Updating my rig: Need suggestions

[MultiScaleMale]

Personally, I'd go with a Mesa D-800+ and whatever Subway cab/cabs look appealing to you. I use a 210 / 115 and they both sound great. A lot stack 2 115's or use the 215 but a single cab may be an easier haul or a more difficult load in than 2 115's depending on your situation. Finding Subway cabs is not super easy right now. Parts shortages have pushed the next deliveries out into 2022.

 

[WG Plum]

It is very difficult to find a shop that actually has high end speakers to demo. I spoke at length with the guys at the Bass Shop in Seattle. They suggested a look at a Aguilar 4X10 and maybe stack it on an Aguilar single 15. Anyone ever used that arrangement? Anyway, I am not sure where to go with this. It is going to be a significant financial investment so I would like to get it right the first time. I am totally open to suggestions.
Regards,

Michael

Chad at the Bass Shop really knows what he's talking about, but he's also an Aggy dealer. He's also a Bergantino dealer, and that's top notch gear too. I myself am trying to find a lighter rig (and just put my Ashdown rig on consignment at the Bass Shop). I'm definitely getting a Broughton SSDI tube pre, but I'm still figuring out the rest of the rig. Sinobas cab? Aguilar AG700 + plus an SL212 cab? Hold for a couple of AudioKinesis Hathors? RevSound cab? There are a LOT of choices.

I think I'm proooooobably going to go with the AG700/SL212, but I don't know yet.

 

[DJ Bebop]

All the choices now!
It's good to be alive as a bass player!

 

[dave hope]

This rig has been very versatile for me. I switched back to flats to play 50-60-70s music, and I didn’t want the attack a tweeter. It’s been a great tool for me so far.

 

[Mark_70]

I went Bergantino when I decided to look for something lighter , and never sounded better .

+1 on Bergantino. I have 2 CN112's. Love the sound of them and I can grab one for band practice or both if I need them for a gig. I used to have some sort of SWR 210 and 115 cabs (XLT or something - can't recall exactly) and I was shocked how much better the Bergantino 112's sounded..
Lightweight, easy to get into and out of the car. Massive sound vs the 210 +115

Regards
Mark

 

[RColie]

My suggestion is to get a 2 ohm capable head, and a stack of (up to 4) 112's - you can bring them into a venue one at a time, so no load is too heavy, but you have gobs of output capability if and when you need it. For smaller gigs, bring 1 or 2 cabinets.

This makes a lot of sense to me. Genzler has a new line of cabinets called Nu Classics. You could do all 112s at 28 pounds each, or replace two of the 112s with a 44-pound 212. Affordable, flexible and great sounding.

 

[Analogeezer]

This is going to be my first and a probably too long post. The gist of the situation is that my faithful SWR rig has just become too heavy for me in my old age. I need lighter speakers. What should I look at?

I bought an SWR SM400 and two goliath 4X10 cabinets back about 1988. I ultimately traded one of the 4X10's for a Big Ben 18" and added a SM 900. I play a five string and really like getting down to the low D and occasionally the low C. I was playing in an R&B band and a classic Chicago-style blues band by the early 2000's. Then kids and their sports stepped in and I really didn't play much at all for about 20 years. Got back to it the last couple of years and as Covid restrictions have eased up, have been playing out. I now have a classic rock band playing 50's, 60's and 70's and a jam band playing Allman Brothers and Dead style music. I still really like the sound of my SWR but those speakers must weigh in at sixty or seventy pounds. I'm just waiting to blow a lumbar disk lifting them in and out of my truck.

What I am looking for are lighter weight speakers that will still give me a rich, mellow tone. I don't slap but I do want the tone to be clear and articulated, particularly in the low registers. I have come to realize that my 18" speaker, while moving a lot of air, does not really articulate the low notes all that well. There are some Phil Lesh runs that really need to come up from a solid, very low pitch so I need speakers that will handle the low notes as well as the middle ranges.

It is very difficult to find a shop that actually has high end speakers to demo. I spoke at length with the guys at the Bass Shop in Seattle. They suggested a look at a Aguilar 4X10 and maybe stack it on an Aguilar single 15. Anyone ever used that arrangement? Anyway, I am not sure where to go with this. It is going to be a significant financial investment so I would like to get it right the first time. I am totally open to suggestions.
Regards,

Michael

My recollection (I will have to find my old SWR brochure) was the Big Ben was closer to 100 pounds, I know the Eden single 18" was.

When I modernized my rig circa the late 1990's I was looking at pretty much what you describe but the single 18" and 4 x 10" cabs of those two brands were near 100 pound.

In the end I wound up with Carvin cabinets which I am very happy with, the single 18" comes in at 72 pounds with casters and a cover, the 2 x 10" at 42 pounds.

That's still way north of what you want (Plus Carvin bass gear is no longer made) but at the time they used Poplar plywood and their cabinets were much lighter than the typical stuff from SWR, Eden, etc.

I've not tried any of the new type cabs with neos and super light weight but you can't really go wrong with Mesa, GR Bass, or G-K stuff these days.

Lots of smaller companies making botiquish stuff too that is quite light.

The GR bass carbon fiber stuff is super light (I think their 4x10" is like 32 pounds) but is pricey. Their wooden cabinets do add some weight but are still pretty light weight.

Analogeezer

 

[Rip Van Dan]

This is going to be my first and a probably too long post. The gist of the situation is that my faithful SWR rig has just become too heavy for me in my old age. I need lighter speakers. What should I look at?

I bought an SWR SM400 and two goliath 4X10 cabinets back about 1988. I ultimately traded one of the 4X10's for a Big Ben 18" and added a SM 900. I play a five string and really like getting down to the low D and occasionally the low C. I was playing in an R&B band and a classic Chicago-style blues band by the early 2000's. Then kids and their sports stepped in and I really didn't play much at all for about 20 years. Got back to it the last couple of years and as Covid restrictions have eased up, have been playing out. I now have a classic rock band playing 50's, 60's and 70's and a jam band playing Allman Brothers and Dead style music. I still really like the sound of my SWR but those speakers must weigh in at sixty or seventy pounds. I'm just waiting to blow a lumbar disk lifting them in and out of my truck.

What I am looking for are lighter weight speakers that will still give me a rich, mellow tone. I don't slap but I do want the tone to be clear and articulated, particularly in the low registers. I have come to realize that my 18" speaker, while moving a lot of air, does not really articulate the low notes all that well. There are some Phil Lesh runs that really need to come up from a solid, very low pitch so I need speakers that will handle the low notes as well as the middle ranges.

It is very difficult to find a shop that actually has high end speakers to demo. I spoke at length with the guys at the Bass Shop in Seattle. They suggested a look at a Aguilar 4X10 and maybe stack it on an Aguilar single 15. Anyone ever used that arrangement? Anyway, I am not sure where to go with this. It is going to be a significant financial investment so I would like to get it right the first time. I am totally open to suggestions.
Regards,

Michael

Hi Michael. I'm going to suggest you check out two cabs. One is the [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] and the other is the [Invalid or Expired Link Removed], both by DNA (David Nordschow Amplification). In case that name doesn't ring a bell his alias was David Eden. He founded Eden and ran it until he left in 2009. In 2010 he brought out his first DNS (David Nordschow Speaker) cabs. I bought the DNS-410 after drooling over it for 5 years in 2015. Was going to be the last cab I bought. It handles 1400-watts rms with a max SPL of 137db.

It is super clear, clean, full, articulate and LOUD with a very tight and low bottom end. I typically ran my 800-watt Eden amp into it with the Master between 9 o'clock and 9:30. Outdoors I'd set it at 9:30 and at wide open Music Festivals I'd set the master a nudge above 10 o'clock. If I got the master too close to 10:30, I'd be told to turn down. That's actually a good thing because that means I don't need to haul around an 810 cab. So great sounding cab that takes very little power to get to gig level.

Problem I ran into was playing small venues. Owner's eyes would bug out of their heads when they saw me roll in my DNS-410. They'd shake their heads "no" and say "use that" as they typically pointed to a small bass combo, often a 112 combo. So in 2019 when DNA accepted me into their Endorsing Artist program, I bought my DNS-210. Nobody looks cross-eyed at a bassist bringing in a 210 cab.

It has the same sonic attributes that the DNS-410 does but in a smaller form factor and it has an even lower bottom end. It will handle 700-watts rms with a max SPL of 134db. I stacked it on top of my 410 the first time I played a gig with it because I wasn't sure if it would cover this fairly large (almost large really) club and I could unplug it and plug in the 410 in just a few seconds. Well that DNS-210 was more than enough for that venue. In fact I now use that DNS-210 for all my indoor gigs, reserving my DNS-410 for outdoors and Music Festivals.

My DNS-210 is not the lightest cab out there at 52-lbs, but it easily covers anything a normal 410 would do and it's a lot lighter than a 410. My DNS-410 will easily handle anything you'd otherwise need an 810 cab for. Street price on the DNS-210 runs from a low of about $849 up to a high of $949. My DNS-410 was $1,000 when I bought it in 2015 and the new ones are about $1149. If you don't play outdoors or music festivals much, that DNS-210 will handle all your other gigs.

Below is a picture of the two stacked together at that first gig for the 210 back in 2019. I only used the 210 at that gig and actually had to push that stack as far to the left as I could because, although the sound was good throughout the venue (I walked it with my wireless), on stage it was killing my ears. I was just too close to it.

 

[mcrawfordmusic]

You will have to try a bunch of gear to decide what's right for you. However, if you go with a high-end brand like Aguilar or Bergantino, you really can't go wrong.

 

[SLPimp]

Just grabbed an Orange TB500 and I use a pair of Trace Elliot ELF 110 cabs. The head is 11lbs with an AD200 preamp and the cabs are 17 each.

 

[mrjim123]

If you're trying to reduce weight forget that 4x10 nonsense. I'd go with a 2x10, a single 15, or 2 individual 12's.

Edit: +1 to @SLPimp ' s "Trace Elliot ELF 110 cabs" suggestion. I have two and can fill just about any room with them. I'm thinking a getting a third. My head is a Mesa Boogie D-800.

 

[Wolford]

Brand agnostic - Since your primary concern is weight, I think it's easy choice. Buy 2 1x12's, to use 1-12" for small gigs and 2-12" for larger. I use 1 or 2 2x10s (vertically) but 1x12's are lighter than 2x10's and if I had to do it again today I'd go 2 1x12's.

 

[BassMike14]

I wanted to thank you all for your replies. I know that tone and sound are very user specific so this will be a little bit of a shot in the dark till I have the cabinets and get a chance to play them. I had a really informative talk with Chad at the Bass Shop in Seattle. Very generous with his time and information. I went ahead and ordered a Bergantino NXV 112 cabinet. If the sound really speaks to me, I will probably get either another 112 or a 212. That should take care of my cabinet needs. Next, I have to figure out how to sell my SWR Goliath and Big Benn. They are a little difficult to mail...

 

[cassanova]

I went with a Mesa D800 + and Ampeg PN210. The head's only 6.5 lbs, and the cab 44 lbs. Both light enough, and easy enough to carry with one hand. Oh, and they both sound great together too!

 

[delta7fred]

10 years ago I went lightweight because I could no longer schlep the 96 pound Trace Elliot combo that I had been dragging around since the 90's, even though it was on wheels.

At the time high end cabs were few and far between in the UK and I love building stuff so took a leap of faith and built a fEARful 15/6 which cured my cab GAS in a stroke. I then changed bands where it was overkill so downsized to a 12/6.

Initially I was using a racked PA amp and channel strip but when I switched to the smaller 12/6 it was too big so went with a GK MB800. This rig will probably see me out.

 

[edwinhurwitz]

I think @edwinhurwitz uses a Bag End cab and having heard him live I can assure you he nails the 70s Phil Lesh tone. I'm not sure how much those cabs weigh, though.

I use a lot of different speaker configurations, including an ancient Bag End II with a K140. It's more like a Wall of Sound cabinet than the later Bag End cabs. Very deep. I've even used it in conjunction with Sunn 200S when I need to be ridiculous. Recently, I used the 200S cab with a '67 showman and I was amazed that it actually was more power than I needed on a reasonable sized stage (1000 seat theater).

Generally, though, I use a MAS 210 Flex. It's smaller, lighter, deeper, and louder. I've been using a Groove Tubes Studio Bass Preamp with a Quilter 800 Bass Block for power.

I wish I had a better picture without that ugly guy in the way.

And my favorite, which just isn't practical, is the full stereo Alembic preamp McIntosh/JBL rig.

 

[DJ Bebop]

I use a lot of different speaker configurations, including an ancient Bag End II with a K140. It's more like a Wall of Sound cabinet than the later Bag End cabs. Very deep. I've even used it in conjunction with Sunn 200S when I need to be ridiculous. Recently, I used the 200S cab with a '67 showman and I was amazed that it actually was more power than I needed on a reasonable sized stage (1000 seat theater). View attachment 4414862

Generally, though, I use a MAS 210 Flex. It's smaller, lighter, deeper, and louder. I've been using a Groove Tubes Studio Bass Preamp with a Quilter 800 Bass Block for power.

I wish I had a better picture without that ugly guy in the way.View attachment 4414872

And my favorite, which just isn't practical, is the full stereo Alembic preamp McIntosh/JBL rig.

View attachment 4414873

Beautiful!

 

[Analogeezer]

I use a lot of different speaker configurations, including an ancient Bag End II with a K140. It's more like a Wall of Sound cabinet than the later Bag End cabs. Very deep. I've even used it in conjunction with Sunn 200S when I need to be ridiculous. Recently, I used the 200S cab with a '67 showman and I was amazed that it actually was more power than I needed on a reasonable sized stage (1000 seat theater). View attachment 4414862

Generally, though, I use a MAS 210 Flex. It's smaller, lighter, deeper, and louder. I've been using a Groove Tubes Studio Bass Preamp with a Quilter 800 Bass Block for power.

I wish I had a better picture without that ugly guy in the way.View attachment 4414872

And my favorite, which just isn't practical, is the full stereo Alembic preamp McIntosh/JBL rig.

View attachment 4414873

That's some cool stuff, drooling over the Macintosh

I gotta ask, is the PA for these gigs using a set of Altec Voice of the Theaters or maybe original Electrovoice Eliminator I's? 'Cuz that would be era appropriate

The second pic, the guy behind the amp looks like he is wearing a lab coat (the shirt); that seems appropriate, having a scientist set up your rig

Say you were a frequent contributor to the old Bottom Line list right? (TBL)

I thought the name sounded very familiar, glad to see ya again!

Analogeezer

 

[edwinhurwitz]

That's some cool stuff, drooling over the Macintosh

I gotta ask, is the PA for these gigs using a set of Altec Voice of the Theaters or maybe original Electrovoice Eliminator I's? 'Cuz that would be era appropriate

The second pic, the guy behind the amp looks like he is wearing a lab coat (the shirt); that seems appropriate, having a scientist set up your rig

Say you were a frequent contributor to the old Bottom Line list right? (TBL)

I thought the name sounded very familiar, glad to see ya again!

Analogeezer

You, too!

Hm. Maybe I should get a lab coat....

Preferred PA for era appropriateness would be: