Thunderbird Club

[GonePlaid]

He must be a bass guitarist then.

Along that line, I rehearsed with a big band Thursday night. One of the arrangements had 2 charts:1 for bass; and 1 for "bass guitar"-written in treble clef(same line). WT7! I've never seen that b4 and I've been playing with big bands and reading charts for over 40 years.

 

[MCF]

Well, I might as well mash all that up right here. Just finished putting this madness together. Time to spend the day with it. No back moaning, yes, the multiple gain stage police will be after me.
And no exhausting paragraphs about signal chains.

View attachment 3342346

That looks plenty powerful. What’s a signal chain?

 

[Nocturnal]

A few steps of removal from knowing your output - have a trusted friend in the audience help give you feedback on your presence in the mix.

Actually my good friend and fellow Bird player will be in attendance. Hopefully he can help if needed.

My vote is VP all the way! It never sounds thin. Do you use pedals?

I have some pedals but they tend to be overdrive/distortion and that really won't fit this set list. I do have the Tech21 VT deluxe pedal that I could take with me for flavor if needed.

My thought about the combo amp is to offer it, not demand it, in case it would make things easier 'for the soundman' (nudge,nudge)

I would take my small Ampeg combo but it is at the other bands guitarists house and he will not be home today. I would feel better with it but this whole thing is a one-off show with maybe a possibility of a couple future dates, but not likely. I will just go for it and hope for the best.

 

[Chucky Stiletti]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

IMO he was being shortsighted and only responding from a how a string sounds perspective..
there's way more to it than that....tension, overall feel, how long they last, are they abrasive to the instrument/fingers....price....look...and on and on...

 

[Count Bassie]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

Perspective...

 

[GonePlaid]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

Wait. You want me to think? Oy! OK. I put on the strings that will give me the sound(s) I want from my rig. IF it's going into a PA and/or being diddled by a sound guy(which rarely happens with our band), I can't control any of that. At least it starts out how I'd like it to be. After that?

 

[Count Bassie]

Wait. You want me to think? Oy! OK. I put on the strings that will give me the sound(s) I want from my rig. IF it's going into a PA and/or being diddled by a sound guy(which rarely happens with our band), I can't control any of that. At least it starts out how I'd like it to be. After that?

Same as any other element, yes.

Get the strings you like to hear through your rig at rehearsal, and the ones that feel good, that you like. Be inspired, the world will do something with it...

 

[JJR58]

What’s a signal chain?

Only explanation i can come up with is when jeff does ridiculous stuff with his rigs.
Current one in question.

 

[Engle]

Funny you would mention that.....played a gig last night, gave the windmill thing another shot and got a similar result..stupid is a stupid does....

The best art involves some suffering...

 

[Miles_ONeal]

Actually my good friend and fellow Bird player will be in attendance. Hopefully he can help if needed.



I have some pedals but they tend to be overdrive/distortion and that really won't fit this set list. I do have the Tech21 VT deluxe pedal that I could take with me for flavor if needed.



I would take my small Ampeg combo but it is at the other bands guitarists house and he will not be home today. I would feel better with it but this whole thing is a one-off show with maybe a possibility of a couple future dates, but not likely. I will just go for it and hope for the best.

Hopefully they have a preamp/di on stage. Problem more or less solved. We have a Sans Amp that stays on stage at church. I bought an MXR to have elsewhere if needed.

 

[Engle]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

I was watching a classic rock band at an outdoor stage last summer. The bassist was playing a Mustang with a pick and it sounded like he had Chromes. I went up after the set, complimented his tone (couldn’t compliment the playing...), and asked if he had Chromes on it. He did.
At least some of the time, your tone will be perceptible in the FOH. I think it’s worth getting a sound you like.

 

[Engle]

Along that line, I rehearsed with a big band Thursday night. One of the arrangements had 2 charts:1 for bass; and 1 for "bass guitar"-written in treble clef(same line). WT7! I've never seen that b4 and I've been playing with big bands and reading charts for over 40 years.

Lazy arranger

 

[fasterpussycat]

+1- this or a pre (pedal) with controls to boost and shape (I use the MXR d.i.+)

This is precisely what my Darkglass Vintage Ultra does so well -- EQ and blendable amp-like overdrive with an xlr out. Lots of people are mad for cab sims (either built in or as a separate box) but the L/HPF covers that.

 

[fasterpussycat]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

I used to practice a lot through my PreSonus interface, with headphones plugged into the headphone socket. The sound is completely different (bright and harsh) to the same signal monitored from the DAW/headphone out on the Mac (full and deep). I learned my lesson and stopped doing it. Now I use my amp at low volume (sounds much like the DAW) or practice silently.

In a live setting, once the signal has been processed multiple times, you may notice a difference between particularly zingy stainless steel rounds, nickels and flats if the bass is soloed, but if there's a lot of other higher frequency audio information flying around, those distinctions would tend to be lost. Also no one who isn't a bass player would likely notice.

Ultimately string (and bass, amp and the rest) choice is more to do with us being happy in ourselves -- and how we want to be perceived -- and therefore giving a better performance than about thrilling the audience.

That's my €1 anyway.

 

[Gaolee]

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

The man you were talking to had a valid point. Most people in the audience aren't all that sophisticated when it comes to bass sound. As long as there's something thumping away in the low frequency, they aren't all that critical. Even non-bass players don't always notice the nuances, although it's good when a guitarists says the one I'm playing today is just rude. So, maybe they notice but don't really care all that much.

When you are recording, it's a little different issue. There's also the fact that the sound has to fit with whatever it is you are playing. You wouldn't want to use a grinding, distorted sound when you are playing Monk tunes, unless you were doing some kind of radical remake. Dead flats would sound absurd for metal unless you were doing something odd with it.

I know what I like to hear, and I also generally play without FOH support. Which means strings make a big difference to me, along with everything else. Whether anybody else cares or not is irrelevant.

[edit] FP already said the same thing - never mind.

 

[fasterpussycat]

While I am standing at the lectern, imparting pearls-beyond-price of wisdom.

One thing I have noticed since I started playing with lasses -- no one gives a rat's arse what bass, or pedals or amp you use, they only care about what you play and whether it sounds any good. It's not that they don't know about gear (they all seem to like Vox, Orange and vintage Marshall) and there's plenty of GAS going around, but they do know there's more than one path to musical enlightenment.

 

[dukeorock]

Well, I might as well mash all that up right here. Just finished putting this madness together. Time to spend the day with it. No back moaning, yes, the multiple gain stage police will be after me.
And no exhausting paragraphs about signal chains.

View attachment 3342346

There’s a multiple gain stage police?! I’m screwed, then.

Tonight I will be playing a 30 min set in a power pop trio. The "backline" is provided but what that means is no bass amp, just straight to the board. Guitarists are supposed to bring an amp. They don't want everyone bringing amps because there are 10 bands playing and they want everyone on and off as fast as possible. Of course most guitarists have more gear to set up so not sure how this is saving any time. Never been to this place so no idea what the setup is but the soundman has a good rep in the area so no one seems too worried about the lack of stage amps.
Still debating what bass I will take for this one because I don't want it to sound too "thin" when the guitarist is playing a solo. First thought was the BlackBird as it was a great choice for the last show I did with the "gutter glam" band (same drummer in this band) but that was a 2 guitar/bass/drum setup. The Epi VP is my second choice but I am wondering if one of the PJ loaded basses might be a better choice (maybe the Hamer??). Might take the VP and bring my St Blues PJ bass as a backup. Any opinions/thoughts on this?

That’s a sad reality. Every guitarist can slow down the show with setup and tear down because they need ‘their tone,’ but 10 different bass players need only what FOH decides and really, who actually cares what the bass sounds like? Nonesense. I’d personally bring a rig and tell FOH all the other bass players are welcome to use it too. Every instrument on a stage should matter.

Were it me(I?), I'd bring my "A" bass and have a combo amp-w/ line out-in the van, just in case. While the guitarist is hooking up all his gear, you'd require 1 plug. But that's me.

Sounds like FOH is more worried about stage volume than time.

Floor monitor from what I am told.

Ouch

Last night I saw a band and afterwards I asked the bass player/bass guitarist what strings he preferred. His first response was a look of puzzlement. Then he said that it does not matter b/c by the time the signal goes from the bass to the amp to the board to the sound guy and finally to the speakers it is too altered. He next said he’s been playing for 42 years.

I was asking more from the POV of what your hearing from the stage rig but after his response I decided to change the subject.

We talk a lot about strings around these parts. Made me wonder if we need to define our setting (headphones, rehearsal space, gig) when discussing.

Thoughts? thx

Sounds like the bass player you talked to is just lazy :/

I was watching a classic rock band at an outdoor stage last summer. The bassist was playing a Mustang with a pick and it sounded like he had Chromes. I went up after the set, complimented his tone (couldn’t compliment the playing...), and asked if he had Chromes on it. He did.
At least some of the time, your tone will be perceptible in the FOH. I think it’s worth getting a sound you like.

Agreed! The other night I hung out with one of the most well regarded bass players in Nashville. We talked a bit about strings. Not the whole time because it ain’t that interesting, but we talked about it

 

[GonePlaid]

While I am standing at the lectern, imparting pearls-beyond-price of wisdom.

One thing I have noticed since I started playing with lasses -- no one gives a rat's arse what bass, or pedals or amp you use, they only care about what you play and whether it sounds any good. It's not that they don't know about gear (they all seem to like Vox, Orange and vintage Marshall) and there's plenty of GAS going around, but they do know there's more than one path to musical enlightenment.

We have 2 guitarists. One has a decent semi-hollow Ibanez that he has 'blinged' up, the other has a Les Paul, an ES 175, an Ibby George Benson and a Strat. Guess which one is the better guitarist. The second one played my backup bass once(5quier VM Jaguar SS-$190.). Liked the sound but wouldn't buy one 'cos "what would people think" if he showed up on a gig with a (ugh) 5quier. So he bought a J-on sale-for $900. Also, likes the sound of my Rumble 200c($350.), but bought a MarkBass for around $700. Seeing a pattern here?

 

[fasterpussycat]

We have 2 guitarists. One has a decent semi-hollow Ibanez that he has 'blinged' up, the other has a Les Paul, an ES 175, an Ibby George Benson and a Strat. Guess which one is the better guitarist. The second one played my backup bass once(5quier VM Jaguar SS-$190.). Liked the sound but wouldn't buy one 'cos "what would people think" if he showed up on a gig with a (ugh) 5quier. So he bought a J-on sale-for $900. Also, likes the sound of my Rumble 200c($350.), but bought a MarkBass for around $700. Seeing a pattern here?

I dunno, might need more data ...

The SVT212AV cab has a 'prestige' badge, but was bought because it is 4Ω, wasn't stupid expensive, there aren't a lot of accessible 212 choices ... and it actually sounds good. Traynor is maybe like Peavey? Although unlike Peavey, most people have never even heard of.

Thunderbirds? I must be plain old perverse. I'll admit to disliking the poly finishes on the modern Epiphones, otherwise Gibson, Epi, Orville, Greco, boutique builders -- they're all Birds and if they play well and sound good, what more can you ask for? The same goes for a Squier, as long as it doesn't have a tort scratchplate (I'll 'tort nazi' you, Mark @dukeorock!) and it plays well, go for it. In fact I'd deliberately rock a Squier just to piss people off.

 

[Miles_ONeal]

We have 2 guitarists. One has a decent semi-hollow Ibanez that he has 'blinged' up, the other has a Les Paul, an ES 175, an Ibby George Benson and a Strat. Guess which one is the better guitarist. The second one played my backup bass once(5quier VM Jaguar SS-$190.). Liked the sound but wouldn't buy one 'cos "what would people think" if he showed up on a gig with a (ugh) 5quier. So he bought a J-on sale-for $900. Also, likes the sound of my Rumble 200c($350.), but bought a MarkBass for around $700. Seeing a pattern here?

I know that guy, and several of his twins.