What are good amps for bar gigs?

[punkjazzben]

Yes, for a living. And my primary concern is not what bar patrons care about because if I do it right, they'll hear just fine. And I have small modular rigs that I've used in bars with great results.

If what people at a bar care about or can discern is important to you, cool.

I was really just pointing out that people at bars tend to not care at all - if it sounds like music, it's all good. If you think your bass sounds good in that kind of venue, that's all there is. Little point fretting about whether we should or shouldn't be mixing cabs in such a situation, especially if you haven't the resources to be picky about it.

 

[makaspar]

Dual Ampeg SVT4 Pros on top of dual SVT 8x10s!! Just turn it down a bit.

 

[chadds]

Why has this thread been hijacked by a futile discussion of teh evils of mixing cabs/drivers? As if anyone at a bar cares or can hear the difference, or you actually need more than one cabinet at a pub, or the majority of people can afford to be this picky. Do you pedants even play live music?

Ben, glad you asked it.
I was on TB when a poster was stating emphatically that his cab really cut through in the mix. Silly me! I thought he might have meant a stage setup with Hammond B3, horn section, rhythm section, backup vocalists, etc.
Well no.
He is in his basement with his son on drums and his early teen daughter on trumpet.
The Internet.

 

[punkjazzben]

Dual Ampeg SVT4 Pros on top of dual SVT 8x10s!! Just turn it down a bit.

Mustang Sally never sounded so good! Bar patrons will be talking about it for decades to come!

 

[slap5string]

And maybe it's not the only setup you've ever known.


And you can't assure that any more with an unknown mixed cab setup than an unknown single cab or dual cab setup. You simply can't... because there is no single definitive example of either.

Why do people do this? I've checked the onstage and room dispersion (using a wireless and pro audio personel) often enough that your assurances ring hollow IME. And I've no doubt others could experience similar results.

Your opinion, your experience differs from mine. My band has been the house band for many a musicians night, at the same venue and I have had the luxury of being able to hear my rig on stage while other people play and have experimented with MANY cab combinations, so I CAN offer my opinion based on MY experience. You don't have to believe or discredit me, just do a search and you will find many TBers share my opinion.

 

[Twenty2AcaciaAv]

Okay, here are some of the details.

We have two guitarsist, myself on bass, a vocalist, and a drummer. The drummer is usually mic'd but he doesn't get extremely load. I can usually hear myself through my cab. We play mainly hard rock and a little bit of metal. During practices I can hear myself with my volume at 12 o'clock.

This has to do more with wanting to know of a good quality amp within my budget. I know taht if I want louder stage volume to get anoher cab.

 

[punkjazzben]

Okay, here are some of the details.

We have two guitarsist, myself on bass, a vocalist, and a drummer. The drummer is usually mic'd but he doesn't get extremely load. I can usually hear myself through my cab. We play mainly hard rock and a little bit of metal. During practices I can hear myself with my volume at 12 o'clock.

This has to do more with wanting to know of a good quality amp within my budget. I know taht if I want louder stage volume to get anoher cab.

Cool.

I'm still going to back the Warwick BC300. But any medium-large combo should do you. That particular one is just a good choice in my opinion.

One trick you can try is to raise a combo or your cab off the floor, and also tilt it so that it's directed at head height rather than at people's knees. That adjustment can do wonders in a smallish bar if you do find yourself needing more volume.

 

[lbbc]

I use a Carvin BX500 thru a Carvin 1-15 and Carvin 2-10 for larger bars and a Genz Benz 6.0 12T for smaller places. The Acoustic is a nice amp but may not push as much air as you would like for larger gigs (without PA support)

 

[Blake Bass]

Little Mark II head and Epifani 3x10 is an excellent bar rig..It is light weight and loud enough for almost anything..You can probably get this rig used for around $1100

 

[CL400Peavey]

Yeah, you missed it. Lots of occurences.

And yes, people have actually said they wanted to put an end to others using mixed cabs. Because you should not do it, period. More than once.

I will be very careful with my responses to this thread, specifically because both Brad and I have been directed to let this topic drop in reference to each other, something that he has apparently forgotten.

Please see the quotes below:

Slap a 2x10 atop that 15, and you should be OK

Using the advice given in this thread to experience different set ups before making a judgement this statement is erroneous. Just willy-nilly stacking cabs isnt going to necessarily sound good.

Very much disagree. The only cab I would pair with the OP's existing, is an identical matching one.

I disagreed with it, based upon information available the best direction to give is double up on an existing cab. In no way did I say mixed cabs cant work, just that referencing my own experience the OP will have more success matching cabs. Any two or three peoples experience may not line up enough to suggest a mixed cab pair that works good or even well in every situation. Matching cabs takes all the guess work out of it. Add in that there was even more erroneous information then given illustrating poor understanding. This is all followed up with marketing examples, and credential demands.

Funny?

I don't recall anyone saying do not mix driver sizes etc. I thought most were simply stating it's more of a gamble than getting 2 identical cabs/drivers etc..

Huh, must've missed it.

+1 to this.

Then we get to BJ bringing up a tangent he was told to drop in reference to myself.

Let me address the overall issues.

Faith/experience based arguments dont hold up. There has to be some thought question or hard science to convince people. Appeal to logic or thought, dont expect people to change their beliefs based on generalities and "you just have to hear it..."

Let me put it this way:

Me:Hey man there is this great new presidential candidate you should vote for!
You: Cool can you tell me anything about them? What topics are important to them?
Me: No I cant go into any depth about why he is a good candidate, but you should check him out.
You: Well can you at least tell me what party he is associated with or where he is located?
Me: I cant even tell you what party he is with, he is located far away, and you will have to pay to hear him speak about his specific platform.

Telling someone to experience a piece of equipment them selves to make a judgement works if you can go down to you local music shop and play it. When its a semi custom cab, that is not readily available, and would require significant financial investment just to hear one, all this falls apart. In such cases different standards are required to share an experience with others, the cold hard facts of science are hard to dispute.


Now for the rest of it all.

The OP again:

Okay, here are some of the details.

We have two guitarsist, myself on bass, a vocalist, and a drummer. The drummer is usually mic'd but he doesn't get extremely load. I can usually hear myself through my cab. We play mainly hard rock and a little bit of metal. During practices I can hear myself with my volume at 12 o'clock.

This has to do more with wanting to know of a good quality amp within my budget. I know taht if I want louder stage volume to get anoher cab.

I had a response to this earlier, must have gotten lost in the mix so to say:

Well go try some new amps. Personally I think you might enjoy a PF-500 and two of the new PF115hlf cabs.

Yeah it uses matched cabs. Could a mis match work? Maybe, but I know a pair of matching cabs will.

Anyone sits a drink on my amp and they die. Or I'll admonish them gently

+100

Gently with a hammer.

Oh, be quiet you lot!

Here's my answer to the question... Warwick BC300. Loud, sturdy, full of features, transparent sounding, convenient to move around. Perfect bar/pub/club amp.

Im sure that combo sounds nice, but a combo is not what I see as a gig-able rig. My experience tells me that if the OP is looking for a hard rock and metal set up he will quickly out grow any combo.

 

[Downunderwonder]

New or used?

 

[scottbass]

This thread begs the question:
Why are there no cabs with built in cup holders?

I added one of these to each side of my fEARful. THEY WORK GREAT! And they fold up for easy transport.

 

[CL400Peavey]

I added one of these to each side of my fEARful. THEY WORK GREAT! And they fold up for easy transport.

Nice!

RNV has a bottle opener on one side, this could be a good additon for him.

 

[PJSim]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPVLyB0Yc6I

 

[Brad Johnson]

I was really just pointing out that people at bars tend to not care at all - if it sounds like music, it's all good. If you think your bass sounds good in that kind of venue, that's all there is. Little point fretting about whether we should or shouldn't be mixing cabs in such a situation, especially if you haven't the resources to be picky about it.

I'm offering a counterpoint to the folks telling people what NOT to do. That's all.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Ben, glad you asked it.
I was on TB when a poster was stating emphatically that his cab really cut through in the mix. Silly me! I thought he might have meant a stage setup with Hammond B3, horn section, rhythm section, backup vocalists, etc.
Well no.
He is in his basement with his son on drums and his early teen daughter on trumpet.
The Internet.

Good times.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Your opinion, your experience differs from mine. My band has been the house band for many a musicians night, at the same venue and I have had the luxury of being able to hear my rig on stage while other people play and have experimented with MANY cab combinations, so I CAN offer my opinion based on MY experience. You don't have to believe or discredit me, just do a search and you will find many TBers share my opinion.

I'm not even questioning YOUR experience, it is whatever it is. OTOH here's what you said:

"Maybe where you are standing with your mixed cab setup is the "sweet spot" because everything sounds "in-phase", but I assure you, there are places in the audience where your sound is "confused" due to the physics of wave / phase cancellation. ... But if you are happy with your 115/210 rig, rock on!".

You can't assure them of that. Especially based on a maybe. It assumes too much, which is what I was talking about. Your experience, cool. You telling them what their experience will be, not so cool.

 

[Brad Johnson]

If you read the thread the first person to get testy was supporting mixed cabs...

This apparently was where "I" initiated a conversation WITH YOU.

I responded to you. I'm fine not having any more conversations with you. Are you?

I have no problem with you believing whatever you believe. Based on my experiences I disagree. And I brought up my recent cab aquisition as a prime example of people with no direct experience trying to tell me that my real world gigging experience is not real. It happens and it makes no sense.

Done.

 

[CL400Peavey]

This apparently was where "I" initiated a conversation WITH YOU.

I responded to you. I'm fine not having any more conversations with you. Are you?

You may do as you wish.

Say what you like, it doesn't make you right, especially since the laws of physics don't agree with you. I'm going to turn it around: prove it. Find a reliable and reputable educational text that backs up your position and show it to us. Oh, wait, you can't, such a text does not exist.

This might be the perfect response to this topic.

 

[jarrydee]

Any 410 and 300-500 watt head can work for bar gigs..Hell I used an Ashdown mag 300 2x10 combo amp for a huge new years gig and it worked great!