Double Bass Thompson Hybrid neck broken

[josiah goldfish]

It's not a particularly hard repair, though I've never done it on a bass. All that glue needs cleaning out then, if the fit at the sides is tight, chalk fit it and use a chisel til it connects everywhere. If it's loose, shim it and do the same thing. Then, with hide glue, glue both surfaces and reinsert the neck with a clamp to hold it against the button.

Most luthiers shouldn't charge much for this. Doesn't take long on a violin or cello, so I assume a double bass isn't that much harder.

 

[powerbass]

I have a Thompson RM200 (hybrid) built 2008, so far so good on the neck joint. This is the first TB report to my knowledge of a structural issue w/a Thompson. I have no idea how many have been sold or if this is a serial problem or not. One bad apple does not spoil the whole bunch - or something like that. As Arnold points out these basses are a good/excellent value for the beginner/student market. Instead of gluing the neck back on I wonder if it is feasible to make it a bolt on/removable neck?

 

[josiah goldfish]

I have a Thompson RM200 (hybrid) built 2008, so far so good on the neck joint. This is the first TB report to my knowledge of a structural issue w/a Thompson. I have no idea how many have been sold or if this is a serial problem or not. One bad apple does not spoil the whole bunch - or something like that. As Arnold points out these basses are a good/excellent value for the beginner/student market. Instead of gluing the neck back on I wonder if it is feasible to make it a bolt on/removable neck?

Good idea, though the neck mortise would still need working on. Personally, I don't think a removable neck is a necessity on a school bass, but you never know! My bass used to be a school bass, and it's the best bass tone I've ever heard!

 

[Jake deVilliers]

It's not a particularly hard repair, though I've never done it on a bass. All that glue needs cleaning out then, if the fit at the sides is tight, chalk fit it and use a chisel til it connects everywhere. If it's loose, shim it and do the same thing. Then, with hide glue, glue both surfaces and reinsert the neck with a clamp to hold it against the button.

Most luthiers shouldn't charge much for this. Doesn't take long on a violin or cello, so I assume a double bass isn't that much harder.

Mr. Goldfish, if that's your name, maybe you should fit a bass neck before you go around telling folks how quick and easy it is!

 

[hhalt]

I have a Thompson RM200 (hybrid) built 2008, so far so good on the neck joint. This is the first TB report to my knowledge of a structural issue w/a Thompson. I have no idea how many have been sold or if this is a serial problem or not. One bad apple does not spoil the whole bunch - or something like that. As Arnold points out these basses are a good/excellent value for the beginner/student market. Instead of gluing the neck back on I wonder if it is feasible to make it a bolt on/removable neck?

This was the answer I was looking for when originally posting. Because Reno is so dry, I think it amplifies any potential weakness in the neck joint. This, along with the fact that it is a school bass, is the reason the warranty is not valid. The school has no problem paying for the relatively inexpensive repair.

I like these basses so much, I bought one myself. Even if I have to pay for a repair down the road, I still think they are a good value. In fact I used it on a recent performance with Avishai Cohen at the Reno Jazz Festival and got some positive comments on the sound of the bass.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Mr. Goldfish, if that's your name, maybe you should fit a bass neck before you go around telling folks how quick and easy it is!

Pull up a chair and watch for the next few hours. It takes time to get it right.

 

[josiah goldfish]

Mr. Goldfish, if that's your name, maybe you should fit a bass neck before you go around telling folks how quick and easy it is!

As I said, I've never done a bass neck, but I have done cello and violin necks (never a viola though, oddly enough haha). Apparently it's not as comparable as I thought! My apologies, I didn't realise it was significantly more difficult! Come to think of it, I guess a bass neck is significantly bigger than a cello's. I can imagine it would be really quite time consuming!

It's Goldsmith, not Goldfish. Goldfish is a screen name, I used to get nicknamed it so I just chose it as a random user name.

 

[fdeck]

I'm not a luthier, but it seems to me that the neck joint and shoulder are the achilles heel of student basses. If you go into a middle school music room, half of the basses will have been sidelined due to these problems, and the other half have been repaired. I wonder if the neck joint is at the root of both issues, since a good neck joint should reinforce the shoulder of the neck. Luthiers, do you typically find poor neck joints when you repair a bass with a cracked shoulder?

I wonder if a compromise might be to import student grade basses with the neck detached, and join it as part of the typical setup work. It would involve more effort of course, but might be more profitable by reducing warranty repairs.

 

[Eric Hochberg]

I wonder if a compromise might be to import student grade basses with the neck detached, and join it as part of the typical setup work. It would involve more effort of course, but might be more profitable by reducing warranty repairs.

The importers of these basses should also insist that hide glue be the only adhesive used in the construction of their basses, at least if they wish to be thought of as reputable…

 

[hhalt]

One reason I like the String Emporium is that they remove the tops of their higher end basses (not the hybrid), for up to a year (I think) and let them adjust to the drier humidity before reassembling.

I do want to point out that it is very possible that both of the basses in question could have been bumped or dropped. The low humidity, weak neck joints, and accidents, all increase the odds of something bad happening!

 

[robobass]

School basses are going to get bumped. No avoiding it. Perhaps the necks should be attached with some kind of spring fastener which can absorb shock I do like the idea of importing ccbs with the necks off.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

I mean, if the actual cost of the bass is COST OF BASS + COST OF NECK REPAIR, isn't that close to a low end Shen anyway?

 

[BrettBelanger]

I mean, if the actual cost of the bass is COST OF BASS + COST OF NECK REPAIR, isn't that close to a low end Shen anyway?

Certainly a used Shen I would think

 

[drurb]

What I'd like to know from the experts here is their assessment of how common are problems with neck joints (or other aspects of the build) among the Chinese instruments that are not usually considered to be CCBs (e.g., Shen, Thompson, Christopher, etc.). hhalt reported that two relatively new Thompsons suffered neck separations. It's not clear whether either of those basses suffered any abuse. In any case, those with expertise in such matters seem to agree that the pictures hhalt posted reveal a problem with the build on that particular bass. Perhaps that bass and the other on which the neck failed suffered from a transient lapse in quality control. It would seem unfair to make generalizations about the brand based only on those two instances. That's why I'd like to hear from experts regarding how common such underlying problems may or may not be. Given what hhalt's pictures apparently reveal, what seems important is how the seller/maker chooses to address any quality-control issues. Once the apparent defect was revealed as a likely contributing factor to the neck separation, I would hope that the seller would support the buyer and stand behind the product regardless of whether it was used in a school setting. I certainly hope that the seller was given a fair opportunity to do that.

 

[Mark Carlsen]

One reason I like the String Emporium is that they remove the tops of their higher end basses (not the hybrid), for up to a year (I think) and let them adjust to the drier humidity before reassembling.

I do want to point out that it is very possible that both of the basses in question could have been bumped or dropped. The low humidity, weak neck joints, and accidents, all increase the odds of something bad happening!

Judging this particular senerio the photo's reveal a glue starved joint. There is no way to know what happened the day this neck was set at the factory in China. " Ah, it's Friday and I have 4 more necks to set but I have very little glue left, maybe enough for one bass... My boss wants the work done today, I have to meet my quota for the week " What to do ??? You get the picture..... I sell Shen's and Christopher's and have no control of what goes on half way around the world. Its to bad, but this is the asian market in the 21st century.

 

[drurb]

Judging this particular senerio the photo's reveal a glue starved joint. There is no way to know what happened the day this neck was set at the factory in China. " Ah, it's Friday and I have 4 more necks to set but I have very little glue left, maybe enough for one bass... My boss wants the work done today, I have to meet my quota for the week " What to do ??? You get the picture..... I sell Shen's and Christopher's and have no control of what goes on half way around the world. Its to bad, but this is the asian market in the 21st century.

Yes, indeed, but, in your experience, how common are such issues?

 

[hhalt]

What I'd like to know from the experts here is their assessment of how common are problems with neck joints (or other aspects of the build) among the Chinese instruments that are not usually considered to be CCBs (e.g., Shen, Thompson, Christopher, etc.). hhalt reported that two relatively new Thompsons suffered neck separations. It's not clear whether either of those basses suffered any abuse. In any case, those with expertise in such matters seem to agree that the pictures hhalt posted reveal a problem with the build on that particular bass. Perhaps that bass and the other on which the neck failed suffered from a transient lapse in quality control. It would seem unfair to make generalizations about the brand based only on those two instances. That's why I'd like to hear from experts regarding how common such underlying problems may or may not be. Given what hhalt's pictures apparently reveal, what seems important is how the seller/maker chooses to address any quality-control issues. Once the apparent defect was revealed as a likely contributing factor to the neck separation, I would hope that the seller would support the buyer and stand behind the product regardless of whether it was used in a school setting. I certainly hope that the seller was given a fair opportunity to do that.

The photos posted here are from a bass that we had for less then two months. My student's bass-same model- broke after two years (very well could have been bumped, since there was more damage to the top. My luthier will be fixing that bass first. I'll post some pic's of that bass' break soon. I am curious to see how similar the glue joint looks to the one I posted on this thread.

 

[Eric Hochberg]

I sell Shen's and Christopher's and have no control of what goes on half way around the world. Its to bad, but this is the asian market in the 21st century.

What is your experience with their construction and any problems after the sale?

 

[Mark Carlsen]

Hi Guys.... Thanks for you're reply's. I would say in the most part the Shen and Christopher line of basses are good value and fairly consistent, but there is always a chance that one slips through the cracks. This may be the one w. the bad neck set, poor quality ebony FB, sloppy finish work, funky endpin, etc. It sometimes is hit or miss, but when I complain the company's are good about making things right. I have been playing a Shen SB-150 for almost 9 years and it is a wonderful jazz bass. Most of what I deal with is the low end stuff and I like what is being done for the most part.

 

[hhalt]

Thanks for putting things in perspective, Upton. As I've said, the Thompson hybrid is a lot of bass for the money. Really good fingerboard, tuners, top, and it sounds good. It does make me question whether I want to continue supporting Chinese slave labor though!

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