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Discussion in 'Orchestral Technique [DB]' started by tito mangialajo, Apr 16, 2009.

  1. tito mangialajo

    tito mangialajo

    Feb 1, 2006
    can you explain me what is the vomit?
  2. What the hell??? hahaha
  3. altruego


    Jun 6, 2008
    Oregon, USA
  4. CT DB

    CT DB

    Apr 27, 2007
    Fairfield Cty, CT
    In order to be somewhat helpful, and maybe get this thread back on track, I seem to have gathered from prior posts here that it is an exercise in shifting, in which one stays on the G string, say, and plays Ab, A, Ab, Bb, Ab, B, Ab, C, etc. using a fingering of 1-1, 1-1, 1-1, 1-1, all the way up the fingerboard, then do it over using 1-2, 1-2, 1-2, 1-2, then `1-4, the 2-1, etc. repeat.
  5. Bass


    Nov 10, 2003
  6. The goal/purpose of the Vomit Exercise is to make the arco sound clean and consistent from note to note, and between the notes during the shift. The shift has to be played in one bow. The fingerings are almost incidental.
  7. I recall seeing Gary Karr (the originator) demonstrate it years ago while here in Sydney but I do not recall it being a bowing exercise. My vague 20yo memory of Gary is playing,say, A Major on the G string, going A - B, A - C#, A -D,etc up two octaves or so then repeating the exercise, starting at the top and working down. Then perhaps moving to a different starting note and repeating. I recall he said it took 28 minutes daily (and was done while watching television?)

    I would see it as a way of building familiarity with the fingerboard,confidence in note finding and smooth relaxed shifting technique, especially when moving to and fro over the shoulders of the bass from neck into thumb position and back. Gliss the shift with two notes per bow for confidently approaching the pitches you want. Use separate bows and clean shifts to change the exercise towards also being a timing and coordination practice. If you are to keep a steady tempo then the further the shift the faster you move. It pays to keep the index finger on the string all the time, hooking over the string a little as you go into thumb position to avoid the embarrassment of pulling off sideways. Direct the energy of the shift along the string like a single railroad track

    When moving around the fingerboard between notes and positions we rely on a number of things. -

    Position to position, like two 3 dimensional settings of the hand and arm.

    The distance moved, measured by the thumb on the back of the and a finger, usually the index finger, in contact with the string.

    Your ear preferably pre-hearing the note you are moving to.

    A memory for pitch, at least for the tonic if in a key.

    There could still be some of Gary's students out there who could set us straight?

  8. Sam Sherry

    Sam Sherry Inadvertent Microtonalist Supporting Member

    Sep 26, 2001
    Portland, ME
    Euphonic Audio "Player"
    The search button works wonders.

    Ya woulda found this which I believe fills the bill.
  9. Posts #23 and #33 explain the exercise. The shifts require changes in the bow stroke. Focusing on the bow stroke is the purpose of the exercise. That is what makes it the Vomit Exercise and not a shifting exercise. There are any number of other shifting exercises whose purpose is designed the focus on shifts.
  10. I checked out you suggestion, DK,and understand the principle of directing bow energy at 90 degrees across the string while angling the bow to move the contact point.

    I at last found my notes of Gary's 1987 master class that describe vomit as a series of 16 fingering combinations for progressively shifting up and down a string over a range of two octaves -

    1 - 1, 1 - 2, 1 - 3, 1- 4
    2 - 1, 2 - 2, 2 - 3, 2 - 4
    3 - 1, 3 - 2, 3 - 3, 3 - 4
    4 - 1, 4 - 2, 4 - 3, 4 - 4 (this last one for only one octave)

    I'm sure I learned the "bow energy" idea later, possibly from Tom Martin, as a trick to prepare for big changes of register after which the bow straightened up at 90 degrees again to maintain good tone.


  11. Wang-Chi-Wang

    Wang-Chi-Wang Banned

    May 22, 2009
    it is when woman or man put hand down throte and then green water come up, it not nice but is good for before challenge audision.

  12. My teacher taught me to vomit in Bb.
    Its a 2 octave shifting excercise. Work on not speeding up the bow when shifting. Try to get a clean sound on the shift. You don't want to hear any glissando when shifting. You do this not by taking bow pressure off the string, but by slowing the bow during the shift.
    Try sliding your finger up the string with a fast bow. You'll really hear the shift. Try it again with a slower bow, the shift won't be as noticeable. That's the purpose of this exercise.

    Work on it slowly and stand up as tall as possible. 70 bpm with 2 clicks every note is a good speed.

    Bb-C(Down bow), C-Bb(up bow)
    Bb-D(down bow), D-Bb(up bow)
    Bb-Eb(down bow), Eb-Bb(up bow)
    ...all the way up two octaves, then down again.

    There are 16 finger combinations
    1,1 1,2 1,3 1,4
    2,2 2,1 2,3 2,4
    3,3 3,1 3,2 3,4
    4,4 4,1 4,2 4,3

    I usually vomit 4 times a day.
    All the way up and down on 1,1, All the way up and down on 1,2 etc. Then the next day it's 2,1 2,2 2,3 2,4..

    People in the other thread we're saying this is a glissando exercise. I was taught to aim for as little glissando between the shifts as possible.
  13. Marcus Johnson

    Marcus Johnson

    Nov 28, 2001
    Thanks, Patrick... having never been taught the vomit exercise, this is one of the clearest descriptions of it that I've seen. It would be cool if someone could post a vomit vid :meh: somewhere to illustrate it.
  14. tito mangialajo

    tito mangialajo

    Feb 1, 2006
  15. Vomiting on the thumb is pretty effective too for a) accuracy in thumb position and b) building up great callouses!
  16. punkjazzben


    Jun 26, 2008
    vomiting sounds awesome, i'm going to try it in the morning!
  17. Eric Swanson

    Eric Swanson

    Oct 8, 2007
    Boston, MA
    +1 on doing them with the thumb, too.

    I do a version of this that my former teacher taught me, adding the additional rigor of doing them as double stops, using various intervals. Shifting up and down, holding the left hand shape of P5ths, m and M 3rds, mostly.

    For me, this takes it to another level in terms of strength and intonation. Great for maintaining hand shape as we move up/down the neck.

    As a former serious student, I spent much time, daily, doing this. Now, as a hobbyist/dabbler, I still do a little bit, every day, just to keep intonation cool.
  18. cpaterso

    cpaterso Supporting Member

    Jan 4, 2007
    hi all - i just returned from the KarrKamp in Victoria BC. if you get a chance, go!! esp. if you are an arco player.

    i talked to Gary Karr and he said to say: "Gary Karr says the vomit exercise is a right hand bowing exercise."

    which is true. we did it every morning for 45 minutes, 5 days a week. it works you on slow bowing, close to the bridge, and using your shoulder/arm.

    it also - works on your left arm and your familiarity with the fingerboard, etc.

    BUT the main drive behind it is working on the right hand.

    yes, you start on Bb (or Ab if you are in solo tuning). start with first finger, go up and back down through two octaves.
    then first finger to second finger, up 2 octaves.
    then first finger to third ....

    then first to fourth, up onlhy one octave and back

    then start on second finger, go up and back to first, then second .....

    then third ...

    then fourth..

    do it slowly. should take you about 45 minutes. and you should feel the muscles around and below your shoulder blade.

  19. vomit is neither a right hand exercise nor a left hand exercise. it's a coordination exercise that addresses several aspects of playing.

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