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Want to see: Graphic EQ in a fly rig format
- Thread starter Stranger Danger
- Start date
You mean just like recordings that hasn't been ruined by post production nonsense such as mixing and mastering sounds much better?
And the EQ section of your bass and amp is somehow magically better than a dedicated equalizer exactly how and why?
I would think it would be the other way around.
Or are you saying that passive basses without any tone control and an amp without an EQ section is the best option, if so, why on Earth would that be?
Or perhaps your point is that any bass amplified through a totally flat response amp and cab that doesn't sound objectively great is a lesser instrument?
Of course you would be fully entitled to such an opinion, as am I to the opinion that that would be absurdly ridiculous.
i'm saying i've recorded in pro studios many times over and have never ever ever had an engineer throw a 10 band eq on my bass. compression, hpf, maybe a pultec style low end boost eq? sure. but if it sounds that bad that you need 10 bands to "fix your tone", i stand by my statement, get a better sounding bass, or strings, or amp settings. a holy grail "10 band eq" is never something i have encountered. Maybe in denmark you guys spend thousands on basses but that 250 dollar EQ is the real secret to your tone, great i'm happy for you.
i'm not saying passive or active or flat is better. i don't know what your tone preference is. i'm saying buy the bass and amp combo that will yield "the tone" for you and your preference. Why buy something that needs fixed? Just buy something is already there.
I don't know why you keep insisting on EQ'ing being wrong and some kind of cheap hack trick to fix something that is broken, rather than a serious tool to shape your tone the way you like it, your whole premise is wrong, and it's like you stubbornly deny that could indeed be that fact.
As if a great tone is any less great just because it wasn't achieved with a bass and amp alone and nothing else.
Of course there is absolutely nothing wrong with you being happy with whatever stock tone your bass and it's pickup got and the same with your amp, but some people have a more nuanced specific taste that there is no way to get from the limited amount of production basses and amps available on the market, doesn't mean that there is anything wrong with their bass that needs fixing, just means they have more specific needs and preferences.
Also just because an EQ has 10 bands it doesn't mean that you have to use them all, better that they are there than not, you're saying Trace Elliot was wrong in including a 12 band equalizer in their amp designs, or is that alright somehow because that EQ is build into the amp and not a pedal from EQ, however that is supposed to make sense?
In my opinion those old Trace Elliot amps are some of the greatest sounding amps ever made.
An EQ is not a cheap first aid hack fix for broken tones, it is a serious tool that allows you to shape your tone just the way you prefer it to be, giving infinite more options for personal customization than just buying the right bass and amp.
And you know what you can't really cheat, if the tone of your bass is not great to start with it is not going to magically become great no matter how you EQ it, but it will be possible to get it to sound more like the specific perfect tone in your head.
But even if it was possible to cheat, then what, what does that even mean, a great tone is a great tone no matter how it's achieved, wouldn't you agree?
You sure have some very odd fixed ideas, that seems to be limiting your options.
But if that is how you like it then feel free to, just don't pretend it to be some kind of law of nature that everyone else has to abide and that you somehow feel obliged to police, please.
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You mean just like recordings that hasn't been ruined by post production nonsense such as mixing and mastering sounds much better?
And the EQ section of your bass and amp is somehow magically better than a dedicated equalizer exactly how and why?
I would think it would be the other way around.
Or are you saying that passive basses without any tone control and an amp without an EQ section is the best option, if so, why on Earth would that be?
Or perhaps your point is that any bass amplified through a totally flat response amp and cab that doesn't sound objectively great is a lesser instrument?
Of course you would be fully entitled to such an opinion, as am I to the opinion that that would be absurdly ridiculous.
On the surface I sort of had the same reaction. But I think what he is trying to say is that ideally you select gear that sounds great without having to fuss with the EQ.
Something to consider is the amp and speaker are really sort of an extension of the bass. By this I mean all three are necessary to form a complete functional instrument, because electric bass does not really produce usable sound by itself. All three can have a major impact on the resultant tone and feel.
What I don't agree with is the idea that a 10-band graphic is extreme or reflects poorly on the user. If anything a 10-band is too limiting, and functionally a 30- or 31-band is way better; although not necessarily practical for this application...remember we are talking about a fly rig.
The problem with 10-bands is the frequency centers and bandwidths are fixed. Because of this you may not be able to adjust precisely the desired frequencies. With a 31-band, the filters are very narrow and there are so many of them that you can be more accurate/precise with you tone shaping. However, you can be even more accurate with a fully parametric EQ.
So one way to use a powerful EQ is you get full-range, flat-response rig, and then you adjust the EQ to achieve different types of tone. The idea is you can change your sound to fit the situation, rather than being locked into a rig with one baked in sound. The tone controls on most amps are good for dialing in one or two basic sounds, but nowhere near as flexible as a good EQ.
Another thing a powerful EQ is good for is dealing with bad room acoustics. The tone control on most amps are not flexible enough to really help in this area, but some are better than others.
For a fly rig, a 10-band would probably be fine. I own an MXR KFK-1 and it's not perfect but it actually works pretty well. This type of EQ works fine with or without a preamp. For example if I needed to quickly build a fly rig and did not want to spend cash on a preamp/DI, I would probably hook up a compressor, tuner, KFK-1, and then connect a DI to one of the KFK's dual mono outs. I have quite a few other effects that could be added as required, but I usually play clean with bass.
Depending on the situation, I might add a small IEM mixer of some sort like a Rolls PM351. The idea is so I have the direct ability to balance the signal of my bass and vocal mic in my IEM mix. I might even go a bit higher tech and get a Radial JS3 mic splitter and use a higher quality mini-mixer. Usually I worked with a great audio tech so running my own IEM mixer was not necessary.
IMHO whether you should should use an EQ is really a personal choice. Some people are good at and enjoy tweaking. Others hate tweaking and get confused if they have too many controls to deal with. The trick is to know yourself and build an appropriate rig that does what you want it to do. As the proverb says: There is more than one way to skin a cat.
thank you, i am not the greatest with words as evidenced by the visceral reactions on here to my post. what you have said is exactly what i am trying to say, especially the underlined.
Might I remind you that this was your initial reply to OP in this thread :
Ever got as far as to thinking that OP might in fact be very happy with his bass and amp but maybe just wish something a little more specific or the option for more variety, that OP's tone might very well not be broken at all, and that that is not really how you are supposed to use an equalizer in the first place, to fix broken tones?
The fact that you didn't indicates that you indeed have some sort of irrational knee jerk reaction against the use of external equalizers and other devices that can be used to improve and tailor your tone to your specific personal preferences in a way that can't be achieved with a bass and amp alone.
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@markjazzbassist ,
But do you still proclaim that someone using a graphic eq to achieve their tonal goals is wrong? Why is it wrong or invalid?
Have you seen the number of devices some bass players use to achieve their tone? How is a graphic eq any different?
But do you still proclaim that someone using a graphic eq to achieve their tonal goals is wrong? Why is it wrong or invalid?
Have you seen the number of devices some bass players use to achieve their tone? How is a graphic eq any different?
not wrong just if I was having to do that much tone shaping I would look upstream like I said. If you want to buy a mid heavy bass then carve all all the mids have at it. Or you could just buy a scooped bass and then you don't need the eq.
And then 10 other basses for 10 other tones you need, instead of just buying a single great equalizer pedal that with the right settings could do the same for you, and 10 more, or even more again, with maybe just 2 great basses, or even perhaps just 1?
You'd have a problem the day you need a mid heavy tone from that scooped bass, an equalizer is not going to add those missing frequencies you know, with the right EQ'ing a bass that is mid heavy to begin with, or even better had a more flat frequency response, on the other hand would be able to do both, and just as well.
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Let's see if the suggestions of others might help us. Both directions are correct. One could be tone shaping. One could be using an eq to try fix problems that are inherent in mismatches of head and cab, mismatched ohms, over eqing at the head, poor gain staging between pre and post sections of the head, wrong cab choice for the tone desired, string choice, grounding issue in bass, mis wired pickups, weak bass for the musical style, etc.
I bought an MXR ac powered ten band floor pedal because I was not getting enough low tones from a Tele bass through a Marshall Lead 100 into a Fender 2x15 JBL cab. The square one with the speaks diagonally. Where should I start? The cab couldn't do it. The head could if it had been tuned up and I was putting it through a 2x15 properly sized and ported cab.
From personal experience: You can't add what the rig can't reproduce. You can't add what isn't there from the bass. You can get this perfect setup based on gear then get to a different room and need a day to sort it for that room. Meanwhile another bassist comes in, plugs into some random house backline with just a cord and tears up. The crowd is jumping until they are spent. When that happens you will know beyond any advice here that it is in your fingers and your intention to make your bass speak and drive your band. You will see and hear that that bassist is way out there making music. He has sorted his ears, his fingers and his bass to do great time to make the music.
I bought an MXR ac powered ten band floor pedal because I was not getting enough low tones from a Tele bass through a Marshall Lead 100 into a Fender 2x15 JBL cab. The square one with the speaks diagonally. Where should I start? The cab couldn't do it. The head could if it had been tuned up and I was putting it through a 2x15 properly sized and ported cab.
From personal experience: You can't add what the rig can't reproduce. You can't add what isn't there from the bass. You can get this perfect setup based on gear then get to a different room and need a day to sort it for that room. Meanwhile another bassist comes in, plugs into some random house backline with just a cord and tears up. The crowd is jumping until they are spent. When that happens you will know beyond any advice here that it is in your fingers and your intention to make your bass speak and drive your band. You will see and hear that that bassist is way out there making music. He has sorted his ears, his fingers and his bass to do great time to make the music.
Phil Bombs FTWView attachment 4413300 View attachment 4413301
You know what they say?
Different Strokes for Different Folks!
View attachment 4413305
Didn't mean to start a flame fest. Looking for a tone shaping tool that I can use to fine tune things when I want and turn off when I want something else. I like the FR format and think something wider and thinner would naturally lend itself to this function. That's all!
Where do you like to put yours? At the end?I would recommend getting a Source Audio EQ2.
Don't know why you want something bigger?
I put the EQ in the Preamp FX Loop of the DSM Simplifier Bass Station.
This way, the lows under 100hz are unaffected and stay clean.
Another sugestion: The Mooer Radar. It has a really powerfull eq section that can be used solo if you want. It has graphic and parametric eq and fits perfectly in the spot that you have available.
