The B-15n vs PF-50t: Shootout

[JimmyM]

I can see why this sentiment matters and where it makes sense.


I think it might be a happy medium here, might be to play something through a looper into the B-15 and then to see how closely I can match that sound while playing the same loop through the PF-50t and showing how I’m manipulate controls to get there.

Other videos will probably be more jam/goofing off focused.

That’s fair enough, I think.

This x10000 ^

Even on high production quality YT channels, I can see some physical difference in the Player's technique or energy when comparing. With how far digital audio technology has come (amp models, effects, recording, etc.) I'd have a hard time believing a modern looper pedal could not replicate a 10-15 second bassline with proper audio fidelity.

Maybe if you have one of those fancy Ed Sheeran deals, but while they’re fine for live work, those little Boss loopers aren’t bastions of audio purity. On the other hand, bassestkkm is open to doing both ways, so all is well.

Bassest, looking forward to the vids, also, I forgot to thank you for the kind words earlier. I can’t wait to hear you smash it Portaflex stylee!

Speaking of which, can I please request a full front and back of the B15?

 

[EricOnTheBass]

I concur with the others about using a looper. It's the best way to make an apples-to-apples comparison. Sure it's not 100% fidelity to a live bass, but at least they will both be receiving the exact same signal.

 

[bassestkkm]

That’s fair enough, I think.


Maybe if you have one of those fancy Ed Sheeran deals, but while they’re fine for live work, those little Boss loopers aren’t bastions of audio purity. On the other hand, bassestkkm is open to doing both ways, so all is well.

Bassest, looking forward to the vids, also, I forgot to thank you for the kind words earlier. I can’t wait to hear you smash it Portaflex stylee!

Speaking of which, can I please request a full front and back of the B15?

Absolutely. Next time there’s good lighting I’ll take some more pictures.

I probably should mention that the Amp recently came back from repair. It ended up getting bashed a little bit during shipping.

A part of the wood at the base of the head ended up breaking. And when I turned it on the first time, the fuse blew.

I immediately packed it up and took it to the shop for repairs. Fortunately, everything on the inside is still OK. The fuse holder was shorting to the chassis and that’s what ended up, causing the fuse to blow. After that was repaired and a few of the solder joints went over, it was completely functional again.

 

[bassestkkm]

That’s fair enough, I think.


Maybe if you have one of those fancy Ed Sheeran deals, but while they’re fine for live work, those little Boss loopers aren’t bastions of audio purity. On the other hand, bassestkkm is open to doing both ways, so all is well.

Bassest, looking forward to the vids, also, I forgot to thank you for the kind words earlier. I can’t wait to hear you smash it Portaflex stylee!

Speaking of which, can I please request a full front and back of the B15?

As requested

 

[JimmyM]

As requested

Bummer about the chassis tray wood, but it still looks quite clean and nice.

 

[Martin Beer]

On paper there are a lot of differences between the two amps. 12AX7 vs 6SL7 preamp tubes. PF 50t has essentially a SVT preamp vs the PF 20t that’s a B-15N . Should be interesting to see if you can dial in the B-15N sound on the PF 50t. Good hunting.

I'm not sure the PF50T preamp is fully an SVT circuit, there just aren’t enough triodes for the full preamp circuit plus a phase inverter. I haven't seen a published schematic for the PF50T, but there's a simplified version of the midrange EQ used in the V9 and the 90s V4BH, and I think it may be based on that.

 

[bassestkkm]

Bummer about the chassis tray wood, but it still looks quite clean and nice.

Thanks! Not bad for 60ish years young. Mr. Dixon (AmpHole tech in Burbank, Ca) bent things back into place and reglued the piece. He said it was nothing internal, just a bump during transport.

 

[bassestkkm]

@JimmyM I think the B-15 I have is 1966-1968. I have a chance to snag a 1976-1979 (4 inputs, white switches with black graphics) for half the price of my original. Would it be worth adding into the mix?

 

[JimmyM]

@JimmyM I think the B-15 I have is 1966-1968. I have a chance to snag a 1976-1979 (4 inputs, white switches with black graphics) for half the price of my original. Would it be worth adding into the mix?

What kind of speaker? It’s a heavy little bugger but it has a cool vibe. I had one with a CTS speaker and I loved a lot about it but preferred the smaller one because it was tighter and a little brighter. If it has an Altec 421a, though, I’d definitely consider it. I’d definitely consider it no matter what, really, as I enjoyed my time with the bigger one, but the Altec is such a killer in that cab.

 

[bassestkkm]

Figured I’d share the basses. Minus a few. Will probably keep the 3TSB jazz with rounds and the fiesta red P with Flats on the record.

The GAS bug and a lot of good deals have hit me hard but I suppose this is what about 20 years of finding a good deal and wanting to expand tone options looks like.

Because I only have a two channel live view interface, I think I will end up putting one Mike up close off access on the cab and one as a room Mike a little further away just to catch the ambience. That way it’s a little better reflection of where we would hear it standing and playing near them.

 

[bassestkkm]

It’s taken a while to get to this point between a busy work, a house hunt, and home life. I’d been trying to record using the mics at my disposal and wasn’t happy with the way things were sounding until today.

I tried just the SM57 but didn’t feel it was articulating well enough. I tried it with a few other things both near and far from the speaker/grill, but the overall sound wasn’t a good representation of what I hear vs what plays back after recording. Then I combined with my Beta 52a and that unlocked articulation that was previously missing.

Maybe it was a phase thing, maybe I’m just weird (likely). But finally, I feel that I’ve got a winning combo where it sounds accurate back through both sets of speakers, as well as the headphones and car radio.

I want to do my best keeping it just the mics and the amps with no post adjusting or compression in the DAW. So each amp will be recorded separately. The looper will have the same things playing and I’ll go through a few different basses.

I’m sure it’ll be a little bit disappointing for some people, but I’m working within my personal instruments. I will be using my Squier CV 50s Bass and Lake Placid blue, the Squier CV 60s precision bass in fiesta red, the Fender made in Mexico RW jazz bass in three tone sunburst, and the Fender Jaguar bass CIJ.

 

[bassestkkm]

Got a little closer to starting recording today. I think I’ve figured out a format too. I’m still not super happy with the way mics are sounding. If anyone has suggestions please let me know. I feel like the Beta 52 is capturing lows well but maybe I need to place the SM57 differently to get a bigger range of mids and highs. I’ll keep playing with it tomorrow.

Here’s where I currently have the mics placed. Possibly further from the grill or more to center would help. I’ll keep trying.

The classic vibe 50s P bass isn’t as nice as the 60s, and the neck is a lot more playable and thin than the fat necked early P basses I’ve had the opportunity to play. It still sounds like a P to me. I may try to put rounds and a hotter single coil setup in there to push the sound more like some of the ones I’ve played, but it is good.

I’d dreamed of a road worn Jazz since I was a teen. I’m glad it found its way to me. You’ll hear it soon enough. Does everything I need it to and then some.

I always hoped the CIJ jaguar I owned would be red with a matching headstock, but with its 70s bridge pickup position and growl, I may just settle for a refinish from someone like MJT aged guitars.

There’s a reason that I’ve had the P bass for 10 years now. Sure, I wish it had some more signs of wear from how much I’ve played it. I like the road worn as much as the minty. But everything I own is slightly imperfect and that is perfect for me.

Lighting really does make a big difference. I will eventually cut my foam sponge to make a mute at the bridge. I usually palm mute. I’ll include some playing videos and others of

Borrowed some lights from my dad to see how it’d affect video. Makes a huge positive change. This is the room currently. I think some of what’s not in this pic will be sold off soon.

 

[JimmyM]

Got a little closer to starting recording today. I think I’ve figured out a format too. I’m still not super happy with the way mics are sounding. If anyone has suggestions please let me know. I feel like the Beta 52 is capturing lows well but maybe I need to place the SM57 differently to get a bigger range of mids and highs. I’ll keep playing with it tomorrow. View attachment 7229018

Here’s where I currently have the mics placed. Possibly further from the grill or more to center would help. I’ll keep trying.


View attachment 7229019

The classic vibe 50s P bass isn’t as nice as the 60s, and the neck is a lot more playable and thin than the fat necked early P basses I’ve had the opportunity to play. It still sounds like a P to me. I may try to put rounds and a hotter single coil setup in there to push the sound more like some of the ones I’ve played, but it is good.

I’d dreamed of a road worn Jazz since I was a teen. I’m glad it found its way to me. You’ll hear it soon enough. Does everything I need it to and then some.
View attachment 7229020
I always hoped the CIJ jaguar I owned would be red with a matching headstock, but with its 70s bridge pickup position and growl, I may just settle for a refinish from someone like MJT aged guitars.

There’s a reason that I’ve had the P bass for 10 years now. Sure, I wish it had some more signs of wear from how much I’ve played it. I like the road worn as much as the minty. But everything I own is slightly imperfect and that is perfect for me. View attachment 7229022
Lighting really does make a big difference. I will eventually cut my foam sponge to make a mute at the bridge. I usually palm mute. I’ll include some playing videos and others of

View attachment 7229021
Borrowed some lights from my dad to see how it’d affect video. Makes a huge positive change. This is the room currently. I think some of what’s not in this pic will be sold off soon.

Definitely go more toward center with the mic. The center represents the full range of the cab whereas moving it down to where it is in your pic sounds kind of muddy. Works well for guitar, but not great on bass if you ask me.