The latency is less than moving your head two feet from a speaker.
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The Great Bass Preamp/DI Comparison
- Thread starter chadhargis
- Start date
Thanks, I won't argue that. Though it seems noticeable, placebo may be a factor. Digital artifacts, however, are real and noted (and recorded) by many.
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My experience has been completely the opposite. I was running top notch analog gear. Oracle tube pre, LA-1A tube compressor, RNDI DI and when I did the A/B test recorded simultaneously into separate channels on my mixer I liked the Pod Go better. I liked it so much better I sold my entire analog board. It's not "almost as good", it crushed it in my opinion.
Must of that "crushing" came from the fact that the Pod Go has so much flexibility, especially around EQ. I dialed up an EQ that allowed me to adjust the exact frequency I wanted, with the exact Q width....the Oracle just couldn't do that. Add to that the ability to mimic famous tones. Want an SVT? Dial it up! Want a B15? Dial it up! Want an Acoustic? Dial it up!. What if you want that SansAmp tone? Dial that up! What if you want a Darkglass B7K for some good metal tone? Dial it up! It's all in there.
Then there is the fact that I no longer have to lug a 28lb pedal board or worry about bumping knobs. None of the knobs, other than the volume knob, on the Pod Go change anything when the unit is off. I run the volume all the way up, so it's easy to see if it's been moved. I also don't have to worry about patch cables or power cables coming loose or getting a short in them. Don't have to worry about noise either.
As an added bonus, I can move my effects anywhere in the chain. I can change parameters on the fly with the press of a foot switch. The tuner is also very good.
For me, it's just a win all around. I can't think of a single thing my old analog board gave me that the Pod Go doesn't other than perhaps "cool factor". The tubes did look cool.
I do still have my budget baby board as a backup which has the NuX pre on it. Even that "budget" board is far more expensive than the Pod Go.
Googling "Pod Go" now...
Great... now I have research the diff between this and the stomp...
<rabbit hole mode engaged>
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I am sure if you take the time, you can get really close - even better - depending on who's listening. It's so abstract, right? I guess in my case once I had it "dialed in" for compressor and DI I'd be set. Any effects would be "gravy" as it were. Maybe I'm just listening with my eyes. The REDDI. The Empress. Both cool pieces. Sound and look awesome. That said...
it's hard to ignore the number of people who seem to really love their Stomp or Pod Go or Helix or whatever. I guess I like that it takes nothing for me to get a good tone with my REDDI/Empress combo. I copied @scubaduba's settings for the Empress and it sounds awesome. How long would it take me to get that tweaking a Pod or Stomp or whatever? Not being sarcastic at all. I really wonder as I can't always figure out how to post on Instagram without my daughters help.
I'm still in the honeymoon phase, but "Yuppers". Sold an Alix with an Empress BC and some other cool high end stuff.
Oh....You can set it up so the Volume knob won't effect (affect?) the balanced out. That's what I did. NO knobs to get messed up!
I went with the Stomp as it's small. And I don't need, or even know what I'd do with, an expression pedal. Look for demo or B stock. Got mine for $530-ish with all the literature, warranty, etc etc, shipped to my door. Just a FYI.
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jacoby75
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I just can't believe that a digital processor sounds as good as quality analog gear. Maybe you can get some great simmed tones, but I have to think that there is a power, presence and oomph to quality analog gear that digital stuff just can't replicate. It's kind of like the difference between the Broughton Silver Deluxe and the SSDI (I know I'm technically in the wrong thread for this example, but here we are). The SD is a great little pedal. Very amplike, warm and punchy. But it pales in comparison to the SSDI. The SSDI adds a weight and heft to each note, which I have to believe is due to the shear tonnage of iron that is in it. Like, even after you turn it off, tone keeps oozing out of it for a while. I'd be hard pressed to find that kind of tone and oomph from a digital unit. Not that they can't sound good. But it would always be a mere shadow, an imitation of the real thing.
. . . Spoken as one whose last digital experience was a Zoom MS60-B. Not one of these good higher-end ones.
. . . Spoken as one whose last digital experience was a Zoom MS60-B. Not one of these good higher-end ones.
I understand the hesitation to believe...
But as a little digital vs analog thought experiment: When you record your fat and beautiful analog bass sound to a DAW and play it back, does it still sound fat beautiful and analog? If not, we should all give up because that's the only way it will ever be heard (except when you play live of course).
If the digital recording sounds good, realize that there is no real difference between playing back a digital recording and simulating or synthesizing that same sound. That simulation or synthesis would include the "warmth" and "weight". The jury is still out on whether it's currently "just as good" as analog. But it's SO much closer than it was just a few years ago. So a few years from now, the jury will probably be back with a "just as good" verdict, for most of us anyway.
I think a lot of the confusion comes from the excessive flexibility of simulation. If you turn on a tube amp, it sounds like a tube amp, and by definition it will, no matter what settings you use. If you boot up a simulation, it can sound like anything, including (maybe) a tube amp. So you have to dial up the parameters that make a good tube amp sound. If you don't do that, it's the equivalent of complaining that an SVT has no mids, because you didn't realize you could simply turn the Ultra-Lo switch off.
jacoby75
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As the analysis of "How and why does ____ sounds good?" it is just a matter of quantifying the answer... The same thing happened with the use of automation in the guitar/bass building industry so that now we have reliably better low cost instruments that are asymptotically approaching higher end quality without having to do all the voodoo...
jacoby75
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And I suppose (for me, at least) the question then becomes is the several hundred to thousands of dollars in difference worth that little bit of subjective, difficult-to-define, intangible "tone magic" or "heft" that might be present in a high-end analog board vs a more affordable, able-to-do-a-lot-more digital board or multi effect? When it comes to the fun of playing live, maybe. But that's a question we must all answer for ourselves.
I probably have at least $2,500 in my big board right now (much of that is due to a $700 Broughton pre.) But it sounds sooooo good, and does more than enough for me. If I could sell it all, buy a Line6 of some kind for $500-$1,700, and pocket the rest, is it worth it? Maybe. Maybe not. Those digital processors do a bajillion things that I would never need. And it would take way longer to program in a a good patch vs just looking at my board and turning knobs. But I have heard some samples of Helix patches that do sound pretty good. And the argument about everything being or winding up digital these days certainly rings true. That and the fact that a Helix would probably weigh one 20th of what my board currently weighs and would be way (weigh) easier to transport.
It's six of one, half dozen of the other, I suppose. Or $2,500 of one, $1,700 of another, as the case may be.
I probably have at least $2,500 in my big board right now (much of that is due to a $700 Broughton pre.) But it sounds sooooo good, and does more than enough for me. If I could sell it all, buy a Line6 of some kind for $500-$1,700, and pocket the rest, is it worth it? Maybe. Maybe not. Those digital processors do a bajillion things that I would never need. And it would take way longer to program in a a good patch vs just looking at my board and turning knobs. But I have heard some samples of Helix patches that do sound pretty good. And the argument about everything being or winding up digital these days certainly rings true. That and the fact that a Helix would probably weigh one 20th of what my board currently weighs and would be way (weigh) easier to transport.
It's six of one, half dozen of the other, I suppose. Or $2,500 of one, $1,700 of another, as the case may be.
Yeah, I get it. I really do. I’m a newbie with the fancy schmancy stuff. Part of my liking the Stomp is.....It can do soooo freakin’ much for a relatively small price. I added a TI Box just ‘cause I’m old school and “needed a real DI”. But in all honesty I didn’t need to.
I don’t think us new converts are trying to convince anybody of anything. At least I’m not. I’m just amazed at how good this stuff sounds. (Heck, another 5 years it’ll be that much better!)
jacoby75
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And I'm certainly not trying to convince anyone that digital is inferior or less-than. To each their own. Like I said, I haven't tried any of the good stuff, digitally speaking. I'm getting too old for that stuff. But I have seen a number of people who add things to their digital boards. Like a better compressor, or tube warmer like an Edison in the effects loop, or good DI or something. Which would indicate to me that something is lacking in the digital stuff for those of us old souls who enjoy the vintage warmth thing. I'm one of those fools who believes vinyl sounds better that CD. But I still might try it some day. Just for kicks.
For the very brief time that I did have the Zoom MS-60B, there were some really great tones to be had out of it. I really liked the SVT setting, as well as some of the compressors. It's definitely not all bad. And I'm about to add a digital cab IR loader to my board (which may or may not last), so I'm definitely no purist.
For the very brief time that I did have the Zoom MS-60B, there were some really great tones to be had out of it. I really liked the SVT setting, as well as some of the compressors. It's definitely not all bad. And I'm about to add a digital cab IR loader to my board (which may or may not last), so I'm definitely no purist.
I think the pod go is a awesome candidate for a B/ practice quick grab and go rig and I may be picking one up down the road I'm currently using a headrush gigboard for that purpose but I wouldn't mind staying with helix sounds as I'm already using a hx fx on my main board.
I personally like to use a combination of tubes + digital to get the most authentic (to my ears) sound out of that setup. When I use the Stomp, I usually use either an LA-1A or MB Compressore in front to add some tube warmth and heft to it. Is it necessary? Probably not. I've used the Stomp alone on numerous occasions and it sounds fantastic, but I just like the extra ooomph that tubes add to the amp models. To my ears, it just pushes it even further into that more authentic territory of a B15 or SVT. If I can cop that tone without hauling around 200+ lbs. of expensive gear, I'm all for it. Power supply + tube comp. + Stomp + various FX as needed + Quilter BB800 all fit on my board and weighs ~20 lbs. That's a pretty easy schlep for me to have that much variety at my fingertips.
I feel like that with my REDDI as well. 14" and 10+ pounds of tubes, iron and transformer. That has to account for something, right?
This. I only have about $1,300 (got my REDDI before the price went up $200) in my "board" as the REDDI is separate, but I think we have similar thoughts.
Right. Do what you do. The Stomp (or now Stomp +) does EVERYTHING. I even have the 1/4" TRS - Male XLR cable from when I used an LA-1A Compressor as my DI. But if it sounds bad at the gig, how long will it take me to "fix" it? I suppose like anything the more you do it the better you become.
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I'm with you at least on the versatility aspect - that's a large part of why I'm keeping the Stomp around. It can do what 100 or more pedals can do, though not all at the same time (the Stomp especially is still somewhat DSP constrained). I have no more need or desire for a chorus, reverb, delay, looper, filter, pitch shifter, the list grows. And the Sansamp is spot-on.
But no amount of tweaking that my (admittedly novice) hands have done have gotten the SVT sim in the Stomp to sound as good as my Super 300 (or the Broughton SV-Pre I had before it). Likewise with any comp in the Stomp vs. my Empress. It's that learning curve that makes me hesitant. I have no shame in admitting that I lack either the technical skill or the patience (or both) to master the tweaking necessary to get it to sound exactly the way I want, even after using others' presets as a starting point.
If you and others have arrived, consider yourselves blessed. And sell me your Oracle.
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