Upgrading from Combo Amp - Ampeg Venture V7 + Cabinet Help

[Eric Mull]

I need some amp + cabinet advise from the vets.

I'm looking at getting my first real rig, and I'm really interested in the Venture series. I love the Ampeg sound and I gig in a 90s rock/grunge cover band, so I think it's a good fit.

I'm a weekend warrior that gigs about 4 times a month and we do our own sound 90% of time in small to medium sized bars.

I do run my amp through our PA but we don't have a sub. My amp is essentially responsible for the low end on stage and throughout the club.

I've gigged 210 and 112 combos (Fender, Markbass, Ampeg) and I feel like I am just not pushing enough air to provide the low end to the whole club.

I'm looking at getting the V7 head and the 210 + 112 cabinet. My thought process is, I can bring both for bigger places and get the full 700w at 4 ohms, and then maybe just bring one of them for smaller places. They're both light and portable which is a huge plus, and the sound demos I've heard all sound great.

Right as I'm about to pull the trigger, I realize the 112 is only rated for 250W and the 210 is only rated for 300W, which is less than half of the head?? I looked at downsizing the amp but the 300W amp doesn't have the compressor and I don't think you can add 2 extension cabs, also 300W is just not as much power as I want.

Do I have to pick a 410 or 212 to pair with this V7 head? I don't love the idea since they're a lot heavier and I need to be able to fit them in a car.

Should I look at other cabinet companies that are rated for more wattage?

What do you V7 owners use cabinet wise?

 

[gtirard]

I need some amp + cabinet advise from the vets.

I'm looking at getting my first real rig, and I'm really interested in the Venture series. I love the Ampeg sound and I gig in a 90s rock/grunge cover band, so I think it's a good fit.

I'm a weekend warrior that gigs about 4 times a month and we do our own sound 90% of time in small to medium sized bars.

I do run my amp through our PA but we don't have a sub. My amp is essentially responsible for the low end on stage and throughout the club.

I've gigged 210 and 112 combos (Fender, Markbass, Ampeg) and I feel like I am just not pushing enough air to provide the low end to the whole club.

I'm looking at getting the V7 head and the 210 + 112 cabinet. My thought process is, I can bring both for bigger places and get the full 700w at 4 ohms, and then maybe just bring one of them for smaller places. They're both light and portable which is a huge plus, and the sound demos I've heard all sound great.

Right as I'm about to pull the trigger, I realize the 112 is only rated for 250W and the 210 is only rated for 300W, which is less than half of the head?? I looked at downsizing the amp but the 300W amp doesn't have the compressor and I don't think you can add 2 extension cabs, also 300W is just not as much power as I want.

Do I have to pick a 410 or 212 to pair with this V7 head? I don't love the idea since they're a lot heavier and I need to be able to fit them in a car.

Should I look at other cabinet companies that are rated for more wattage?

What do you V7 owners use cabinet wise?

I can't find the exact figures in the Ampeg's specs, but the power rating of class D amps is always given for 4 ohm, and you generally get half the power @ 8 ohm, so when using only one cab, the amp's power is probably around 350W, it should be OK with the 210 if you are careful not to max the volume.

And with 2x210 cabs, the amp run @ 4 ohm at full power and each cab receives the hafl of the power so you should be fine too.

That said, Barefaced cabs are also known to offer a great alternative to their Ampeg equivalents (they offer higher power ratings and sensitivity).

 

[Eric Mull]

I can't find the exact figures in the Ampeg's specs, but the power rating of class D amps is always given for 4 ohm, and you generally get half the power @ 8 ohm, so when using only one cab, the amp's power is probably around 350W, it should be OK with the 210 if you are careful not to max the volume.

And with 2x210 cabs, the amp run @ 4 ohm at full power and each cab receives the hafl of the power so you should be fine too.

That said, Barefaced cabs are also known to offer a great alternative to their Ampeg equivalents (they offer higher power ratings and sensitivity).

So the 112 and 115 are both rated up to 250W and the 210 up to 350W according to Sweetwater. As long as I don't turn the volume up to maximum, I'll be fine?

In the past I don't think I've ever turned my amps much past 1 o'clock so it shouldn't be a problem, but It just makes me nervous that they're rated so low.

 

[Aloe]

well, going from a 210 combo that pushes 300ish watts to a V7 into one 8 ohm 410 would give you around +3dB boost. that's not a lot. a V7 into two 210s could give you up to like +4-5dB which is better but still like not twice louder, and you risk with expensive repair if you or anybody else turns the amp loud.

usually cabs don't sound good at their max thermal rating, the RMS rating is a thermal one, it doesn't guarantee, it will sound good at this power.

to complicate it even more, 'amp at 12 o'clock' might be a maxed out one, some (or maybe most) don't really have much usable volume past half the rotation.

I'd start with the idea, how loud you actually need to be. I get that like 300W into a 210 doesn't cut, but how louder rig do you need? +3dB, +6dB, +10dB, or how much? do you have an idea, how loud your PA is in decibels? extra loudness doesn't come free, you'll need to spend more money and likely haul more speakers, so try to be realistic in those estimates.

at the end a sub or a couple might be cheaper.

 

[Eric Mull]

well, going from a 210 combo that pushes 300ish watts to a V7 into one 8 ohm 410 would give you around +3dB boost. that's not a lot. a V7 into two 210s could give you up to like +4-5dB which is better but still like not twice louder, and you risk with expensive repair if you or anybody else turns the amp loud.

usually cabs don't sound good at their max thermal rating, the RMS rating is a thermal one, it doesn't guarantee, it will sound good at this power.

to complicate it even more, 'amp at 12 o'clock' might be a maxed out one, some (or maybe most) don't really have much usable volume past half the rotation.

I'd start with the idea, how loud you actually need to be. I get that like 300W into a 210 doesn't cut, but how louder rig do you need? +3dB, +6dB, +10dB, or how much? do you have an idea, how loud your PA is in decibels? extra loudness doesn't come free, you'll need to spend more money and likely haul more speakers, so try to be realistic in those estimates.

at the end a sub or a couple might be cheaper.

Ok, I just want to make sure I understand. So I’m running a 500 watt combo at 8 ohms, which is 300 watts. If I upgrade to the V7 and run 700 watts at 4 ohms (a 112 and a 210 cab), it’s only going to be around +5 db louder?

 

[Aloe]

Ok, I just want to make sure I understand. So I’m running a 500 watt combo at 8 ohms, which is 300 watts. If I upgrade to the V7 and run 700 watts at 4 ohms (a 112 and a 210 cab), it’s only going to be around +5 db louder?

well, if you'll run 700 watts to a venture 210 and 112, you will blow them.

doubling the watts: +3db
doubling the speakers: +3db

they sum, and that's it. that's the theoretically possible benefit, in real life it could be less.

'twice loud' is like +10dB, to get in this ballpark that would be like a 800-watter into a 810.

for calculating the real world loudness of a rig don't forget speaker sensitivity.
the formula is: log(W)*10+S

so, for example, I'm pushing 300W into a cab rated 101dB, log(300)*10+101=125.7dB max possible with this rig.
if I have a cab rated at 94dB, I get 118.7dB max, a whopping difference.

 

[Up the dose]

I need some amp + cabinet advise from the vets.

I'm looking at getting my first real rig, and I'm really interested in the Venture series. I love the Ampeg sound and I gig in a 90s rock/grunge cover band, so I think it's a good fit.

I'm a weekend warrior that gigs about 4 times a month and we do our own sound 90% of time in small to medium sized bars.

I do run my amp through our PA but we don't have a sub. My amp is essentially responsible for the low end on stage and throughout the club.

I've gigged 210 and 112 combos (Fender, Markbass, Ampeg) and I feel like I am just not pushing enough air to provide the low end to the whole club.

I'm looking at getting the V7 head and the 210 + 112 cabinet. My thought process is, I can bring both for bigger places and get the full 700w at 4 ohms, and then maybe just bring one of them for smaller places. They're both light and portable which is a huge plus, and the sound demos I've heard all sound great.

Right as I'm about to pull the trigger, I realize the 112 is only rated for 250W and the 210 is only rated for 300W, which is less than half of the head?? I looked at downsizing the amp but the 300W amp doesn't have the compressor and I don't think you can add 2 extension cabs, also 300W is just not as much power as I want.

Do I have to pick a 410 or 212 to pair with this V7 head? I don't love the idea since they're a lot heavier and I need to be able to fit them in a car.

Should I look at other cabinet companies that are rated for more wattage?

What do you V7 owners use cabinet wise?

I'm in the same boat as you. I play in a 90's cover band and I'm playing similar size venues. I am currently using a 900 watt class D head with a 212 cabinet and I never have a problem being heard. It's a perfect rig. Small, light, powerful. I think the V7 amp with the venture 212 cab should be all you need.

 

[Eric Mull]

I'm in the same boat as you. I play in a 90's cover band and I'm playing similar size venues. I am currently using a 900 watt class D head with a 212 cabinet and I never have a problem being heard. It's a perfect rig. Small, light, powerful. I think the V7 amp with the venture 212 cab should be all you need.

Awesome, thanks for the feedback. What head and cab are you using?

 

[direktor]

I think the V7 amp with the venture 212 cab should be all you need.

Having just bought the V12 and VB-410, I would agree.

It’s more than almost anybody needs. That V7+212 combo is popular for a reason.

 

[Pulverizor]

Isn't the 212AV cab regarded as having the 'classic' Ampeg tone?

If you need to carry the room then at least get the 410 rather than potentially driving the 210&112 to destruction.

 

[Aloe]

Awesome, thanks for the feedback. What head and cab are you using?

you probably meant to quote @Up the dose, not me. somehow there's my name, but his message.

 

[EdwardofHuncote]

Most of mine are unmodified. Ironically, built by Alembic, who got their start (at least with the instrument side of the business) by modifying guitars and basses.

Here's a couple of my favorites....

1977 Series I.

2017 Custom Fretless.

 

[Eric Mull]

I'm in the same boat as you. I play in a 90's cover band and I'm playing similar size venues. I am currently using a 900 watt class D head with a 212 cabinet and I never have a problem being heard. It's a perfect rig. Small, light, powerful. I think the V7 amp with the venture 212 cab should be all you need.

Awesome, thanks for the info. What amp + cab are you using?

 

[Eric Mull]

you probably meant to quote @Up the dose, not me. somehow there's my name, but his message.

Yeah you're right, not sure what happened there.

 

[Up the dose]

Awesome, thanks for the info. What amp + cab are you using?

Streamliner 900 with the new GK Neo 212

 

[DaveParker39]

There might be an argument for getting a sub instead of a new amp.

Any time I have needed to "push more air" than my Rumble is able to I've needed the support of the PA because everyone else has to be louder too.

 

[Eric Mull]

There might be an argument for getting a sub instead of a new amp.

Any time I have needed to "push more air" than my Rumble is able to I've needed the support of the PA because everyone else has to be louder too.

That’s fair. I appreciate the feedback!

 

[mcrawfordmusic]

I reckon a 2x12, two 2x10's or a 4x10 is a good sized rig for just about anything. Keep a combo for smaller gigs.

I need some amp + cabinet advise from the vets.

I'm looking at getting my first real rig, and I'm really interested in the Venture series. I love the Ampeg sound and I gig in a 90s rock/grunge cover band, so I think it's a good fit.

I'm a weekend warrior that gigs about 4 times a month and we do our own sound 90% of time in small to medium sized bars.

I do run my amp through our PA but we don't have a sub. My amp is essentially responsible for the low end on stage and throughout the club.

I've gigged 210 and 112 combos (Fender, Markbass, Ampeg) and I feel like I am just not pushing enough air to provide the low end to the whole club.

I'm looking at getting the V7 head and the 210 + 112 cabinet. My thought process is, I can bring both for bigger places and get the full 700w at 4 ohms, and then maybe just bring one of them for smaller places. They're both light and portable which is a huge plus, and the sound demos I've heard all sound great.

Right as I'm about to pull the trigger, I realize the 112 is only rated for 250W and the 210 is only rated for 300W, which is less than half of the head?? I looked at downsizing the amp but the 300W amp doesn't have the compressor and I don't think you can add 2 extension cabs, also 300W is just not as much power as I want.

Do I have to pick a 410 or 212 to pair with this V7 head? I don't love the idea since they're a lot heavier and I need to be able to fit them in a car.

Should I look at other cabinet companies that are rated for more wattage?

What do you V7 owners use cabinet wise?

I think the V7 and a pair of 2x10's would be a better option and what I would personally go for, but a 2x10 and 1x12 rig is becoming a popular choice for many players. I would be asking Ampeg if they recommend that pairing.