Vintage Schecter?

[paddydaddyo]

So, I bought what was supposedly a vintage Schecter P-Bass recently. It arrived via UPS, and—as I usually do—immediately inspected it upon opening the box. That is, removing pickguard, pickups, checking for hidden damage, etc.

Unfortunately, I was immediately struck with the overwhelming impression that this isn't the vintage '80s Schecter It was purported to be ... and that there may not even be a single Schecter part in the entire build.

The bridge looks much more like an '80s Fernandes than any Schecter bridge I've ever seen. It is basically a dead ringer for a Fender bent-plate with single groove barrels ... but both the D and G string intonation screws are long. I thought was a little off immediately.

The body itself is ash, 3-tone sunburst, and beautiful. However, there are no markings or factory brands in the pickup route or the neck pocket. The pickguard is a 3-ply B/W/B that looks to be original to the body, but all of the screws are gold, not chrome like every other piece of hardware on the bass. Both it and the body were never drilled for a thumbrest/tugbar, which looks a lot like the high-quality Japanese copies of the late-'70s through early-'80s.

The pickup is not a Schecter Monstertone, and the pots aren't CTS. The grounding is factory wired to a base plate under the pickup, but with cutouts for the mounting screws (a la early Fenders) which again, reminds me of a vintage Japanese copy like A Tokai or Fernandes. The Schecters I've seen had a plate that was the outline of the pickups, complete with drilled tabs for mounting. If this is a Schecter mount, I've never seen one like it.

And the neck. It has no brand marking on the heel, just a few small Numbers in a blue-ish color ink. The trussrod adjusts from the heel, but the plugged end at the headstock looks odd to me. Again, I've never seen a Schecter neck where the hole was drilled so that it went into the bottom of the fretboard. There has definitely been some refinishing on the headstock face. The decal looks like it's been on there for a while, but the placement seems off to me.

Add to all of this that it sports a late-'70s Fender neck plate, with the black gasket and big F.

So I am in a pickle, it's a cool looking bass, has some genuine mojo and a beautiful 'burst on a nicely grained ash body. But I have this nagging feeling that it's not genuine, and the price was a bit high for a parts bin bass.

Add to all of this that the seller will accept the return, but I will be out over $200 in shipping, all told, and would have NOTHING to show for that.

Any vintage Schecter experts out there that can Shine some light?

EDIT: Pictures of the various parts mentioned above

 

[paddydaddyo]

So many crickets, so little time ...

I decided to work with the seller on a partial refund, and just keep it. I needed (!?! ... OK, OK ... WANTED) a workhorse P-Bass strung with flats again. I thought I was all done with gigging and being in a band back at the beginning of this Pandemonium in March, so I sold my '58 custom repro. Now I, of course, find myself on the verge of "putting something together" again with some local cats. And I also find myself without a flat-strung P-Bass for the first time in this Century. Don't know about y'all, but I gotta have one.

Still interested in getting to the bottom of this though. My best educated guesstimate is that it's actually an old Fernandes, with a Fender neck plate, that someone put a Schecter logo on. An odd mutt, with a story, that I will get set up to play and sound like a purebred champ ...

 

[deernaes]

Back before the internet and eBay and Reverb, there was a popular scam pulled on pawn shops that were just going by the Blue Book value of guitars.
Scammers would take a cheap instrument, create a waterslide decal of an expensive guitar, affix it and bring it in to the pawnshop. The pawnshop clerk would look it up, see that it's potentially worth X dollars and dish out the funds.
A pawnshop is my city had an "Alembic" that is probably still in the shop. It actually was a crappy P-bass clone, and the sticker simply said "Alembic Elan".
If sure they dished out quite a bit for it because it had a $1200 price tag on it.
I brought it to their attention and they just shrugged their shoulders.
If I'm not mistaken, Schecter was also another popular brand name back then because Schecter guitars were quite pricey....

 

[paddydaddyo]

Just to be clear, I don't actually "like this" ... but I totally believe it, and get it. This could be exactly one of those types of builds.

The silver lining is that it is actually a really beautiful, light, resonant bass that sounds pretty good already, and plays quite nicely. I have a set of scatterwound pickups I had wound back in '17 on some gray fiber with an early-'60s spec that I never installed, and the guts from a '71 Precision (CTS & Switchcraft) that have been in my spare parts box for years. The bridge is pretty bad off, but I also have several of those to choose from as well.

All-in-all, I'm feeling pretty good about it. Schecter, schmecter. It'll be a great bass.

 

[Lammchop93]

I don't know much about branding at all and how schecter marked but, but I'm almost positive schecter started as a parts company before making guitars, so it's very likely they didn't label all of their parts.

 

[paddydaddyo]

I don't know much about branding at all and how schecter marked but, but I'm almost positive schecter started as a parts company before making guitars, so it's very likely they didn't label all of their parts.

Yeah, it's a little weird for sure. But the big tells for me are;

1. I have never seen another Schecter maple/rosewood bass neck with the headstock end of the truss channel drilled through and plugged. On the all maple necks? Sure, that's the norm. But one the rosewood 'board necks, this is the only one I've ever seen, including tons of interwebs image searching.
2. The hardware for a "Schecter" is decidedly and completely un-Schecter. For example; the bridge is exactly the same in every way to the old Fernandes one I have in my parts bin. EXACTLY. From the D/G screws both being longer, to the diameter and grooves on the barrels, the plate dimensions and curve ... even the tiny indentation on the head of each intonation screw. The neck plate is from a late-'70s Fender (or is a reproduction), so that's also off. The tuners are ________.
   
3. The pickup and harness is absolutely not USA made. The pots are Japanese, the green drop capacitor has non-US markings, and the wire is thin and plastic coated. Not to mention the pickup grounding plate being different than the ones that Schecter made and used.

I could go on and on with examples and the research I've been doing, but as I said, I'm good with it being a funky old Frankencision.

I do have half a mind to take that decal off the headstock now though ... I certainly will if I ever decide to part company with it.

 

[Bob_Ross]

Any vintage Schecter experts out there that can Shine some light?

I would not call myself an "expert" but I'm definitely a vintage Schecter aficionado. I've played at least a dozen of them over the years -- mostly back when I worked for a Schecter dealer in the mid-1980s -- and I've owned one for the past ~25 years that I will never part with.

Your observations about the truss channel being drilled through/plugged, and the pickup grounding plates, are consistent with my experiences: Those do not strike me as genuine Schecter parts.

otoh, I've probably seen as many different bridges used on vintage Schecter basses as one could possibly find in the mid-1980s; in fact, I can only remember two of the ~12 basses I played having the same bridge! So I'm not sure that would be a dealbreaker.

You didn't mention specifically, but I'm guessing the tuning machines are not labeled "Schecter"?

 

[paddydaddyo]

You didn't mention specifically, but I'm guessing the tuning machines are not labeled "Schecter"?

Yeah, no markings whatsoever, hence the blank.

But I will add that the screw holding the gear on the plate:

... has the same little dot indentation as the screws on both the bridge that was mounted on it ...

... AND the rough bridge that I personally removed from a factory-original '81 Fernandes:

Yes, those are actually NOT the same picture.

Another interesting thing to point out is that the pickguard was not the original that was mounted on the body. When I removed it, I saw that there is the 14th hole drilled for the "center field" screw (in the middle of the pickguard, just below the G string), and the 15th, drilled for mounting the thumbrest at the '70s, top position. You can also make out that the pickup route of the original pickguard was different than this replacement, as there are extra pickup mounting screw holes in the cavity to make it fit (this perspective is looking at it from "the audience"):

To me, it seems most likely that it is a late-'70s Fernandes, that somebody put a different neck on, with a copied Schecter decal ...

 

[paddydaddyo]

I meant to mention that Gotoh tuners have that little dot indentation in the screw ... the only ones I've ever seen with it:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[UnDoNe]

Was this on Reverb? I think I was watching it for some time. Looks a good bass, regardless of its heritage.

I know a bit about the old Schecter pickups and this definitely isn't one of those. They should have the quarter inch pole pieces and be coil-tappable.

I did wonder if this could have been an old Fender in the ad (with the F neckplate) but doesn't seem that way with the pics you've added. Hope you enjoy it, regardless of what it is.

 

[paddydaddyo]

Was this on Reverb? I think I was watching it for some time. Looks a good bass, regardless of its heritage.

I know a bit about the old Schecter pickups and this definitely isn't one of those. They should have the quarter inch pole pieces and be coil-tappable.

I did wonder if this could have been an old Fender in the ad (with the F neckplate) but doesn't seem that way with the pics you've added. Hope you enjoy it, regardless of what it is.

It was on Reverb. I made an offer that was lower than the asking price, and after the initial discovery of its dubious heritage, worked out a partial refund. The seller was cool throughout, but remains convinced it is genuine.

I also thought it might be a late-'70s Fender body for a time there, but the lack of markings in the neck pocket, the pickup routing, and other tells made me realize otherwise. Regardless, it's a great bass, and I'll play it and enjoy it for sure!

 

[A-Step-Towards]

Every close up small detail besides the logo looks like a roughly 1983-1984 SQ serialized Squier Precision to me. I've had maybe 10 of them in my life. The tuners look like that. The plug at the headstock looks like that, they adjust via A Phillips screw at the heel. I didn't see your adjustment in the photos. The body is mainly what looks like a SQ Squier to me. They used a wood called Sen-ash much like American ash but it has a almost holographic look to it. SQ Squier also has metal shield under the pickups like that. I've built part basses out of SQ Squiers , I've parted them out and I even took a wiring harness from one to repair another bass and the wiring harness and cap were identical.

Never had a old Schecter so idk if they are usually this similar to an SQ Squier but that's what it looks like to me. Good news is MIJ SQ or JV Squiers are desirable not like a modern Squier at all. I'd pay up to $600 for a clean one if I wanted another.

 

[paddydaddyo]

Every close up small detail besides the logo looks like a roughly 1983-1984 SQ serialized Squier Precision to me ...

Yep, I think you nailed it.

I just spent an hour and a few cups of coffee this AM looking at early/mid-'80s Japanese SQ serialized Squier Precisions on the web. It's a total match, especially the odd plugged truss end that is halfway in both the board and the neck ... that's the real proof to me. In almost 40 years of bass buying, fixing, tweaking, and selling, that certainly seems unique to the model and builder. And it confirms the pickguard change I theorized, as the originals were white—and I'm obviously not alone in thinking that's about the worst looking color guard for a 3-tone sunburst body ... especially one that is this nice! That sen really is beautifully grained, and they did a great job shooting the 'burst too, with wide bands of deep color.

BTW: I personally have NO issue with quality-made Squiers—my avatar shot is a modded Squier that I built up actually—and in searching around about the SQ run basses, it seems that they do command a pretty fine price for a "bargain brand."

Thanks all for the input, I am now going to put this in the solved case file, and just enjoy playing it!