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True 3-way fEARful bass enclosures

12bass

12bass

Jan 2, 2003
4,873
3,552
Victoria, Canada
#1
Hey Everyone,

For disclosure, I am not a commercial builder, just a satisfied DIY bassist who would like to let others know what is out there.

Many of you may be familiar with greenboy's fEARful bass enclosure plans which were released to the DIY community for free. The original designs featured the cheap-but-good (CBG) crossover which was intended to make a reasonable compromise between cost and sound quality. One of the characteristics of the CBG design is that it uses a relatively simple highpass filter on the midrange driver. Because of this, there is a significant peak in output around 4 kHz at the point of cone breakup which some people find somewhat harsh. Moreover, 3-way CBG implementation has a bit of a hole between the midrange and tweeter, which renders the tweeter less useful.

While many love their CBG fEARfuls, some users were hoping for something a bit more even in response from top to bottom.

Enter the true 3-way:

The true 3-way crossover design, primarily developed by Steve Clift (sclift), changes all that. The new 3-way crossover uses a full bandpass filter for the midrange which tames the resonant peak and smoothly interfaces with the tweeter for the higher frequencies. Care has also been taken to ensure optimal phase response throughout the room. The true 3-way elevates the fEARful to a whole new level of fidelity.

The result is what I would characterize as a much flatter, better behaved, bass enclosure. I found myself fighting with EQ to tame the original CBG design, while the true 3-way offers more of a blank canvas for sculpting my tone. For me, there is no downside, apart from a bit of added cost and labor due to increased crossover complexity. Highly recommended!

The free plans for the true 3-way crossover are available here: [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Note: registration is required to view the greenboy forum.
 
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#5
15/6/1 ... Which horn plays the nicest?

When I go to speakerhardware.com for the 15/6 deluxe pack they give you the true cross option then you order the horn and they give you more cross over options.

I don't get why if your cross is a 3 way why is another cross needed?
 
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#6
I am aware of this option, and have considered modifying two of my 15/6/1 Anchak built fEARfuls for quite a while. I think the reason I haven't is two-fold.

1. I am so happy with the cabs the way they are, and have achieved tones I really love.
2. The actual process of swapping out the CBG crossovers for the true 3-way crossovers looks to be a pain.
 
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#8
Passinwind said:
Because the CBG crossover lets the mid driver roll off on its own, without a low pass filter section.
Click to expand...

Invalid Link Removed

So... on the site... you choose True Xover for option one

Then under HF choice you get both horns each with 3 choices... xover parts, xover parts with PCboards OR prebuilt Xover.

So the True Xover only covers the crossing of the 15 to the 6 the 6 to the horn or all 3? Obviously I'm a NOOB but its a bit unclear too
 
#9
Tunaman said:
Invalid Link Removed

So... on the site... you choose True Xover for option one

Then under HF choice you get both horns each with 3 choices... xover parts, xover parts with PCboards OR prebuilt Xover.

So the True Xover only covers the crossing of the 15 to the 6 the 6 to the horn or all 3? Obviously I'm a NOOB but its a bit unclear too
Click to expand...

You are picking which level of completion you get the cross over.
 
#12
Tunaman said:
Okay... but if the True Cross is a 3 way & you pay for it in option 1, why do you need to pay for another crossover for the horn? What is the true cross crossing if not all 3?
Click to expand...

The tweeter needs a high pass no matter what, assuming you use the tweeter option. If you do a T3W the mid driver needs a low pass, which is what option 1 covers. It's conceivable that someone might want to low pass the mid driver to kill the 4-5K spike, but not use a tweeter at all. Looks like Leland has that covered, but yeah, his labeling could maybe be a little more instructive, and I think he's actually currently working on that.

In any case, there's a whole forum that is dedicated just to these things, have you joined it yet?
 
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#13
Passinwind said:
The tweeter needs a high pass no matter what, assuming you use the tweeter option. If you do a T3W the mid driver needs a low pass, which is what option 1 covers. It's conceivable that someone might want to low pass the mid driver to kill the 4-5K spike, but not use a tweeter at all. Looks like Leland has that covered, but yeah, his labeling could maybe be a little more instructive, and I think he's actually currently working on that.

In any case, there's a whole forum that is dedicated just to these things, have you joined it yet?
Click to expand...

Yeah I joined. I just troll TB more... and was intrigued by the new cross. I know that Kjung was very adamant about the mids being too harsh initially with the Fearfuls. I've been waiting it out to see what my needs are. I play a 5 string & could use some deeper lows than my GK NEOs for disco\motown\top 40s... but I'm mainly interested in them doing sub\kick drum duty. A "decent" 18" subwoofer costs like $1500... Id rather just spend those bones on these.
 
#14
Tunaman said:
Yeah I joined. I just troll TB more... and was intrigued by the new cross. I know that Kjung was very adamant about the mids being too harsh initially with the Fearfuls. I've been waiting it out to see what my needs are. I play a 5 string & could use some deeper lows than my GK NEOs for disco\motown\top 40s... but I'm mainly interested in them doing sub\kick drum duty. A "decent" 18" subwoofer costs like $1500... Id rather just spend those bones on these.
Click to expand...

Cool, and I hang here much more than there myself. I think I'd just build a BFM sub for what you want though.

When I built my fEARful there was no crossover design, so several of us rolled our own. No need to live with Dave's aggressive voicing in the CBG if you don't care to, but doing actual DIY can be a pretty deep rabbit hole!
 
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#15
Passinwind said:
Cool, and I hang her much more than there myself. I think I'd just build a BFM sub for what you want though.

When I built my fEARful there was no crossover design, so several of us rolled our own. No need to live with Dave's aggressive voicing in the CBG if you don't care to, but doing actual DIY can be a pretty deep rabbit hole!
Click to expand...

Yeah the Tuba 24 kills our TERRIBLE Mackie SWA1501s we are using, funny he has the chart to compare them!

Could a 15/6/1 beat the Mackie 1501 too?

24inchSWA1501.gif
 
#16
Passinwind said:
Cool, and I hang here much more than there myself. I think I'd just build a BFM sub for what you want though.

When I built my fEARful there was no crossover design, so several of us rolled our own. No need to live with Dave's aggressive voicing in the CBG if you don't care to, but doing actual DIY can be a pretty deep rabbit hole!
Click to expand...

I had Don at LDS build me one per Dave's plans before there were authorized builders. It took some back and forth, but I ended up a fEarful spec cabinet from a non-authorized builder. At that time, before the CBG crossover, I just went with a Ralf Patterson 3-way crossover with the woofer and midrange separating at 800hz. I've not been able to compare it to a CBG or a T3W, but I believe Ken did and said that it was remarkably similar to the CBG. I too find the upper midrange hump a little too aggressive for my taste, and often consider grabbing a T3W to tame and even things out a bit. It's a tough call since traditional 2-way cabs have been more my thing lately.
 
#17
Not sure what you mean about a "traditional 2-way", silky. If you mean something like the SWR and Eden designs which use a woofer coupled with a horn, that sort of arrangement leaves a sizable hole between the top of the woofer and the bottom of the tweeter, sort of a "boom+sizzle" sound. The T3W crossover will not sound like that. Rather, it sounds more like a PA or hi-fi speaker, even and well-behaved, on and off-axis. Further, if you shut of the tweeter, it sounds somewhat like an old 15", with fairly mellow highs.
 
#20
12bass said:
Not sure what you mean about a "traditional 2-way", silky. If you mean something like the SWR and Eden designs which use a woofer coupled with a horn, that sort of arrangement leaves a sizable hole between the top of the woofer and the bottom of the tweeter, sort of a "boom+sizzle" sound. The T3W crossover will not sound like that. Rather, it sounds more like a PA or hi-fi speaker, even and well-behaved, on and off-axis. Further, if you shut of the tweeter, it sounds somewhat like an old 15", with fairly mellow highs.
Click to expand...

The thing I love about the fEARful designs is the mid. For me, I prefer a paper cone mid driver, crossing in the 800~1000 range. I play Rics, and that type of design makes my bass's grind the way they were supposed to instead of a compression driver horn crossed at 4kHz. But I also like a woofer that can play up to 4k w/o a mid/tweet when I do old school. The fEARful LF driver just can't go that high. Everything is a compromise. I really luv my fEARful 15/6 with the stock CBG x-over most of the time. I have a Genz-Benz 410 Uber for the other times.
 

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