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The Physics of "mwah"?
- Thread starter fretlessman71
- Start date
It *is* about envelope filters - completely mechanical, but that's essentially what it is.
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lol well the op did ask for a math approach
okcrum
in your chest
Here's what a plucked string looks like in slow motion:
There's a wave that reflects off the nut and saddle, which is the note you hear. On fingered, fretted instruments, the reflection is off the fret and is nice and sharp. On fretless, the wave reflection is smeared by hitting the junction of your finger and the fingerboard. That smear, along with the bit of buzz (also smeared) from the string contacting the board is what we hear as mwah.
The math is nontrivial even before you get to the fretless part....
There's a wave that reflects off the nut and saddle, which is the note you hear. On fingered, fretted instruments, the reflection is off the fret and is nice and sharp. On fretless, the wave reflection is smeared by hitting the junction of your finger and the fingerboard. That smear, along with the bit of buzz (also smeared) from the string contacting the board is what we hear as mwah.
The math is nontrivial even before you get to the fretless part....
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Because the end conditions on the string are very different, you get a lot of second harmonic (an octave up) that's generated. On a fretted bass, you get harmonics at the beginning of a note, and they decay faster than the fundamental. With fretless, the harmonics hang on longer - what we call mwah.
Low action, round wounds, and an epoxied or ebonol board, and...mwah away.
Low action, round wounds, and an epoxied or ebonol board, and...mwah away.
It's buzz you control with both hands, probably more with the right hand than the left hand.
The physics is wire slapping wood at the rate equal to the vibration frequency of the wire.
The physics is wire slapping wood at the rate equal to the vibration frequency of the wire.
D
Deleted member 165050
Guest
+1
Low action, lower tension strings, slow vibrato. All this makes a very light non-damping contact between part of the vibrating string and the fingerboard. Now what you need is someone to model it.
I used to play fretless exclusively, as a Jaco clone but quit a decade ago. I dont know what makes mwah, but rotosounds does it while eating away the fingerboard.
My Zon Sonus with carbon fiber neck and round wounds (Lo Riders) gave all the mwah I needed and more.
I took lessons from a pro jazz fretless player who bought cheap basses and brushed on multiple coats of varathane. Amazing amount of mwah. Sadly, he passed from leukemia at an early age.
My Zon Sonus with carbon fiber neck and round wounds (Lo Riders) gave all the mwah I needed and more.
I took lessons from a pro jazz fretless player who bought cheap basses and brushed on multiple coats of varathane. Amazing amount of mwah. Sadly, he passed from leukemia at an early age.
Yeah, i remember a video where Jeff Berlin said his signature bass has a sound similar to fretless because it has wide frets
Thanks for posting this video. I had read the description of the vibration of plucked string in a book of science about violin-type string instruments (IIRC they called it Helmholtz vibration), and this video demonstrates it just like they explained it. Very interesting...
Burp.
Excuse me.
You know, if nothing else, Jaco had the mwa thing nailed. He also had those unearthly pinched harmonic ghost notes down to a proverbial science.
That's all I had to say.
Excuse me.
You know, if nothing else, Jaco had the mwa thing nailed. He also had those unearthly pinched harmonic ghost notes down to a proverbial science.
That's all I had to say.
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Simply put, "mwah" is the sound of the fingerboard interfering with the motion of the string.
Best "mwah" I ever got was on my NS CR4M with flats with low action. Another good one was my DIY Warmoth fretless "upright" also with flats and low action...
Best "mwah" I ever got was on my NS CR4M with flats with low action. Another good one was my DIY Warmoth fretless "upright" also with flats and low action...
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I had a CR4M for a while that I had TI Spirocore Weichs on. Sounded just like one of my ZON fretless basses but was a lot more trouble to cart around and set up..................
D
Deleted member 165050
Guest
I had a CR5M which I put Helicores on, really great mwah sound that seemed to sustain forever. On both my FBGs I have La Bella LTFs which also get that sound.
Interesting you mention Weichs, I've found lighter, more flexible strings are more mwah-tastic.
OK, I am a physicist, here is what I "think" is happening:
1) When you first plug a sting it vibrates more or less parallel to the fret(less)board, as seen on the high speed video earlier. The initial plucking creates a lot of overtones that give the percussive attack of when plucking. This dies off really quick and the sound becomes mellow. (the "m" in the "mwhah" )
2) After some time the string starts to vibrate more circular - so , every time the string vibrates back and forth it increases the amount of up - and down movement
3) At one point the up-and down movement will start to hit he wood of the board. This drastically increases the overtones created and the note seems to swell in volume (it actually does not - it just seem so because our ear is more sensitive to the overtones, so with more overtones is seems louder). - the "wha" in the mwah
4) The string hitting the board takes a lot of energy out of the string really quick, so the overtone spectrum dies off quickly when the string does not vibrate enough to hit the board (the "ah" part in "mwah" )
So, to get the "mwah" right you need just the right string spacing that the initial note is "clean" and starts to hit the fredboard after a few 10s of ms. Too low you just get "whah", too high you just get "m".
1) When you first plug a sting it vibrates more or less parallel to the fret(less)board, as seen on the high speed video earlier. The initial plucking creates a lot of overtones that give the percussive attack of when plucking. This dies off really quick and the sound becomes mellow. (the "m" in the "mwhah" )
2) After some time the string starts to vibrate more circular - so , every time the string vibrates back and forth it increases the amount of up - and down movement
3) At one point the up-and down movement will start to hit he wood of the board. This drastically increases the overtones created and the note seems to swell in volume (it actually does not - it just seem so because our ear is more sensitive to the overtones, so with more overtones is seems louder). - the "wha" in the mwah
4) The string hitting the board takes a lot of energy out of the string really quick, so the overtone spectrum dies off quickly when the string does not vibrate enough to hit the board (the "ah" part in "mwah" )
So, to get the "mwah" right you need just the right string spacing that the initial note is "clean" and starts to hit the fredboard after a few 10s of ms. Too low you just get "whah", too high you just get "m".
