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The decibel delima. Long rant, short gig.

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#61
Passinwind said:
Yep. 70dB at where? Stage, sound booth, parking lot, police station? It's a meaningless number without a well defined measurement position being specified.
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+1. The 70 dB could refer to outside the club or at the neighboring property which could potentially be reasonable. But if the 70 dB is the volume limit for the front of the audience, then the owner should probably book acoustic gigs only, with no drum kits. I don't think my (3 piece plus vocals) classic rock band could comfortably play at 70dB. The drummer would rebel.

We had a club owner come out with his meter and check us several times and tell us to turn down, which we did. Eventually the drummer started playing sarcastically (almost inaudibly), then when he got to the cowbell part, started beating the bejeezus out of the cowbell. I couldn't help myself and busted out laughing.

The audience loved us at that club but the owner turned it into a strip bar so we don't play there any more. :p
 
#62
BartmanPDX said:
+1. The 70 dB could refer to outside the club or at the neighboring property which could potentially be reasonable. But if the 70 dB is the volume limit for the front of the audience, then the owner should probably book acoustic gigs only, with no drum kits. I don't think my (3 piece plus vocals) classic rock band could comfortably play at 70dB. The drummer would rebel.

We had a club owner come out with his meter and check us several times and tell us to turn down, which we did. Eventually the drummer started playing sarcastically (almost inaudibly), then when he got to the cowbell part, started beating the bejeezus out of the cowbell. I couldn't help myself and busted out laughing.

The audience loved us at that club but the owner turned it into a strip bar so we don't play there any more. :p
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My understanding is that the police office would come up to the picket fence that runs along the sidewalk and do the test from there. Maybe 30 to 40 yards away. Not sure about that.

So does anyone know what the decibel level is for noise ordinances in you area?
 
#64
If the police were measuring from 30-40 yards away then at 1 meter from the PA you could have been at a 100dbs which is the same as the chart mentioned earlier says for a disco. Time for your band to buy a smaller amps if you want to play places like that in the future. A svt/fridge set-up is asking for trouble. The owner sees a big rig like that and will assume you are loud.
 
#66
steveksux said:
So you don't know how to turn your volume knob down? Really? Or you dont' know which direction is down? Which is it? Might want to check the owners manual of your gear. I bet its in there.

So what's your idea of the lower limit of a 1500 watt amplifier driving a pair of 2x10's in decibels?

How loud is your PA with the sliders down all the way? If you can hit 0 dB, why can't you hit 70 dB? Or anything in between?

Randy
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Drumsticks hitting electronic drums would be almost 70. Your vocalist would be almost humming, acoustic guitars wouldn't be able to use picks. There's no reason to even bring an amp to a 70dB gig.
 
#67
modulusman said:
If the police were measuring from 30-40 yards away then at 1 meter from the PA you could have been at a 100dbs which is the same as the chart mentioned earlier says for a disco. Time for your band to buy a smaller amps if you want to play places like that in the future. A svt/fridge set-up at a is asking for trouble. The owner sees a big rig like that and will assume you are loud.
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I agree but it wasn't a problem the last time I used it there. Ran the volume around noon.
 
#68
I woulda told the band to turn everythting to 4 o clock and blown the f****n paint off the walls, then made sure the same cops issuing the fine had to call in S.W.A.T. to remove us from the stage:bassist:

Its rocknroll for chissake..:D:D:D:D:D

Seriously bum deal dude!!!
 
#69
rmkesler said:
We were scheduled from 6:00 to 10:00. We were in a downtown area.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen,_Georgia

Nutdog, your profile says you're in GA. Ever play in Helen?
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No but it's just over the hill. Would be a great place to be this time of year. I'm in the not as thriving as it used to be metropolis of Dalton. Most of my playing has been in the Atlanta-Chattanooga I75 corridor. Currently, with 3 kids, it's mostly church and the occasional wedding/party/fundraiser.

And I don't think we have a db limit. I think the noise ordinance is only enforced if someone complains. But so far I haven't had any luck getting that obnoxious high school band to turn down on Friday nights. :eyebrow:
 
#70
M0ses said:
Drumsticks hitting electronic drums would be almost 70. Your vocalist would be almost humming, acoustic guitars wouldn't be able to use picks. There's no reason to even bring an amp to a 70dB gig.
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Sounds like you don't have a clue what 70dB sounds like. Vacuum cleaner is around 70 dB, not exactly whisper quiet. Noticed you avoided the part about amps going down to zero also. Smart move on your part. Keep hoping nobody noticed that!

In addition, I'm thinking perhaps you missed the part about it having to be 70dB about 30-40 yards away from the stage.

Also, do you have any explanation how other bands manage to play there? Obviously they're doing it, he hasn't been fined out of business yet.

Any answers? Or just more inane statements about acoustic guitars not being able to use pics or they'd be too loud?

Randy
 
#71
nutdog said:
Professionalism works both ways. If an owner with a 70db limit knowingly books a band with 3 guitars, drums and bass, he's an idiot. “Either turn it down or turn it the f@ck off” is not professional. It is a rude way of providing options, one of which the OP's band selected.
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To me, this is the crux of it all. Without the rude comment, it would not have been appropriate for the band to pack and leave. With that comment, it completely changes the equation. No one should have to deal with nasty behavior like that. Life is truly too short for that bullsh*t.
 
#74
steveksux said:
Like .... turn down like the other bands that play there?
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You are assuming that all the other bands play within this 70 db limit. Maybe they were the first to encounter this situation after a police warning. Maybe all the other bands to follow couldn't play to those conditions either.

Just having an outside terrace of general crowd noise would go over the limit of 70 dbs (judging by the reference chart someone had posted). If 70 db is a normal conversation, then a whole bunch of conversations is usually more than that. Even an unamplified acoustic guitar and acoustic vocal would be louder.

I have been in situations where the volume levels were an issue and the band has done its best to comply (with no problems yet), but 70 dbs means not having any outdoor activity.
 
#75
Smallmouth_Bass said:
You are assuming that all the other bands play within this 70 db limit. Maybe they were the first to encounter this situation after a police warning. Maybe all the other bands to follow couldn't play to those conditions either.
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Sure am. Its a lot safer assumption than these guys happened to be the first. What do you think is the most likely?
Just having an outside terrace of general crowd noise would go over the limit of 70 dbs (judging by the reference chart someone had posted). If 70 db is a normal conversation, then a whole bunch of conversations is usually more than that. Even an unamplified acoustic guitar and acoustic vocal would be louder.
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The one I posted compared 70dB to a vacuum cleaner close by. Which do you think is more likely to be correct if you're talking about a nuisance/noise ordinance? That normal conversation would be the limit, or something louder?

When you have two options to choose from, and one makes no sense, better off choosing the other option.
I have been in situations where the volume levels were an issue and the band has done its best to comply (with no problems yet), but 70 dbs means not having any outdoor activity.
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Again, this thought that 70dB is impossible to obtain.

All the electronic gear comes with volume controls that take it down to 0dB. How hard can it be to adjust to 70dB? Its not a question of can't. Its a question of "don't want to". The only one that has a legitimate gripe is the drummer. He's really got to change how he plays to keep quiet on an acoustic set. Everyone else just needs to twist a knob.

Randy
 
#76
Randy....you are like that annoying person in class that feels the need to raise your hand and offer your thoughts on anything and everything. Randy, why did the band choose to leave after careful deliberation? Answer: they were given an ultimatum and didn't feel like they could comply with a 70db limitation. Rather than risk a $700 fine for themselves and the club, they made a safe decision and called it a night. Randy, they are not all going to sell all of their gear in order to purchase micro rigs that satisfy one clubs demands. Asking a rock band to play at 70db with a drummer is absurd. Revealing this new 70 db requirement to a 3 guitar rock band upon there arrival and asking them to put themselves at risk for a $700 dollar fine...well that's just Bull man. The OP definitely strikes me as the type of guy that would have arrived at the gig with a db meter had the owner had the decency to inform them of this potentially $700 policy change. This isn't about being 'tough guy' enough to suck it up and turn down Randy. It is about deducing an inability to know if you are within the alloted Db range, and using proper risk assesment to conclude that the gig is not worth $700 out of any bands pocket. Feel free to put your hand down now...
 
#79
faulknersj said:
Randy....you are like that annoying person in class that feels the need to raise your hand and offer your thoughts on anything and everything. Randy, why did the band choose to leave after careful deliberation? Answer: they were given an ultimatum and didn't feel like they could comply with a 70db limitation. Rather than risk a $700 fine for themselves and the club, they made a safe decision and called it a night. Randy, they are not all going to sell all of their gear in order to purchase micro rigs that satisfy one clubs demands. Asking a rock band to play at 70db with a drummer is absurd. Revealing this new 70 db requirement to a 3 guitar rock band upon there arrival and asking them to put themselves at risk for a $700 dollar fine...well that's just Bull man. The OP definitely strikes me as the type of guy that would have arrived at the gig with a db meter had the owner had the decency to inform them of this potentially $700 policy change. This isn't about being 'tough guy' enough to suck it up and turn down Randy. It is about deducing an inability to know if you are within the alloted Db range, and using proper risk assesment to conclude that the gig is not worth $700 out of any bands pocket. Feel free to put your hand down now...
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zero is less than 70 dB, right?

If the knobs go down to zero, why can't they achieve 70dB?

I can get as quiet as I need to be with a 1500 W bass amp. 70dB, 60dB, whatever is necessary. twist the knob. Its not magic. Its a knob You dont' have to buy smaller equipment.

Simple facts. And if the 70 dB is probably not the volume at the stage, its 30-40 yards away, outdoors. It would be louder at the stage. Hence, even easier to achieve than 70dB. Although, doesn't even matter since a simple extra twist of a few knobs will bring it down to 70 at the stage also.

Randy
 
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