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when you discover the "old stand by" is just old.

sm49341

sm49341

May 12, 2013
568
524
Michigan
#1
I got one of those new Mic Mechanic boxes yesterday. I tried one in a store and kinda liked it, and I feel our pa sound is dull. I sing backing vocs only, and I have this high airy voice, no time is spent dialing in my voice. As not to create chaos I stay away from the sound board. I like how this box puts my sound I my hands.
Anyway as I'm playing and testing with this new toy I just hooked up an old EV mic from the 80's. We got all sm58s when we restarted the band and was just lying there unused so I grabbed it. I Sang and played with the new mic mechanic box about 45 minutes and then realized that I need to test/set this thing with my stage mic, an sm58, not this old EV. I plugged in the sm58, and what a disappointment. What a dull sounding lifeless thud monster. Just to make sure my 58 wasn't broken, I grabbed my nearly new sm57 guitar cab mike. Sounded same as the 58. I plug in the EV N/D357 and the wow comes back. I continued to expiriment and decided that for my voice, it's the EV for now on. I'm buying one of these.
Point here I guess is that just because it's been around for 40 years doesn't mean other stuff isn't better or hasn't surpassed it. People are just comfortable with it because it's a known. You know what you're getting with an sm58. What I found out tonight is that sometimes you need to see what you are missing.
 
#2
sm49341 said:
Anyway as I'm playing and testing with this new toy I just hooked up an old EV mic from the 80's. ...I Sang and played with the new mic mechanic box about 45 minutes and then realized that I need to test/set this thing with my stage mic, an sm58, not this old EV. I plugged in the sm58, and what a disappointment. What a dull sounding lifeless thud monster.
Click to expand...

While I'm not a big fan of the 58, are you saying that you tweaked the box for 45 mins w/ the EV and then plugged in the 58 w/ the Mic Mechanic tweaked for the EV? Or that you zeroed everything on the FX unit and began from scratch w/ the 58?
 
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#3
Per the specs review, the ND357 is a mic whose "frequency response changed with proximity to the source — within 12 inches, “proximity” effect caused up to 18dB of boost below 500Hz. Electro-Voice described this response as “tailored to provide bass boost without the boominess of many directional microphones.”
The bass boost may explain why it sounds warmer on your voice than a 57/58 (which are basically the same mic). I have on old 257 (that I haven't used in...well yrs) that used to do the same for male vocals. Much warmer sounding..
 
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#4
I'm also not a huge fan of the SM58, but it's not a dog either IMHO. If your vocals are sounding a mess through an SM58, I'd suggest taking a serious look at the things that are happening before and after the mic before concluding that it is the mic. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but IMO the SM58 has earned its reputation for good reason. I personally am an Audix fan for vocals, but I won't turn my nose up at a house provided SM58 if that's all they have.
 
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#5
EastCoastThump said:
While I'm not a big fan of the 58, are you saying that you tweaked the box for 45 mins w/ the EV and then plugged in the 58 w/ the Mic Mechanic tweaked for the EV? Or that you zeroed everything on the FX unit and began from scratch w/ the 58?
Click to expand...
No it's just a pedal. No dialing in here, 3 knobs at 12 o clock. It has a tone button that applies a canned effect. The 3 buttons had no effect on the crispness of either.
 
#6
jimfist said:
I'm also not a huge fan of the SM58, but it's not a dog either IMHO. If your vocals are sounding a mess through an SM58, I'd suggest taking a serious look at the things that are happening before and after the mic before concluding that it is the mic. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but IMO the SM58 has earned its reputation for good reason. I personally am an Audix fan for vocals, but I won't turn my nose up at a house provided SM58 if that's all they have.
Click to expand...
Well yea, I own a 57 and a 58 for a reason. They are the standard, a safe standard. It's Just on MY voice, (not a good voice) the EV just seems to add a texture and crispness that the 58 does not. Really stunned me. The 58 seem low and boomy, and lacked a texture the EV gave me. Typically I like to dial the lows out of my voice, like 9:00 on your standard board knob. I don't know if this is even scientifically possible but when I analyze my own voice it seems like the middle and highs are ok and reasonably on pitch, but the lower part just sounds weak and flat. Reading about the 357 it's marketed as a female voc mic. And yeah' I guess I'm not exactly Johnny cash.
So yes I'd be stupid to say a 58 is not good. It just seems for my application the old retired EV seems to pick up the characteristics of my voice that I want sent out. And I never would have predicted this.
 
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#8
I use a Beyer Dynamic microphone for the same reason. SM58s don't work well for me, but if you own one, and are waiting for it to break, you'd best be patient...

I use a Mic Mechanic when we don't have FOH support because of the de-essing it provides. The reverb effects are great, and even the pitch correction is very useful, if you don't crank the knob.

It's a great tool.
 
#9
I pulled out my old N/D257 and took it to rehearsal to leave there. I usually take my Beta 58 there and back..
To be sure, it was much "warmer" than the Beta, so the specs seem accurate..
One less piece of gear to haul to rehearsal. :)
 
#11
tfer said:
I use a Beyer Dynamic microphone for the same reason. SM58s don't work well for me, but if you own one, and are waiting for it to break, you'd best be patient...

I use a Mic Mechanic when we don't have FOH support because of the de-essing it provides. The reverb effects are great, and even the pitch correction is very useful, if you don't crank the knob.

It's a great tool.
Click to expand...
Will gig with mine this weekend. I like the pitch setting about 1:00 for me. Cranked it's gets a little step-ish.
All in all its a subtle tool. It certainly is not going to make me a lead singer. I do think it will help me to better compliment the leads and make our overall band sound better. Especially the backing ooh's and ah's. Going to record this weekend and see how it sounds.
 
#12
sm49341 said:
Will gig with mine this weekend. I like the pitch setting about 1:00 for me. Cranked it's gets a little step-ish.
All in all its a subtle tool. It certainly is not going to make me a lead singer. I do think it will help me to better compliment the leads and make our overall band sound better. Especially the backing ooh's and ah's. Going to record this weekend and see how it sounds.
Click to expand...
The correction will nudge you into the right pitch. You'll hear the out-of-tune wobble in your head, and you go from there.
 
#15
For a production company or a house engineer buying a primary line of mics, 58s make a lot of sense. They are robust, have great feedback rejection, and just about all voices are going to sound good through one. However, good is not always great. When selecting your own personal mic, the 58 may not be the most complimentary microphone for your particular voice. Sometimes, the offerings from Sennheiser, Audix, AKG, and other brands may be better choices for any one individual at the end of the day.
 
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#16
After jumping to Audix OM-6's for my front line vox mics I'm spending a lot less eq making voices work. I still have a pair of 58's and a few other choices for folks that just gotta have. I also try not to bring them out unless I have to... I moved to the Audix VX-5 as my personal vocal mic. Love it... The clarity and presence are beautiful without being at all harsh. My lady lead slacker uses one as well. Our gutarist, singer uses an OM-5. He is a powerful singer with a slightly dark voice and a great range. His voice benefits from the extra presence of the 5 over the more neutral OM-6.

For sound company front line, I couldn't recommend SM-58's today. They were the gold standard, today not so much.
 
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#17
Some people play Jazz basses and others play Ric's. If you want a personalized bass sound why wouldn't you want a personalized mic sound? People have different voices and it would be folly to assume 1 mic is perfect for all. The sm58 is the old standard because sound engineers know how to dial in a usable sound with them quickly and easily. Like a P bass lol.
 
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#19
Joebarnes said:
Some people play Jazz basses and others play Ric's. If you want a personalized bass sound why wouldn't you want a personalized mic sound? People have different voices and it would be folly to assume 1 mic is perfect for all. The sm58 is the old standard because sound engineers know how to dial in a usable sound with them quickly and easily. Like a P bass lol.
Click to expand...

Maybe. My take on it has more to do with inertia. Sound companies collectively own a metric ton of 58's and are going to eek out the last dime in their investment... Trust me in that I live the investment part. Every day but particularly now in the down season... I keep looking at that truck and wondering... Anyway... That many engineers know how to dial a voice in or out with a 58 is in my book part of the problem. Familiar is not necessarily better... Many voices need that help with a 58. I put the same person on an om-5 or 6 their voice depending and I spend very little eq on them. Sonically less eq tends to sound better to my ear...

Sc09... Just playing the bass and singing... Yep. There are days when that sounds like a great plan.
 
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#20
LiquidMidnight said:
For a production company or a house engineer buying a primary line of mics, 58s make a lot of sense. They are robust, have great feedback rejection, and just about all voices are going to sound good through one. However, good is not always great. When selecting your own personal mic, the 58 may not be the most complimentary microphone for your particular voice. Sometimes, the offerings from Sennheiser, Audix, AKG, and other brands may be better choices for any one individual at the end of the day.
Click to expand...
back somewhere in the 90's, i was buying new mic's for a JR/SR high school, and I was also lead sound engineer for our church and upgrading the system. What did I buy? Yep, SM58's. When you are working with a variety of amateurs and students, you want good general purpose mic's that are indestructable. The SM58's in that day met those requirements extremely well.
 

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