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Used bases aren't selling well.
- Thread starter darwin-bass
- Start date
I think people dont realize how much shipping, paypal, gas, a box and your time to go to the post office factors into prices on tb. If I sell a bass here for a posted price of $800 , say a USA standard fender, I won't even net $700 after shipping and PayPal fees, so why offer it for less when you can just wait on a local deal? Then there is the chance a member here wants a return, with Craigslist as soon as they drive way you don't have that worry. I price stuff here at basically what I have to get to make it even worth selling here and then at least 75% of the time it sells on Craigslist. I just paid $130 to ship a jazz in a tolex case fully insured $1000.
IMO, it certainly seems harder to search the classifieds under the new format than it used to be. Actually, it seems harder to search any of the forums. I usually use a google search now with 'talkbass' added. I figured I just forgot how to search, but maybe not.
I have what you would all consider a fantastic day job...and I'm basically completely broke. I did just buy a bass off TB because it's exactly what I've been watching for, the five string version of my main 4 string US milli. It was cheaper than either of my other 4 string millis. I also bought it after needing it for a couple of songs I'll be covering. I wouldn't be buying anything to just try out right now. I also need to get rid of 4 other basses to make some money, but I'm waiting for tax refund season and hoping the market is better then. I'll probably try to use one of them for trade bait for a pedal that I specifically need for a cover...once again, not to just experiment with. So, I think the market problem here is a combination of every single thing everyone has mentioned.
I have what you would all consider a fantastic day job...and I'm basically completely broke. I did just buy a bass off TB because it's exactly what I've been watching for, the five string version of my main 4 string US milli. It was cheaper than either of my other 4 string millis. I also bought it after needing it for a couple of songs I'll be covering. I wouldn't be buying anything to just try out right now. I also need to get rid of 4 other basses to make some money, but I'm waiting for tax refund season and hoping the market is better then. I'll probably try to use one of them for trade bait for a pedal that I specifically need for a cover...once again, not to just experiment with. So, I think the market problem here is a combination of every single thing everyone has mentioned.
?????
How can you tell when someone is holding the good stuff if they are not putting them up for sale? Are you clairvoyant or something?
I do the same thing! It really narrows things down to what you actually want. The TB search tool isn't the greatest...
As I stated a couple posts above yours, resale has ALWAYS typically been at most 60% of new. I'm not singling you out, just quoting you because this point can't be emphasized enough.
Asking more than 60% of new is too much and that's for mint condition. The basses & amps I am very familiar with have no problem selling for a reasonable price, and quickly, whether here or on eBay or Craigslist. No change as far as I can see.
Those who start high and come down to a fair range manage to sell. Those who hold out for above-average also tend to sell eventually if it's a darling brand, but even then it seems to sell to someone who really doesn't know the market or just really wants that color or configuration and is willing to pay a premium.
I've found it weird that I can't find some models for sale used locally or on Ebay. Try to find a Classic Vibe P bass for example. The used prices are damn near the new prices if you happen to find them. I think people are hanging onto those instruments.
Were they new or used?
Please keep this forum bass related.
What's the best alpaca for metal?
I agree with this 100%. My first bass was a Univox hiflyer (mosrite copy)($115 in 1971). Matsumoku my #$$; those things used are commanding way too high of a price for their inferior quality. It was a good bass to learn on, but I just did a trade and received a Squire VM P5,
it is like new, but if I bought it new, the price is $299.
It absolutely kills. Wish I had this thing when I was learning.
Yeah please take the politics over to a PM conversation. We don't do that here. Thanks.
what we have now is a scenario where you walk into a guitar/bass store (such as GC or Sam Ash, etc) and you're surrounded with $199-$299 instruments galore, brand new... looking nice and shiny...
So when someone tries to sell a premium instrument, he's combating the mindset that $1000 is expensive... even if this premium instrument is worth many thousands..
I recently STOLE a Spector NS4 in "like new" condition for $3000.... the same bass (identical) sells for $6-8K new..
Craigslist hasn't helped things either.. between the flakes, and the lowballers it's hard to get a good price for anything on there.. Everything thinks it's a garage sale..
So when someone tries to sell a premium instrument, he's combating the mindset that $1000 is expensive... even if this premium instrument is worth many thousands..
I recently STOLE a Spector NS4 in "like new" condition for $3000.... the same bass (identical) sells for $6-8K new..
Craigslist hasn't helped things either.. between the flakes, and the lowballers it's hard to get a good price for anything on there.. Everything thinks it's a garage sale..
Burwabit
Likes guitars that tune good and firm feelin women
I couldn't agree more. I'm a spreadsheet geek so I built a tool to help me price things in different forums. It also helps me quickly respond to offers based on what my take home would be. Below is a sample for the Jazz I'm currently selling. I want to net $900 on it, so it's priced accordingly on Talkbass, Reverb, and eBay. If I were to get say a $900 offer, I'd only net $824 assuming $50 shipping.
2008, IMO, was a peak both for vintage instruments and used instruments in general (as a percentage of new prices), and now prices are more normal. That was a time when people were leveraging themselves to the hilt in other areas.
What you have now is people anchoring on those days, when it was easier to flip basses and make money or break even, and thinking it should always be like that. Nope. Trees don't grow to the sky.
I listed 2 basses on consignment via BassNW.com (Bass Northwest store in Pioneer Square in Seattle) just before the Holidays, and they both sold at asking price within 1 week! That was the quickest turnaround I've seen in years, and I didn't have to lift a finger to advertise or ship them.
If you want to move stuff, there are plenty of options. In fact, things seem to move pretty rapidly these days as long as they're not overpriced.
If you want to move stuff, there are plenty of options. In fact, things seem to move pretty rapidly these days as long as they're not overpriced.
Burwabit
Likes guitars that tune good and firm feelin women
The vintage market was already beginning to slip in '07...I'd say that in general the peak was just prior to that. For example, prices on '50s Les Paul Juniors (which speculation had pushed to unrealistic highs) and pre-CBS Strats had come down, but it wasn't a crash. The economic collapse in September 2008 definitely precipitated a bottom drop out, though. That has only just begun to recover now. Vintage basses took a particularly bad hit, possibly because there are like 100 guitar players for every bass player and a minority of those are vintage bass collectors. Also, many modern bassists have to have a 5 (or even 6) string bass, or one with active electronics, making a vintage bass a non-starter, particularly one for for big $.
Being an old geezer who's been buying and selling guitars for 40 years, I'd never seen the economy affect the vintage guitar market before 2008. I really thought that guitars were insulated from the economy, but I was very wrong. Then again, there wasn't a economic crash event as extreme as '08 in my lifetime prior to that.
As a new bass player I can say that since I don't know what I don't know about used basses, Guitar Center has a big head-start over the classifieds since I can return a used bass if it's a bad fit for me. Sellers here have feedback but resolving a dispute isn't as simple as just going to GC and returning.
To give you an idea of what interests me in the classifieds, I'm looking to upgrade from my used SR300 to something more solid in the $500-$700 range. Had I been here prior to buying the SR300 I likely would have bought it or something similar for <$200 (this seems to fit with an earlier poster's summary of who the market is here). Spending upwards of $700 on a used bass from a private party is intimidating and makes GC that much more appealing to me.
Regarding prices, I don't know what basses have retailed for in the past though I saw a new MIA Fender Jazz at $1400+ in GC (gulp). Regardless, I don't understand why sellers think they should get back what they paid for their used basses or make a profit (with exceptions for those that are in demand or purchased very cheap). Maybe that's how it worked before but the world has changed drastically in the last 5 years or so. Among other things, everyone can see market prices with a quick google search and if your price isn't competitive then people will go elsewhere. Whatever you think your bass is worth, the reality is that it's worth what the market will pay for it.
So how do you deal with that? Simple: buy basses to play or stare at, not sell. If you decide to sell a used bass, accept that you will take a loss just like you would on most anything else that's used. If you break-even or profit then the bass gods are smiling on you!
I'd add one last thing: IMO gear sold here should be cheaper than a GC. I know you don't want to hear that but there needs to be a compelling reason for a buyer to shop here instead of no-risk GC.
Edit: To clarify if I wasn't clear, I'm comparing TB classifieds to shopping used at GC (not new). I wouldn't buy new.
To give you an idea of what interests me in the classifieds, I'm looking to upgrade from my used SR300 to something more solid in the $500-$700 range. Had I been here prior to buying the SR300 I likely would have bought it or something similar for <$200 (this seems to fit with an earlier poster's summary of who the market is here). Spending upwards of $700 on a used bass from a private party is intimidating and makes GC that much more appealing to me.
Regarding prices, I don't know what basses have retailed for in the past though I saw a new MIA Fender Jazz at $1400+ in GC (gulp). Regardless, I don't understand why sellers think they should get back what they paid for their used basses or make a profit (with exceptions for those that are in demand or purchased very cheap). Maybe that's how it worked before but the world has changed drastically in the last 5 years or so. Among other things, everyone can see market prices with a quick google search and if your price isn't competitive then people will go elsewhere. Whatever you think your bass is worth, the reality is that it's worth what the market will pay for it.
So how do you deal with that? Simple: buy basses to play or stare at, not sell. If you decide to sell a used bass, accept that you will take a loss just like you would on most anything else that's used. If you break-even or profit then the bass gods are smiling on you!
I'd add one last thing: IMO gear sold here should be cheaper than a GC. I know you don't want to hear that but there needs to be a compelling reason for a buyer to shop here instead of no-risk GC.
Edit: To clarify if I wasn't clear, I'm comparing TB classifieds to shopping used at GC (not new). I wouldn't buy new.
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let me just say the following....
EVERY bass I own, barring one (the single H Stingray) was ordered directly from the factory by either myself or it's original owner, and never sat on the rack at a GC where every kid and their mother played with it to their hearts content.. Sometimes (especially on higher priced, higher up the rack) basses, they're clean and rarely touched, but for the most part a bass sitting at GC for a month has the equivalent wear and tare on it of a bass I've owned for two years!
So when/if I sell a bass on here, I know it's history and I impart this on the buyer as a value added item.
while the 30 day return policy at GC is great, you have to be VERY careful what you buy there... I got very lucky with my EBMM, it was it's 2nd day on the rack and only played by one of the salesman, or I'd never have taken it home if it was a depository of 100's of hands worth of fingerprints!
