What’s wrong with stiff strings?

[Raman]

I used to play roundwounds forever. Lately, I switched to flatwounds.

I first installed a set of D’addario chrome light gauge. I like them quite a lot. Then, last week I ordered and installed a set of Fender stainless steel medium gauge (Fender 9050M) on my Squier CV Precision. Simply because I chanced upon a set for sale and had heard good things about Fender 9050s.
So, a lot is new for me about these strings: Still new to flats, stainless steel and the heavier gauge.


One very regular comment I’ve been reading is people find the medium gauge “way too stiff”. I’m wondering what is meant by that. Does it mean harder to pluck and to fret? Does it mean your hands will get tired more quickly? Does it mean it’s harder to perform some techniques, like popping or playing faster higher up on the neck? Or, is it just a matter of not liking the stiff feel under your fingers?

So far, after only a few days, yes I do feel they are stiffer under the fingers, but it's not completely clear to me why it's such a problem for so many people.

I’m also wondering: If it’s a matter that fatter strings are harder to pluck and fret, but at the same time won’t bounce around so much because of their stiffness, wouldn't lowering the action compared to light gauges be a solution?


Finally, if anybody here is a fan of fatter strings, I’d like to know why, and whether you think they should be approached differently in either set up or play technique.

Thanks.

 

[michael_t]

One very regular comment I’ve been reading is people find the medium gauge “way too stiff”. I’m wondering what is meant by that. Does it mean harder to pluck and to fret? Does it mean your hands will get tired more quickly? Does it mean it’s harder to perform some techniques, like popping or playing faster higher up on the neck?

Yes, yes and yes.

How one wants a set of strings to FEEL is a matter of personal preference. No right or wrong. My 65-yr-old hands are not what they used to be, especially after two surgeries on each hand. So, I like a set of strings that are comfortable to play on but still firm enough not to go all flippity-flop for plucking. That means a relatively light set of hex-core strings for me. Again, just my personal choice for optimal comfort and playability.

 

[smeet]

I generally prefer the feel of stiffer strings. But flexible strings allow me to be more expressive with vibrato, which I use a lot even though I don’t really bend the strings. I can also get that “smacking the heck out of the strings” sound without actually using much force.

I recently moved from hex (low riders) to round cores (fat beams), really enjoying the way I can control the tone and attack.

 

[trothwell]

Another variable is how long you play at one time. I had a moderately heavier set of flat wounds on a few years ago, and it felt to me initially. But after playing for (say) an hour, my hands felt noticeably more fatigued vs. using a lighter set.

 

[Raman]

Another variable is how long you play at one time. I had a moderately heavier set of flat wounds on a few years ago, and it felt to me initially. But after playing for (say) an hour, my hands felt noticeably more fatigued vs. using a lighter set.

I haven't really played for a long time in a row since I installed them, but I was worried about that.

 

[seanm]

I find that with a loud band, your fingers get very sore playing stiff flats after a few hours. I don't have that problem with the same bass/strings and a band with moderate volume.

I always play flats live but I started using rounds for practice since they are easier on the fingers. YMMV.

 

[FrenchBassQC]

Stiffer strings will get your hands tired quicker if you're not used to play with that type of strings.

 

[mambo4]

I play TI jazz flats almost exclusively. They are considered on the floppy end of flats.
I find TI jazz flats really help put the tone "in the fingers"
My intuition is that a stiffer string is less responsive to variation in right hand technique.

 

[Raman]

I play TI jazz flats almost exclusively. They are considered on the floppy end of flats.
I find TI jazz flats really help put the tone "in the fingers"
My intuition is that a stiffer string is less responsive to variation in right hand technique.

Good call!

Now that you say it, I realize that they absorb a lot more of my dynamics and release it smoother. They're the mechanical equivalent of a compression pedal!
I've been playing solo in a quiet environment, and I tend to pluck softly. So I haven't noticed any soreness or tiredness. Though I see that, in a band situation, I could be tempted to play harder in order to get more dynamics through.

 

[mattj1stc]

I’m in the opposite camp. I prefer stiffer, higher tension strings. I like La Bella Jamerson flats for 4 string bass guitars. I also like the Steve Harris Rotos. Both are arguably the stiffest, highest tension flats. I use a balanced set of Kalium rounds on my 5 string with a .150 B string. My upright has Spirocore S42s and I’m thinking about moving up to the Starks.

 

[Raman]

I’m in the opposite camp. I prefer stiffer, higher tension strings. I like La Bella Jamerson flats for 4 string bass guitars. I also like the Steve Harris Rotos. Both are arguably the stiffest, highest tension flats. I use a balanced set of Kalium rounds on my 5 string with a .150 B string. My upright has Spirocore S42s and I’m thinking about moving up to the Starks.

What type of music do you play?

 

[Rib 13]

I play .40s.....my attitude is "They're bass strings: They're already big" .....that being said, thicker strings do sound richer and fuller, but they make me play sluggishly......I do have a practice bass strung with .45s laying around the house as my grab-n-shred bass.....after I workout on this thing, picking up my other basses is like a hot knife going through butter

 

[TjMetalhead]

For me it wears out my hands faster. I have minor carpal tunnel so stiff strings are a no go. I've been using TI flats for a year now and I'm never gonna use anything else.

 

[Grinderman]

There are strings that I've tried that aren't quite as stiff as I'd prefer; Dunlop 40-100 flats for example. The same make of strings but 45-105 are better in this regard. On the other hand I think 40-100 Fender 9050L flats feel okay, better than the Dunlop stings in the same gauge.

I'm reasonably sure there must also be some strings that would feel too stiff to me.

What someone else thinks are stiff strings may or may not be stiff to me or vice versa; therefore, I can't really answer the question.

 

[Raman]

There are strings that I've tried that aren't quite as stiff as I'd prefer. I'm reasonably sure there must also be some strings that would feel too stiff to me.

What someone else thinks are stiff strings may or may not be stiff to me or vice versa; therefore, I can't really answer the question.

At least you tried, I think...

 

[Raman]

Ok, so I've been playing with the 9050M as this thread unfolds.

I'm being mindful of the stress on my hands. I'm especially concerned about this. I have very strong hands, but they cramp a lot. (It's actually being investigated medically.) I don't want to stupidly start using strings that will accelerate the issue.

This said, I am liking these strings a lot! I'm currently playing unplugged. Just a couple tracks I need to learn: Fleetwood Mac's Rhiannon and Fiona Apple's About love. I love the vibe that I'm getting from these super fat flats. It's as close to a double bass as I've felt on an electric. The strings in themselves produce a rich rumble.

I love these strings so far. But I'll have to be mindful about any hand stress.

 

[Grinderman]

At least you tried, I think...

I imagine there's probably some make and gauge of strings out there that have the most ideal amount of stiffness for me, out of all the possible strings in the world. I also figure it's quite possible, if not likely, I'll never happen upon those strings. I even reckon that if I were fortunate enough to try those most ideal strings I might not fully appreciate them for being the absolute best for me, in the moment.

I accept that there is an element of the unknowable so I'm open to simply being satisfied with any number of possibilities as long as they fit within some range of flexibility or stiffness that's acceptable to me. I only know what's within the realm of acceptable to me when I feel it.

I have no recollection of strings that were so stiff they stressed my hands, caused tendon soreness or fatigue, at least not for some decades. I think I'm more likely to become mentally fatigued from playing than my hands physically. Roughness of strings is also more of a concern than stiffness but that's only with certain stainless round wounds such as Roto 66.

 

[Chrisk-K]

Who told you that stiff strings cause an issue? It’s a personal preference to like loose vs stiff strings. Some like high tension strings and others like low tension strings.

 

[Raman]

Who told you that stiff strings cause an issue? It’s a personal preference to like loose vs stiff strings. Some like high tension strings and others like low tension strings.

I read many threads before asking the question. In those threads, the comment "Way too stiff!" came up a lot.

 

[Gothic]

I had a set of 9050m flats on a precision myself. I'd grown to love their tone but they're just way too stiff for me and I found fatigue in my fretting hand to set in much quicker. Not to mention, at some point the bass was also fighting back and I had to keep turning the truss rod to "reign them in", so to speak (that's a bass issue though, not the strings' fault). So out they went.
Mind you, I do prefer "floppier" strings for many reasons. My favorite flats are TI's. Currently, the heaviest, stiffest set I've got is LaBellas 760FS on a '51 P copy. They're not really light but they're also not 9050m stiff.