "Roundabout" sound, you'll need a Marshall guitar amp with distortion/overdrive going. Squire dubbed over the track on the Marshall, and might have used a guitar for part of it. Also, Squire used a Ric 1999 early on, I believe. There was a recent BP article on him where they went through his gear and recording technique.
 
#9
If you want to sound like Chris Squire, you need his bass:


CS.jpg



:hiding:
 
#10
Gasman said:
If you're trying to get the "Roundabout" sound, you'll need a Marshall guitar amp with distortion/overdrive going. Squire dubbed over the track on the Marshall, and might have used a guitar for part of it. Also, Squire used a Ric 1999 early on, I believe. There was a recent BP article on him where they went through his gear and recording technique.
Click to expand...

+1. He did overdub the part using one of Steve Morse's guitars.

I get big growl out of my Ric, no problem. Not the exact same tone as Squire, but killer nonetheless. I can get a decent Geddy Lee tone if I really dig in.
 
#12
I've never played a Ric that didn't have that famous growly tone. I've had 5 of them, so far, and they all did the Ric sound. I would suggest that alot more than just the bass goes into any person's particular sound, including amplification, speakers, strings, and the players own fingers. You might try a little bit of overdrive and some boost in the mids, but other than that, I'm confused as to why you, and Hoover are not getting some form of growl out of your Ric basses.
 
#13
BartmanPDX said:
+1. He did overdub the part using one of Steve Morse's guitars.

I get big growl out of my Ric, no problem. Not the exact same tone as Squire, but killer nonetheless. I can get a decent Geddy Lee tone if I really dig in.
Click to expand...

to be honest i can get some growl using a pick - and i do use roundwounds - . i'm not looking for the exact Roundabout sound, more like the tones he got on the "Yes" album or "And you and I" or the solo Eddie Harris album "Eddie Harris in the U.K."
Link Removed
 
#14
lefty007 said:
I get growl out of my 4003 on any amp, and I use flats. I regularly use an Eden WT-405 with 2x10s Ampeg, and it sounds amazing.

But I can advice:

-The Navigator is a soft-sounding preamp to me (had one).
-Equally, the Mackie 1400 is not the most warm and responsive amp (I actually had a Navigator with the Mackie combo, and it was never that great of a sound.) Getting an Ampeg pro head wouldn't hurt.

-If you are not already, try playing with a pick and roundwound strings.
Click to expand...
I do use a pick and roundwounds, sorry, shoulda mentioned that as well.

Funny, my Eden and Mackie setup just screams Roger Waters with my 78 Pbass, and my Musicman 5 likes it as well.

But getting an SVT for the bedroom is not an option :-) Any suggestions on smaller tube amps would be welcome.
 
#15
azwhofan said:
And I humbly ask what in your opinion caused those Ric's to be so far off the mark?
Click to expand...

Man, I wish I knew!

I can certainly suggest why they didn't sound exactly like Chris Squire's...afterall, so much of a player's sound is in their hands, in their touch. Squire admits he strikes the string simultaneously with the side of the pick and the edge of his thumb. He's played through an old Marshall amp since day one (or at least some day prior to recording Time And A Word). And the body of his bass was refinished, then shaved down, then refinished again or some such nonsense. So it would be silly for me to expect to pick up any 4001 plugged into the amp du jour and have it sound exactly like Squire.

But as to why so many of the 4001's I've played sounded nothing like Squire's, I can't even begin to guess. Okay, a couple of them were strung up with flatwounds or halfrounds, so that's part of the problem, sure. But still: a dozen or so 4001's with Rotosound roundwound strings, and they all sounded closer to a Fender Precision than anything Chris Squire ever recorded. Maybe I should start whacking away with the side of my thumb/edge of a pick?
 
#17
I'll have to agree. I used to be the setup guy at a used GTR store in Miami (Ed's, fwiw). Anyway, at any given point in time, we'd have maybe 15 Ric basses in the store. I recall exactly ONE having THE sound in all the time I was there. Same hands, same amp, etc. One bass. Dunno, YMMV, FWIW, ETC...


Lee
 
#18
I have found my 4003 to be even more sensitive to right hand placement than other basses, so you might want to play round with hand placement, and see if that helps. Also, try backing off one of the volume knobs to get just out of humbucking. That should make it a bit more growly.

Hope this helps, Tom.
 
#19
A SansAmp Bass Driver will help IMO. I get pretty close to Squire with my Rics and the overdrive I get from that little gem. They're great little boxes. Squire uses effects for his sound, as well as guitar cabs and Ampeg and Marshall heads too. I have three Rics(4003, V63, C64) and all have plenty of that classic Ric growl.
 

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