Why aren't upper horns longer, to eliminate dive?

[Bass Ape]

Ok, I did not bother testing while seated because I’m pretty sure any object will tip one way or the other while perched atop my leg. I also never play without a strap and rarely while seated.

I just tried this with three basses and two straps. Two jazzes and one stingray. They all behaved the exact same way, when positioned anywhere between roughly 50 degrees upwards (totally scientific estimate) and 0 degrees parallel with the floor, they all stayed exactly at the orientation I moved them to. Didn’t have to hold up anything with my left hand. In fact, I kept my hands off the basses except for initially positioning them.

So either my collection defies physics or y’all are doing something different.

Not all basses have neck dive, but the ones that do

My last and most egregious offender was my Dean Zelinski Mule bass 5. That headstock had a love affair with gravity. Almost impossible to play sitting down and a bit less awful standing with a 4" leather strap.

Just because someone has not experienced neck dive on their instruments does not mean that it does not exist. Plenty of good examples.

Of course now I have a Warwick Corvette and and Fbass, so I'm out of the neck dive game.

 

[urkel3000]

Where can I find something like this?

View attachment 7332724

You could probably make one out of a cereal box or something and have a machine shop fab you one

 

[Pep]

You could probably make one out of a cereal box or something and have a machine shop fab you one

Great idea! I was just wondering if some one actual manufactures these.

 

[InhumanResource]

Not all basses have neck dive, but the ones that do

My last and most egregious offender was my Dean Zelinski Mule bass 5. That headstock had a love affair with gravity. Almost impossible to play sitting down and a bit less awful standing with a 4" leather strap.

Just because someone has not experienced neck dive on their instruments does not mean that it does not exist. Plenty of good examples.

Of course now I have a Warwick Corvette and and Fbass, so I'm out of the neck dive game.

Do you experience it when not sitting down? I don’t think it’s realistic to expect a bass to balance nearly on one’s leg.

 

[Bass Ape]

Do you experience it when not sitting down? I don’t think it’s realistic to expect a bass to balance nearly on one’s leg.

Oh heck yeah! that bass was all neck with a 5 inline headstock. There was zero chance of it no being affected by gravity.

My Warwick corvette and my F bas balance perfectly on my leg with no dive. Better body weight to neck ration. Although, both would be considered ugly because of the elongated top horns.

Why would you consider it "unrealistic?"

 

[Pdaddy1978]

Whatchoo talkin' about, Willis?

Maybe its just happy to see you.....

 

[lug]

Yes, even Carvin / Kiesel got the message. I had a BB75 about 20 years ago. Very well built and comfortable.

It was one of Bunny's main requirements.

 

[InhumanResource]

Oh heck yeah! that bass was all neck with a 5 inline headstock. There was zero chance of it no being affected by gravity.

My Warwick corvette and my F bas balance perfectly on my leg with no dive. Better body weight to neck ration. Although, both would be considered ugly because of the elongated top horns.

Why would you consider it "unrealistic?"

Basses are such goofy shaped objects that I would just never expect one to balance neatly.

I had until recently a nice L2500, empress body and the neck end was definitely WAY heavier than the body which hardly had any weight to it at all. I gigged with it a lot and just like my other basses, it pretty much stayed where I put it. Maybe I’m 4 for 4?

 

[Major Seven]

I was in GC futzing with basses. For most, I had to use a grippy and/or wide strap keep the neck up. But one in particular hung beautifully, with the neck staying up even with a 2" wide slippery nylon strap.

Its upper horn was a bit longer, putting the strap button between the 10th and 11th frets.

I've seen posts here on TB where people have achieved that same strap button position by adding custom plates or long screws and tubes to their basses.

Why aren't most basses made like this?

View attachment 7331866

What bass is that?

 

[Ol Sparky]

If it neck dives in the seated position without a strap,
it quickly gets wished away to the corn field.

 

[Suntory]

Remember the fender long horn? Yeesh it was heavy, 10 lbs easy.

 

[Never2Late]

What bass is that?

Mitchell MB100 (short scale). No crazy shape. Just a slightly longer horn. It also happens to have 2+2 tuners.

This is the first bass I've ever played that stays in place with the neck up at ~45 degrees with a 2" nylon (slippery) strap.

 

[Never2Late]

I'd agree with you. I went down this rabbit hole a few years back. I even tried bushings to extend the button out. They work - but are an eye-sore. I settled on stacking the buttons to extend it just a bit more. It works so well that I've done many of mine, whether they have neck dive or not. Plus once you have a strap on you can't see it or tell what I've done. I use a longer screw though.

I love this idea. I was planning on trying to find hollow plastic bushings, but this guarantees the holes are the right size, and the metal buttons won't break.

I just found a set of 12 buttons on Amazon for $6.

 

[Stranger Danger]

It’s possible we’ve had this conversation. I’ve very vocal about it. Spector and Warwick are 2 basses I REALLY want to own. But that reach below the 5th fret is just too much for me.

If someone could build me a P bass or Stingray body with a similar shaped neck with 17mm spacing, with a reverse P/JJ setup to have the NS2 and Thumb pickup positions with a Ken Smith preamp and I’d be one HHHhHHHhHhhhhhhHhhAAAAAAAAAAPPY dude.

A Warwick Dolphin might work for you

 

[ole Jason]

I know the looks are polarizing but I love how both of my singlecuts balance. I think the extra mass of the "horn" helps alleviate neckdive. There are plenty of ways to avoid neckdive of course but I've never played a singlecut that noticeably had the issue.

The Manne Multi is particularly nice because it's carved/balanced in a way that makes the body lean into your body instead of away from it like a lot of slab body basses tend to do.

 

[GrowlerBox]

There's a lot of talk here about the length of the horn strap attachment, but the strap has another end. My best-balanced bass has a thick ebony board on a lightweight kauri body and a horn ending at about the 13th position (it's fretless, total weight ~7.5 lb). The other strap button is displaced from the midline towards the top or left or E-string side of the body, about a third of the way along the bottom edge, more or less in line with the top edge of the pickups, so more of the weight of the bass is below the line connecting the two ends of the strap, even accounting for the pretty deep cutaway to the 27th-ish position. It just hangs where I put it, and it's a joy to play.

 

[hbarcat]

Just as an experiment, I once made a bass body that I designed to be the most technically efficient shape possible, while also maximizing ergonomics and minimizing weight, yet not conpromising tone or sustain. I was an engineering major (studying acoustic science, in particular) and it seemed like an interesting project.

I started with a center section that had enough structure to provide good strength and stability to the connection between the neck and bridge, then added a bulge below that (on the lower treble side) for the controls and electronics.

On the lower bass side, I put on an thin extended armrest with a comfortable arch to it, and on the upper bass side, I added a narrow horn that extended quite a distance to perfectly balance the bass.

I succeeded in making a technically excellent instrument, but it looked ugly as hell. Some people said it looked hideous. Others called it ridiculous. Literally nobody liked it.

I'm fairly certain that if a bass that looked like that was commercially available, nobody would buy it. You'd have a hard time giving it away.

 

[Tight and Tasty]

Just as an experiment, I once made a bass body that I designed to be the most technically efficient shape possible, while also maximizing ergonomics and minimizing weight, yet not conpromising tone or sustain. I was an engineering major (studying acoustic science, in particular) and it seemed like an interesting project.

I started with a center section that had enough structure to provide good strength and stability to the connection between the neck and bridge, then added a bulge below that (on the lower treble side) for the controls and electronics.

On the lower bass side, I put on an thin extended armrest with a comfortable arch to it, and on the upper bass side, I added a narrow horn that extended quite a distance to perfectly balance the bass.

I succeeded in making a technically excellent instrument, but it looked ugly as hell. Some people said it looked hideous. Others called it ridiculous. Literally nobody liked it.

I'm fairly certain that if a bass that looked like that was commercially available, nobody would buy it. You'd have a hard time giving it away.

You’ve got me intrigued, got any pics??

 

[hbarcat]

You’ve got me intrigued, got any pics??

Sorry, I don't. It was from back in 1987.

 

[GTHintz]

I was in GC futzing with basses. For most, I had to use a grippy and/or wide strap keep the neck up. But one in particular hung beautifully, with the neck staying up even with a 2" wide slippery nylon strap.

Its upper horn was a bit longer, putting the strap button between the 10th and 11th frets.

I've seen posts here on TB where people have achieved that same strap button position by adding custom plates or long screws and tubes to their basses.

Why aren't most basses made like this?

View attachment 7331866

Well Warwick did it.