Gotta agree, Professionals get paid, amateurs don't. benefit shows are of course the exception. That $300 does not constitute"pay"
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Tip jar at private party?
- Thread starter aprod
- Start date
Gotta agree, Professionals get paid, amateurs don't. benefit shows are of course the exception. That $300 does not constitute"pay"
No I agree that playing higher paying gigs is the way to go. Unfortunately in my area there are no bars that will pay even half what you were getting. Same with Private events. My band has played 4 that paid $3500 -$4000.00 but they involved a great deal of travel. Our local wedding price is $1800-2000.00 and we are the high end of the market.
Context is everything.
My fiddler likes to busk. He makes good money doing it, and he enjoys it. Inevitably people talk to him while he's busking...
"Hey, you're great. How'd you like to play at my [insert birthday, wine tasting, book launch or other event here]?"
Then the potential client's jaw drops when he says:
"Sure, it'll be $XX.xx for just me, or $XXX.xx for my three-piece band and an additional $XX.xx for each additional band member required."
Most people seem to expect somebody who's busking must be hard up or something and will jump at $0.xx (chump change) or don't get why it's so expensive for only a few minutes of playing.
Whether you play for 45 minutes or do three sets, you still have to have repertoire, haul gear, show up, dress appropriately etc. Playing for taxi fare is not fair. Still, we've had some good gigs from time-to-time through busking.
Don't forget to tip your accountant. And your check-out clerk. And your attorney. And tip your dentist. Tip your gas-meter reader, and tip your web master very well, and tip your...
Context is everything.
My fiddler likes to busk. He makes good money doing it, and he enjoys it. Inevitably people talk to him while he's busking...
"Hey, you're great. How'd you like to play at my [insert birthday, wine tasting, book launch or other event here]?"
Then the potential client's jaw drops when he says:
"Sure, it'll be $XX.xx for just me, or $XXX.xx for my three-piece band and an additional $XX.xx for each additional band member required."
Most people seem to expect somebody who's busking must be hard up or something and will jump at $0.xx (chump change) or don't get why it's so expensive for only a few minutes of playing.
Whether you play for 45 minutes or do three sets, you still have to have repertoire, haul gear, show up, dress appropriately etc. Playing for taxi fare is not fair. Still, we've had some good gigs from time-to-time through busking. Don't forget to tip your accountant. And your check-out clerk. And your attorney. And tip your dentist. Tip your gas-meter reader, and tip your web master very well, and tip your...
Context is everything.
Tip jar is very situational.
In literally every situation where someone on this thread says it's in poor taste, I have seen it used to great advantage and offend not a single person in the room.
But you have to use good judgment and ask the right people for their input for the tip jar to be most effective.
In literally every situation where someone on this thread says it's in poor taste, I have seen it used to great advantage and offend not a single person in the room.
But you have to use good judgment and ask the right people for their input for the tip jar to be most effective.
Right ... the symbol is "cool". I assumed that you thought your suggestions was just that. It ain't ...This >< ain't tough.
They PAID for a band. Maybe they were cool with a tip jar, that's fine by me. My band(s) would NOT put out a jar, nor would we ask to.
Hmmmm ... when I contract someone to do some work, the nature and extent is specified, I expect no less and no more from the contractor, and he can expect no less and no more from me.
If you tip them for less than good service then you are in the same position as those party goers ... you feel compelled to tip by convention. And probably don't like it much.
You really don't get it, do ya?
Fat Steve
The poodle bites, the poodle chews it.
For every event I've been too, whether a wedding, a corporate function, award ceremonies and the like, if there was a bartender than there was a tip jar. Why should it be any different for the band? Now, you don't need to necessarily have a "tip jar", but an open guitar case with a $10 bill sitting in it is just fine. I've never had any complaints.
Some of you remind me of Mr Pink in Reservoir Dogs. If you've never seen it, here's the scene in question:
Some of you remind me of Mr Pink in Reservoir Dogs. If you've never seen it, here's the scene in question:
Because the bartender is probably making close to minimum wage. If the band at such an event is playing for peanuts it's because they are too stupid to charge the going rate. I see tip jars for bartenders at maybe half the events/weddings I do.
I'm not sure what "peanuts" is exactly based on the OP, but it probably ain't far from minimum wage considering the transport, set-up, tear down and playing, not to mention time( if you're there you have to behave)
I've been to maybe one wedding, possibly none, where there wasn't a tip jar for the bartender.
But once again who is at fault that the OP s band got paid only $300.00? If that is all they asked for then they were stupid not the hosts. Some posters were blaming the hosts for the low pay. Maybe they don't have any idea what a fair price is. It might be the first time they ever hired a band.
I played two events last week where I saw no tip jar for bartenders. One is my weekly quest ranch gig. The bartender makes a note of who is drinking and what and that is added on to the guest bill at the end of their stay. The other event was at a resort where we were entertainment for a dinner for a corporate retreat for a well known financial company. There was a bar and I'm fairly sure that there was no tip jar.
So can the band make a note of who is listening and add that to the guest bill? no they don't have that option.
It sounds as if your gigs are bit more on the upscale side, so as most have agreed, the tip jar wouldn't be appropriate. were you paid well last week? and since we're on the topic, what would do if whomever booked the gig did it for less money than you wanted?
Fat Steve
The poodle bites, the poodle chews it.
I think it may be a geographical thing. Here in LA, tipping is the norm for just about any service job WITHIN REASON. No, we don't tip at fast food places or grocery stores (nice strawman argument by the way to whoever posted those examples above), but valets, barbers, bartenders, waiters, doormen, food delivery drivers and musicians are all usually tipped around here. However, up there in Montana it may be a different culture.
BTW modulsman, you can get your point across without being condescending or looking down at the "dumb" bands. Not everyone can be as stunningly awesome as you guys, nor are there same opportunities available to everyone. It seems as though you've been a professional musician for a long time, and I respect that and I do tend to enjoy your posts and views. In this case though, it seems as though you have a very rigid idea of what is acceptable and not, and not every area has the same social protocols. I guess there are some VERY STRONG feelings about tipping up there in gods country, while down here it's not such a big deal.
Thank you for your input.
BTW modulsman, you can get your point across without being condescending or looking down at the "dumb" bands. Not everyone can be as stunningly awesome as you guys, nor are there same opportunities available to everyone. It seems as though you've been a professional musician for a long time, and I respect that and I do tend to enjoy your posts and views. In this case though, it seems as though you have a very rigid idea of what is acceptable and not, and not every area has the same social protocols. I guess there are some VERY STRONG feelings about tipping up there in gods country, while down here it's not such a big deal.
Thank you for your input.
The guest ranch gig is my main bands bread and butter gig. We play there 12-15 times a summer. I get paid $312.50 each time and a good meal. We take some money off the top for a band fund and gas. The corporate gig was a 3 hour deal with another band. PA was supplied and a meal. I made $250.00 in a 5 piece band. Not sure what the BL made. On Saturday night with the same band as a 4 piece. I did a gig that required 12 hours of my time and was paid only $120.00. But with that band you have to take the good gigs with the bad. And no we didn't put out a tip jar.
I thought the going rate around here for "Mustang Sally" requests was minimum $100.00. I like the concept of the 'situational' tip jar. But that doesn't speak to the OP's issue, which I think was communication with his bandmates.
GTR: "Hey guys, I'd like to play HOSTS party as a favor to them."
BAND: "You know we need $____ per person, especially to cover gas, gear wear and tear and so forth."
GTR: "I said we'd do it for $300.00."
BAND: "Maybe you will do it for that, but we won't. Here are the options you have:
Contact the HOSTS and explain that the fee you negotiated was not agreed to or sufficient for the other band members since you was never authorized to commit to that fee on our behalf to begin with without our consent.
HOSTS will have to either:
(a) Pay more for this with or without a tip jar;
(b) Find another band that will play for that pay scale. "
So the tip jar is pretty far back in the options that way.
An alternative scenario for this 6 piece band would for the GTR to say to the HOSTS right up front, "The band usaully gets (let's say 1200) for a gig like this, but I will be happy to discount my portion (200) as a professional courtesy".
So he can donate his service to his friends, the HOSTS if he likes, but you are certainly not obligated to do so.
With that understanding for doing gigs for friends as a policy, the tip jar issue becomes kind of moot. Or you could just ask. In this situation I would not have put one out though, if the agreement was made in advance to the pay. It seems that the tip jar was only an issue as the gig was underpaid.
It also sets a precedent for when the drummer's sister, or horn players cousin wants a party. Then the drummer says "We did HOSTS party for $300.00 and this is my sister, she's family!" Then you're screwed.
So from now on, agree everyone gets paid except for the individual(s) that choose to donate or discount their own service.
The last party I was at that had private bands, 2 of them, the sound guy alone made 4 times that.
~~~~~~~~~
Re the post about the guy who was going to put out the tip jar to recoup the band pay, I find that pretty disgusting. If you want a party with a band, expect to pay for the service. If not, don't buy what you can't afford.
Also, an unwanted tip story ... One time I was in Boston for a trade convention. Usually I take a guitar so I can play when I get bored or jonesed out.
Anyway, I am at the Parker House (rather snooty
) and I went down to the lobby to play there so as not to disturb people on my floor. 10PM on a Saturday night. Date night. Security throws me out of there in about 30 seconds. "You can't play that here!" Ok. (One of the better places I have been thrown out of, don't even ASK about the Renaissance.)So, I hoof it next door and there is a ministry in a store front and the entrance is trapezoidal, just like a stage, kind of a horn shape. Perfect. I whip out the 12 string and start my workout.
A guy comes by with a pretty girl on his arm, and he tries to give me 5 bucks. My case is not open and I refuse. I realized I am now making him look bad in front of this hot date he is trying to impress, so I tell him, "ok, but I'm gonna give it to the food bank". Help a bro out to hook up, you know. So I open the case, and people randomly walk by and throw money in.
At the end of an hour or two I had 50 bucks or so, and I gave it all to the RI Food Bank (Feeding America).
Now I have made it a habit than rather to refuse donations, I try to be gracious about it and give any of them to the Food Bank. That assuages any minor guilt I might have about taking anyones cash as I just put it toward a good cause.
Mustang Sally is still 100 bucks though. You can feed a lot of people with that.
I think using a tip jar looks like the band is groveling for pennies. If the audience is like most I've played for, the tips come when a song is requested. Song request are usually much more generous. My trio has received anywhere form $20 to $100 for a song request.
The guest ranch gig is my main bands bread and butter gig. We play there 12-15 times a summer. I get paid $312.50 each time and a good meal. We take some money off the top for a band fund and gas. The corporate gig was a 3 hour deal with another band. PA was supplied and a meal. I made $250.00 in a 5 piece band. Not sure what the BL made. On Saturday night with the same band as a 4 piece. I did a gig that required 12 hours of my time and was paid only $120.00. But with that band you have to take the good gigs with the bad. And no we didn't put out a tip jar.
Keep in mind, I'm playing the devils advocate. But yes you do quite well compared to many. Your pay alone for your bread and butter gig is what many bands split among 4 members, even the 120 for 12 hours is still $10 an hour( minimum wage in MA is 7.50)
At your rates the tip jar should never come into mind, but your situation doesn't call for it. Also it sounds like your BL is pretty good regarding pay. I'm curious what the op's guitarists track record is with bookings.
Final note on this, you've done well to put yourself in a position to collect good pay regularly, and I respect that. A lot of us struggle to reach that point so enjoy and appreciate that!
Most of our work is private and frat parties these days, and we never put out a tip jar for those jobs, but we are getting paid good and almost always get a nice tip from the host.
Regular jobs will see a tip jar on the table next to our email signup and CD for sale sign.
Regular jobs will see a tip jar on the table next to our email signup and CD for sale sign.
Cool,
I like where your heads at.
We use a pitcher, and we have never had any complaints. I don't think it has anything to do with being classy, professional or anything. If your band doesn't use a tip as a protocol then don't. It doesn't make you any better than anyone else. If your band acepts tips than do it, it doesn't make you any less of a band or less professional at least your gigging.
I'm not snooty, my band played 150 shows last year, at 60 years old I an very lucky to be out there gigging anywhere. I know a lot of guys that can't find or get into a gigging band that makes money.
And we are a bar band, a biker bar band. Nothing to be ashamed of.
Blue
It's relative Hsech,
We deliver full sound with a sound guy and lights at every show.
We have a tip pitcher and I know for a fact we don't look like were groveling for pennies. As a matter of fact, I have seen many of our local working bands use tip jars and never thought they looked like they were groveling.I only noticed how well they were playing and looked.
Blue
