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Double Bass Whats the technical term for the petrushka chord?

#21
Hexatonic means six notes per octave, pentatonic five notes per octave, heptatonic (?) seven notes per octave and octatonic (?) right notes per octave in a scale.

There are not many useful hexatonic scales, mostly wholetone and tritone major triad pair (Petrushka chord). Other hexatonic scales are usually reduced heptatonic scales that miss one note.
 
#22
Don Kasper said:
I'm not familiar with the term "...a hexatonic" - can you elaborate and/or define?
Esp. regarding vertical/harmonic (not horizontal/melodic) content or structures.
Thanks, davidh...
Click to expand...
Sure, a hexatonic is really just a six note scale made up of two triads with no common tones. Take the Cmaj/Gbmaj , you have C, E, G, and Gb, Bb, Db.... when you play it like a scale it becomes, C, Db, E, Gb, G, Ab, Bb, or you can start from any note you want. An easier one would be, playing Cmaj/Dmaj triad, C, E, G, D, F#, A, you can play that over a Cmaj chord, or even a C7#11 chord, or even Gb7alt. The lines you get when you alternate between the triads is pretty hip, try playing one triad, then the other triad in all inversions, you get some nice lines... and then when you play it like a hexatonic scale you have: C, D, E, F#, G, A, a sound that's different from a heptatonic or 7 note scale i.e; gregorian modes etc...Its a pretty cool sound, a good reference is Hexatonics by Jerry Bergonzi. lemme know if you want to go over this more, PM me.
 
#25
C7b9#11

Can come from diminished dominant scale, which we all know as the half/whole diminished scale. It shares that space with three other dom 7 chords: Eb7b9#9#11 Gb7b9#9#11 and A7b9#9#11

It can also be considered a "tri tone" scale when combining that triad pair: C Db E F# G Bb
 
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#26
Don Kasper said:
I see no reason to call this, or hear this as, anything other than a (partial) C Lydian scale.
Click to expand...

Well, and that's part of the problem that I alluded to in post #15:

Just because you can call something -- or hear something -- as [insert familiar name here] doesn't mean that it's meaningful or musically useful or (especially) musically accurate to call it that.

David's example of that particular hexatonic scale is without context, so it might be hard to elaborate...but the earlier discussion of whether or not to refer to the Petrushka Chord as a C7b9#11 is a perfect example of misguided nomenclature. Or, even if you hear the Petrushka Chord as a C7b9#11, it would be a perfect example of misguided audiation...because that chord name means nothing useful in the context of "Petrushka" to either an analysis (in terms of the composer's craft/process) nor to an understanding of the piece's place in culture or history.

So, depending on the context, there might be very good reasons not to call that particular hexatonic scale "a (partial) C Lydian scale" and to try to hear it as something unrelated to Lydian. It all depends on how it's used and how it's derived.
 
#29
it is known igor has some jazz influences in his paris era but it is clearly it is not a cb7#9%11$13
the point is, he had found some kind of musical continiuty and sonority with that layers or within that layers. if it is c/gb chord pls show me an analysis he proceeds towards any dominant and how he structured the form of the piece
so stop bulls#tb7maj13#11 and get familiar with 20th century music
 
#31
sevan said:
it is known igor has some jazz influences in his paris era but it is clearly it is not a cb7#9%11$13
the point is, he had found some kind of musical continiuty and sonority with that layers or within that layers. if it is c/gb chord pls show me an analysis he proceeds towards any dominant and how he structured the form of the piece
so stop bulls#tb7maj13#11 and get familiar with 20th century music
Click to expand...
So, what was Igor REALLY Like???
 

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