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The Fender Bassman 100T thread
- Thread starter Tim1
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The Harke specs say 98dB spl 1watt/1meter, which I didn't think was very efficient. I thought anything over 100 was considered high efficiency, and 95 or lower inefficient. From my measurements, if the Harke is 98dB, the Fender should be about 96.
I'm just not worrying about it anymore and am anxious to see what the gig this Friday reveals, especially getting back to my heat concerns if the head has to be driven really hard. The guitar player in my new band has been way into tube amps for many years. He has a 1972 100watt Twin, and I was asking him if he didn't like the lower wattage older ones better. He said he had owned a few in the past and loved them, but that they absolutely just gave out after a while from being constantly overdriven. He said that completely recapping and re-tubing would not bring them back up. Don't know if that relates at all to the Bassman, but it makes sense as heat is death to all electronics, solid state or tube.
On a positive note, I picked up a sweet little Jack Casady Signature Epiphone while I was in New York this past weekend, and for a relatively cheap-ass little bass I'm super impressed with it. Flats on my G&L L-1000, rounds on the Epiphone, my new 100T and 410 neo I am basically ready to rock. Can't wait to hear this thing blow & go at the gig this Friday, and believe me I'll be posting a full report this weekend.
aside from the obvious differences with the specs. how do these compare with the ampeg v4bh reissue?
I haven't had direct experience with the V4B but others have posted that the 100T has more clean grunt.
The v4b and v4bh are totally different. They have nothing in common except being both hundred watt ampeg tube amps. the "reissue" tag is laughable. As for the comparison with the v4bh and the 100t there is no comparison. The v4bh is an anemic 100watts and sounds great at home/recording/practice volumes but not at show volume. The fender is hefty. It has the show capable volume of the v4b without going so easily into total overdrive.
ok cool, ive heard that before about the ''reissue'' i've seen a bunch of the orignals in person with guitar and bass and they always seem to cut through. just saw one for sale here just curious.
Man, my bass weenie is vibrating like crazy. Tonight's the night the new band plays its first gig, and I get to unleash the 100T/410 neo and see what it can really do. This is doubly exciting as I'm playing with a monster drummer, Bryan Wakeland, who was in Tripping Daisy, Fever in the Funkhouse and the Polyphonic Spree. Bryan is master of the super lazy drawl, which means he sits ever so slightly just behind the beat, and it creates just an amazing groove. IMO the mark of a true musician vs. 'just a drummer'. This is going to be the longest day ever. I'll let you guys know how the 100T does tomorrow. Here we go!
Record it!! Even if you don't share it with us, you'll want it for the future.
Ya, will be really interested to hear how that 410 sits in the onstage mix in a live situation, sounds like you are going to have a great night. I know what you mean about drummers who sit slightly behind, yo ucan get a great groove going.
So after all my kvetching and worrying I finally got to gig with the Fender rig last night. Here's the layout.
The bar is around 5000 sq. ft. - about 60'x85' with the band toward one side facing longways down the room. The stage area isn't elevated. Nothing but vocals through the mains except a touch of kick drum. There was anywhere from 75 - 100 people there at any one time, which is a factor. This size bar with 20 people in it you could play without a sweat with 100 watts. But the more people there are the more the guitarist has to crank and vocals have to come up, especially if you're not elevated and you're blowing right into people.
This was the new band's first gig. We're 3 piece for now, a classic-rock deal with stuff ranging from Police to Dwight Yoakum to Led Zeppelin. Guitar player plays Telecasters through a '72 100 watt Twin. We're seasoned players so we don't try to blow people's heads off, but the drummer is very powerful so it's definitely not meek.
The basses were a passive G&L L-1000 with GHS Bright Flats, and a passive Jack Casady Epiphone with roundwounds.
Finally regarding my style and what I expect from a rig, I think the biggest compliment someone could pay my playing would be to call it bombastic. I didn't get the nickname Freight Train by hiding behind the drums. I currently use no pedals or fx other than the 100T's overdrive occasionally, and don't plan to add any, especially not a compressor. I've always molded my bands around bass and drums carrying the load, and everything else playing as sparse and with as many holes as possible. I don't do any slapping/tapping stuff currently except for two sections on one song, So upfront grunt and punch is what I need.
The last time I played live, which was nearly 20 years ago, I had dual Hartke 410XL's with a GK 800RB. Maybe dissed these days, but in its day it helped set the standards of the modern aggressive bass sound. The Bassman 100T with a single 410 neo had so much more punch, headroom and clarity than that rig it's not even worth talking about. Having played amplified bass since around 1965/66, I've never had a rig sound like this. It gives you the impression of unlimited headroom.
I play sort of stream of consciousness, so I'm prone to whank on it with a thump or chord punch at any time, and I couldn't believe how the rig barks it right out with total authority. I had switched to the Epiphone/roundwounds on a few songs the first set, which I used on the active channel and was able to use the overdrive pretty heavy on one song, and it sounds great. But the G&L in single coil position through the vintage channel was such magic I settled in on that and had no desire to change anything except switching to single coil w/bass boost position a couple of times. The vintage channel/G&L tone stack I had set at 6-6-6 with channel volume on 6. On the active channel/Epiphone I had bass boosted just slightly, mids peaked just slightly probably around 2k or so, and highs rolled off a bit. Channel volume on 6. On the overdrive song I had overdrive on 8 and blend on 5, and the overdrive is sweet, crunchy and punchy. The 410 neo's tweeter level was at 11:00. I started the night on 5 on the master volume, and it eventually got to 6 when the crowd peaked. I had a lot of compliments on my sound, embarrassingly so eventually, and had a few people tell me at our loudest they were feeling the bottom in their chest when I punched.
The 100T didn't seem to stress over all this in the least. It really didn't seem to get much hotter than it does at rehearsal in the drummer's living room. I didn't look but I'm sure the fan came on, but after 3 sets it was no hotter than you'd expect a tube amp to be. I never got anything close to speaker breakup. The chord punches I would do gave the impression of clean, but it had that tube grease on it so it wasn't abrasive or piercing, and again they were crazy dynamic. I don't know how much louder the rig could have gone - it gives the impression it can give all you can take. But I seriously don't see much need to ever play much louder than I had it since at any place much larger I'd usually have mains help. What I'm really interested in next time we play this place or similar is seeing what happens in 25 watt mode. Should be some interesting power tube grind if it doesn't just suddenly jump into distortion.
Anyway, blah blah woof woof, this is a fantastic rig and the only reason I can think of me personally wanting one of the larger cabs or stacked 410's is for the look onstage, and I got over that 20 years ago. Plus what looks better than the 100T/410 neo? (Or 610, Tim.)
The gig was a rousing success btw and the bar is clamoring to lock us in for New Year's Eve.
(Added 5/20/12) After looking over this I realized I made it sound like I''m ham-fisted. That's not the case at all. We're a dynamic band. There are a couple of songs that play softly with thumb and the rig stays really clear, focused and present when you're using a light touch.
The bar is around 5000 sq. ft. - about 60'x85' with the band toward one side facing longways down the room. The stage area isn't elevated. Nothing but vocals through the mains except a touch of kick drum. There was anywhere from 75 - 100 people there at any one time, which is a factor. This size bar with 20 people in it you could play without a sweat with 100 watts. But the more people there are the more the guitarist has to crank and vocals have to come up, especially if you're not elevated and you're blowing right into people.
This was the new band's first gig. We're 3 piece for now, a classic-rock deal with stuff ranging from Police to Dwight Yoakum to Led Zeppelin. Guitar player plays Telecasters through a '72 100 watt Twin. We're seasoned players so we don't try to blow people's heads off, but the drummer is very powerful so it's definitely not meek.
The basses were a passive G&L L-1000 with GHS Bright Flats, and a passive Jack Casady Epiphone with roundwounds.
Finally regarding my style and what I expect from a rig, I think the biggest compliment someone could pay my playing would be to call it bombastic. I didn't get the nickname Freight Train by hiding behind the drums. I currently use no pedals or fx other than the 100T's overdrive occasionally, and don't plan to add any, especially not a compressor. I've always molded my bands around bass and drums carrying the load, and everything else playing as sparse and with as many holes as possible. I don't do any slapping/tapping stuff currently except for two sections on one song, So upfront grunt and punch is what I need.
The last time I played live, which was nearly 20 years ago, I had dual Hartke 410XL's with a GK 800RB. Maybe dissed these days, but in its day it helped set the standards of the modern aggressive bass sound. The Bassman 100T with a single 410 neo had so much more punch, headroom and clarity than that rig it's not even worth talking about. Having played amplified bass since around 1965/66, I've never had a rig sound like this. It gives you the impression of unlimited headroom.
I play sort of stream of consciousness, so I'm prone to whank on it with a thump or chord punch at any time, and I couldn't believe how the rig barks it right out with total authority. I had switched to the Epiphone/roundwounds on a few songs the first set, which I used on the active channel and was able to use the overdrive pretty heavy on one song, and it sounds great. But the G&L in single coil position through the vintage channel was such magic I settled in on that and had no desire to change anything except switching to single coil w/bass boost position a couple of times. The vintage channel/G&L tone stack I had set at 6-6-6 with channel volume on 6. On the active channel/Epiphone I had bass boosted just slightly, mids peaked just slightly probably around 2k or so, and highs rolled off a bit. Channel volume on 6. On the overdrive song I had overdrive on 8 and blend on 5, and the overdrive is sweet, crunchy and punchy. The 410 neo's tweeter level was at 11:00. I started the night on 5 on the master volume, and it eventually got to 6 when the crowd peaked. I had a lot of compliments on my sound, embarrassingly so eventually, and had a few people tell me at our loudest they were feeling the bottom in their chest when I punched.
The 100T didn't seem to stress over all this in the least. It really didn't seem to get much hotter than it does at rehearsal in the drummer's living room. I didn't look but I'm sure the fan came on, but after 3 sets it was no hotter than you'd expect a tube amp to be. I never got anything close to speaker breakup. The chord punches I would do gave the impression of clean, but it had that tube grease on it so it wasn't abrasive or piercing, and again they were crazy dynamic. I don't know how much louder the rig could have gone - it gives the impression it can give all you can take. But I seriously don't see much need to ever play much louder than I had it since at any place much larger I'd usually have mains help. What I'm really interested in next time we play this place or similar is seeing what happens in 25 watt mode. Should be some interesting power tube grind if it doesn't just suddenly jump into distortion.
Anyway, blah blah woof woof, this is a fantastic rig and the only reason I can think of me personally wanting one of the larger cabs or stacked 410's is for the look onstage, and I got over that 20 years ago. Plus what looks better than the 100T/410 neo? (Or 610, Tim.)
The gig was a rousing success btw and the bar is clamoring to lock us in for New Year's Eve.
(Added 5/20/12) After looking over this I realized I made it sound like I''m ham-fisted. That's not the case at all. We're a dynamic band. There are a couple of songs that play softly with thumb and the rig stays really clear, focused and present when you're using a light touch.
That's great. When I first started reading your post I thought you were going to say that it couldn't handle that size room
But it sounds like it handled the gig with ease.
Freight Train said:
But it sounds like it handled the gig with ease.
Great review thanks, Freight Train. Delighted to hear the 410 performs so well - if you ever needed more grunt you could just add another I suppose. I think if a 410 cab had been here when I bought my 610 I would seriously have considered it. My gut tells me that the main sellers in this new line for Fender will be the 100T and the 410 and 610 cabs. Why? Because most of us do not need 300 tube watts or the added weight and size that goes with it, and one or two 410s or one 610 should do just about any gig. Plus, as someone else pointed out, what other 100 watt tube amp is available on the market and there are a few other 300 watt heads.
This is not putting down the Super 300 which is awesome, just that the 100T does so much more and goes so much louder than I would expect from a "little" 100 watt head. It also does cop that vintage Fender tone so much better than I can remember the original "vintage " amps doing it - and the icing on the cake is that it seems to have much more headroom than the originals. I would be interested to know whether the power amplifier circuit has changed much from the original all tube Bassman 100 - it certainly feels that way.
This is not putting down the Super 300 which is awesome, just that the 100T does so much more and goes so much louder than I would expect from a "little" 100 watt head. It also does cop that vintage Fender tone so much better than I can remember the original "vintage " amps doing it - and the icing on the cake is that it seems to have much more headroom than the originals. I would be interested to know whether the power amplifier circuit has changed much from the original all tube Bassman 100 - it certainly feels that way.
I totally agree. I was so worried about 'only' 100 watts and 'only' one 4x10 cab. I haven't played through a rig that small since before I got my my first 200 watt 4x15 Kustom rig, which I was 14 years old. The thing about a lower wattage tube amp, if it's designed properly, is its ability to deliver instantaneous power, well beyond what a solid state amp of maybe 3 times the power could do. And if the cab can reproduce that it's an amazing punch (especially with flat wounds). Like I said, this rig punches harder than my GK 800RB with 2 410XL's did, and who knows what that thing really is but I would say at least 400 watts into 4 ohms maybe? Anyway, much more than 100 watts for sure.
So that was all my worry - I knew a well designed tube amp with a proper cab could do it, I just didn't know if the 100T/410 neo was that. And the sensitivity thing worried me. But it turned out to be everything I'd hoped for and more.
Congrats Freight Train - I see you have also posted the first offical online review on the Sweetwater site. Spread the word 
I replaced all the tubes in mine after the first week (it took 4 days to get them or it would have been sooner). I have never heard a amp with that much noise. I used JJ's in the pre & TAD's in the power section. It is dead silent now. I can get a lot more clean volume too.
I would suggest pulling the GT's out of these amps as soon as you can to get all the performance out of this great amp.
That recording sounds Great!
I would suggest pulling the GT's out of these amps as soon as you can to get all the performance out of this great amp.
That recording sounds Great!
So, how much, on average, does one need to spend on tubes, just to get the 100T to sound like it should have from Fender, in the first place? :scowl:
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