vintage mutron III

[BioDriver]

The Groove Regulator from 3 Leaf is another filter you should try. No volume spike, no tone suck, and filled with ooey-gooey-funky-stunky-munky-juice.

That's why I got one! I'm too bloody poor to afford a Mutron (or a Meatball for that matter) so this was the closest I could get.

Also, I remember seeing "revived/updated Mutrons" being sold as the Mutron III+. How do those compare to the real deal?

 

[groooooove]

That's why I got one! I'm to bloody poor to afford a Mutron (or a Meatball for that matter) so this was the closest I could get.

Also, I remember seeing "revived/updated Mutrons" being sold as the Mutron III+. How do those compare to the real deal?

those are the reissues, and they stink.


i did play a 3leaf and really, really liked it. but it wasent as phat as the FX25, nor did it have the real mutron wetness to it.

 

[mikeboth]

Also, I remember seeing "revived/updated Mutrons" being sold as the Mutron III+. How do those compare to the real deal?

If you are talking about the Haz Labs products, they don't use opto-electronics for the 'wahing' part of the filter, but instead use a kind of FET. So, while the filter type is the same (state-variable, where HP, BP and LP outputs are available at the same time), the actual filter response is not the same as in the original pedal.

The designer of the Mutron III steers people away from the III+ and towards Qtrons (they use the opto method for varying the filter frequency), and I'd do the same. Don't buy a III+ and think you'll get something sounding exactly like the III.

 

[fightthepower]

Volume Spike - when a sting was picked with conviction my original mutron could rattle some teeth - but the Carl Martin Compressor tamed this.

How was this related to the pedal not being true-bypass?

 

[Hoover]

the Musitronics stuff has lived up to the hype. Their octave, filter and phaser (the phasor II anyway, haven't tried the original Phasor) are all amazing IMO.

The only one that disappointed me was the flanger. It was fine, but really it's only valued because of its rarity. As flangers go there are quite a few that I think are better.

Musitronics made a flanger?!?!?!?

 

[Jared Lash]

Musitronics made a flanger?!?!?!?

Indeed.

They seem to go for between $1700 and $2000 these days.

The flanger did have one cool feature, the "built-in" expression control. Here's a clip on guitar which sounds pretty good IMO. I found it too thin sounding on bass.

 

[groooooove]

im pretty sure one of the old flangers just sold on ebay for close to $2000.. insane.


im really curious why nobody actually mades a half-decent copy of the real thing- not a totally different filter in the same box (III+)

 

[mikeboth]

im really curious why nobody actually mades a half-decent copy of the real thing

The closest you'll get (AFAIK) is the Q-tron. It's a Mutron III with some enhancements (true-bypass, boost, mix mode).

 

[markjazzbassist]

good question. the answer is going to be the very thing you don't want to hear though, "you have to try it for yourself".

for me, the tone is unbeatable and delicious, BUT the gain control sucks because to get that tone (for me and my passive basses) i need to be boosting the signal and then my filtered tone is noticeable hotter than my bypassed tone.

that didn't cut it for me. so i have a couple filters that i use that don't boost the signal (chunk agent funk, ehx bassballs) and use those.

do i still have a mutron? you bet. i'll always have one, they have "the filter tone", but until i can find a way to beat that boost, it'll stay a studio piece.

 

[groooooove]

for me, the tone is unbeatable and delicious, BUT the gain control sucks because to get that tone (for me and my passive basses) i need to be boosting the signal and then my filtered tone is noticeable hotter than my bypassed tone.

does it behave with active electronics? my two mains are active..

The closest you'll get (AFAIK) is the Q-tron. It's a Mutron III with some enhancements (true-bypass, boost, mix mode).

ive heard that, but at the same time refuse to buy anything from electro harmonix anymore. (gave them more chances than i should have.)

in starting this thread i was really hoping to get people to say "the 3leaf is just as good," or reccomend something atleast as cheap as $300.. but, for once, the TB community has spoken in favor of the hype around this pedal..

i feel like i cant justify buying it, being that i have and really like my FX25. but god help me, every time i hear the original recording of "make my funk the p funk" im amazed at how no filter sounds anything like that.

i guess it would make sence, to have the real mutron for the extra greasy funk gigs, and the DOD for when board space is limited, or if i dont think i'd use it as much for that particular night.

oh well..now i just gotta make sure i keep my eyes on the 'bay

 

[RCCollins]

ive heard that, but at the same time refuse to buy anything from electro harmonix anymore. (gave them more chances than i should have.)

you realize that the q-tron was designed by Mike Beigel, the designer of the Mu-Tron, right? He has described it as an improvement upon the original. Take that as you will

 

[sikamikanico]

He has described it as an improvement upon the original. Take that as you will

I'm sure it wasn't just marketing...

 

[Lindsay]

I'm sure it wasn't just marketing...

...or bitterness due to the fact that he sold Musitronics in exchange for future royalties to a company that went broke shortly after.


from somewhere:

Musitronics didn't have enough money to keep going with both the Gizmotron and the Mu-Tron line, so the company directors decided to sell Musitronics. Unfortunately, that's when we found ARP, a synthesizer company that was in the process of committing suicide with a guitar synth called the Avatar. We sold Musitronics to them in '78 on a royalty basis, but they folded before we could ever collect a cent. We became Gizmo Incorporated and continued to try to make it go, but then I had a heart attack and that was the end of it.

 

[RCCollins]

I'm sure it wasn't just marketing...

I said take it as you will. But while it may not be your favorite, the Q-tron IS the legit successor to the Mutron III, designed by the same dude.

It's funny- in the analog synth world, Musitronics is known as the company that KILLED Moog with its cost cutting measures and factory relocation. Yet in the world of pedalfreaks, it's a mark of mojo!

i'm sure not knocking the Mutron III. It's one of the effects that got me interested in effects. But at this point, there are TONS of envelope effects to choose from.

 

[bongomania]

god help me, every time i hear the original recording of "make my funk the p funk" im amazed at how no filter sounds anything like that.

Oh hey, guess what-- not even the most perfect original Mutron III sounds like that! Check out some threads about Bootsy's rig. In order to get that tone, he is splitting his bass signal into multiple channels (different pickups, different frequency ranges) and running each channel through its own filter or other effects. Bootsy's tone is literally unattainable unless you (a) have a lot of money and a roadie, or (b) lower your standards to a sound that you can convince yourself and the audience is "close enough".

Once you've lowered your standards the way we all do , you'll find that the tone quality of the Mutron III may not be worth the expense and the practical troubles of having it, compared to the other filters that have 80-90% of the tone and only 10-20% of the hassle, at 30-60% of the price.

 

[RCCollins]

Oh hey, guess what-- not even the most perfect original Mutron III sounds like that! Check out some threads about Bootsy's rig. In order to get that tone, he is splitting his bass signal into multiple channels (different pickups, different frequency ranges) and running each channel through its own filter or other effects. Bootsy's tone is literally unattainable unless you (a) have a lot of money and a roadie, or (b) lower your standards to a sound that you can convince yourself and the audience is "close enough".

Once you've lowered your standards the way we all do , you'll find that the tone quality of the Mutron III may not be worth the expense and the practical troubles of having it, compared to the other filters that have 80-90% of the tone and only 10-20% of the hassle, at 30-60% of the price.

I'm not at all sure that bootsy had that kind of setup back in 74-5 when that album was recorded (I'm pretty sure that famous configuration was his live setup with the Rubber Band, a couple years later). I could be wrong about that, but in a way it's immaterial - who knows what all they were messing with in those sessions. And I'm not just talking about gear!

 

[groooooove]

you realize that the q-tron was designed by Mike Beigel, the designer of the Mu-Tron, right? He has described it as an improvement upon the original. Take that as you will

i do know that, and agree that he would only say that for marketing purposes. i do like a lot lof EHX stuff, its just way too flimsy for me. the Qtron family i really never liked that much though.

Oh hey, guess what-- not even the most perfect original Mutron III sounds like that! Check out some threads about Bootsy's rig. In order to get that tone, he is splitting his bass signal into multiple channels (different pickups, different frequency ranges) and running each channel through its own filter or other effects. Bootsy's tone is literally unattainable unless you (a) have a lot of money and a roadie, or (b) lower your standards to a sound that you can convince yourself and the audience is "close enough".

Once you've lowered your standards the way we all do , you'll find that the tone quality of the Mutron III may not be worth the expense and the practical troubles of having it, compared to the other filters that have 80-90% of the tone and only 10-20% of the hassle, at 30-60% of the price.

i have seen the stuff about his rig, but wasent that from later in the 70s? im sure his rig was probably still really intence for that album though.

filters are really hard to judge. they might sound so greasy when your playing it in a music store, but then when your at the gig you feel like its barely giving you any quack when its in the mix.

if i was to pull the trigger on a differnt filter, i think i would either go with the 3leaf groove regulator, or if i can find a cheap one, the vintage mutron.

 

[fokof]

I own an original MutronIII , can't be copied that's for sure, but I must admit that the MutronIII emulation on the VB99 is "VERY" good........

 

[groooooove]

I own an original MutronIII , can't be copied that's for sure, but I must admit that the MutronIII emulation on the VB99 is "VERY" good........

really? i wouldent expect a unit like that to have a good envelope filter on it..

 

[bassbmx]

If I bought a vintage Mutron III over ebay, would it be worth the extra money to send it straight to Analogman or someone like that to get the caps replaced?

Also, would modding it for true bypass reduce resale value like changing parts out on a vintage Fender? I'm not too fussed because I don't think I'd be selling it anyway but thought I'd ask first.

Joe