Why do i have to solder when changing pickups?

[Munjibunga]

For the record. I know how to solder. But often if when im working in the studio i think that it would be nice to try "another" pickup. In my opinion it should be like this: loosen the strings, take of the pup, put on another one...click. I could go from a vintage pup to e.g a QP in one minute.

So invest a little time in attaching quick-connectors to your pickups and your bass, then plug and play. Aren't you afraid that using magnets strong enough to properly hold your pickups in place would interfere with the function of the magnets in the pickups? Seriously, it seems to me that a creative person could innovate a way to do what you want to do. Take a look at Mike Pope's Viceroy. There's some innovation there. Also, how would you deal with the need for different routs for different pickups?

 

[khutch]

Imo it should be like lego with magnets. I would like to to have a bunch of pickups and change whenever i wants to..e.g at a studio gig. Whats the point of the screws and the soldering?

Listening to all you have said I can see why you would want this and I have to believe some other people would too. Enough to make the idea marketable? Maybe, maybe not. Sometimes the fact that something has been tried before and failed just indicates that it was tried before its time. If you could have invented the bass guitar in, say, 1523 would it have succeeded? Perhaps not.

A number of objections have been raised, all addressable. Magnets are perhaps a bad idea but other mechanical quick attach methods are used everywhere. Connectors are a bad idea? Yeah, virtually every piece of modern electronic equipment uses them. Can't adjust the pickup height? Just another design challenge that is easily met. And go down the list, solving one issue after another. This is not rocket science.

You would need to devise a system that allows you to easily adjust the height and location of two, three pickups. You would need an attachment method and connection point scheme that would allow a wide variety of pickup types to all mate to the same electro-mechanical attachment point. You would probably need to be willing to share your invention with the whole industry in order to gain enough market traction to make it a success. Perhaps best to just assemble a consortium of instrument and pickup makers to jointly invent the system from the get go. They could then patent the system and charge latecomers a real but reasonable fee to join the system after the fact.

It could be done, it has been done many times in many other industries. It is not a small job but if someone were to manage to do it, three years later every naysayer on this thread would want it and would not know how they lived without it. Every one.

Ken

 

[GlennW]

If you use connectors, then you have the reliability of the connectors to contend with.

Accutronics started using connectors on their reverb tanks a while back, and those seem to fail much more than the old ones.

 

[odin70]

Also, how would you deal with the need for different routs for different pickups?

I was thinking p-bass pickups for a p-bass and j bass pickups for j bass etc.

 

[isher1992]

I've pulled stereos out of a few cars, and connectors can be iffy. Just when you think you've seen everything, you pull a head unit that's been connected with twist connectors that should be used in house wiring, not small circuits.

Corrosion, improper crimping, and just poor quality connectors can be a hassle. I mean, unless you were talking about something more like a socket type connector, but what if you have a bass with a single coil or 3-wire humbucker and you're wanting to change to a pickup that has a 5-wire setup? And even then, you have unshielded versus shield, then you need to consider how everything is grounded. Then your connectors won't really match up.

When it comes to pickups, I'd go ahead and replace pots too, just because it seems like a smart idea...if I'm already having to add/relocate/rearrange wires, why not go ahead and replace those before they go bad down the road, since I already have it open?

IMO, soldering wires to pots is far more forgiving with the soldering iron than soldering to PCB's.

 

[isher1992]

I agree. I'm a horrible solder-er if you could even call what I do soldering. It's more like me sitting there with a hot poker on a soldering joint staring at it waiting for something to happen for 10 minutes. (it usually never does so 10 minutes is about my give-up and quit time limit) There has to be a better/faster way to change things out. Some basses and guitars do have wiring harnesses with the connecting clips already attached so there's one semi-solution. I'm sure there's a wire here or there you'd still have to end up soldering somewhere. As far as the screws that's just plain laziness if you don't want to have to deal with those.

Are you keeping the tip clean, tinning the tip and your connection points, scratching coatings off the back of pots when you solder wires to them, and using flux or 60/40 Rosin-core solder? I learned all about that stuff the hard way...

 

[ex-tension]

Here you go: the Vox Humana Swiss Army Bass:



The pickups and output jack are mounted in a block that can be easily exchanged for blocks with other configurations.

Close but no sigar

What's wrong with this idea?

 

[isher1992]

What's wrong with this idea?

I'm guessing the OP doesn't want to have a modular system in his bass, but would rather just not have to solder to his pots and jack.

 

[mrbell321]

I've pulled stereos out of a few cars, and connectors can be iffy. Just when you think you've seen everything, you pull a head unit that's been connected with twist connectors that should be used in house wiring, not small circuits.

Corrosion, improper crimping, and just poor quality connectors can be a hassle. I mean, unless you were talking about something more like a socket type connector, but what if you have a bass with a single coil or 3-wire humbucker and you're wanting to change to a pickup that has a 5-wire setup? And even then, you have unshielded versus shield, then you need to consider how everything is grounded. Then your connectors won't really match up.

When it comes to pickups, I'd go ahead and replace pots too, just because it seems like a smart idea...if I'm already having to add/relocate/rearrange wires, why not go ahead and replace those before they go bad down the road, since I already have it open?

IMO, soldering wires to pots is far more forgiving with the soldering iron than soldering to PCB's.

Indeed, it's I've seen some ridiculous car audio(and house wiring, actually) jobs. And even when it's done right, I think the designers of those multi-plugs in car audio are secretly laughing at all the installers out there: "MUAHAHAH! Let them try and declip this connector without my patented 16 prong, 32 axis declipper!! I WILL RULE THE WORLD! And the funny part is, my declipper won't fit under the dash of any known vehicle!"

Are you keeping the tip clean, tinning the tip and your connection points, scratching coatings off the back of pots when you solder wires to them, and using flux or 60/40 Rosin-core solder? I learned all about that stuff the hard way...

Yeah, it shouldn't take 10 minutes. Well, maybe for your iron to heat up, but soldering itself is a 3 second or less affair. Wait until the iron is hot. Tip should be shiny, fresh solder from the spool should liquify instantly on contact.
With wire to wire connections, make sure things are making good contact mechanically(before any solder is applied). Touch the tip for ~1 second or so to heat the wire some. Then touch the solder briefly to the tip, this creates a solder bridge which transfers heat more efficiently. Then you should be able to move and feed the solder to the rest of the area being soldered.
Remove the iron and solder when the pieces are coated, but not drowning. Big globs aren't better.
Solder should flow smoothly, like water and fill in gaps. If not, your iron isn't hot enough and you won't get good contacts. You also tend to, counterintuitively, put more heat into surrounding pieces that can't handle it. The only are this SHOULD be a problem are when connecting the pots which are big hunks of metal that act as heat sinks and keep the joint from reaching proper temp. Even this, tho, isn't hard w/ a decent iron and proper solder bridging.
If the solder instantly liquifies, but doesn't stick, the surface was contaminated and you should clean it first. Often, solder has flux-core so pre-cleaning isn't necessary on decent condition parts. However, finger oils, smoke and other evidence of gigging, as well as new components(sometimes coated w/ oil) can be stubborn. You can buy standalone flux to clean things. YOu can usually do well enough w/ a swab of denatured alcohol, or even just a hard rubbing w/ a clean cloth. the flux-core solder will do the rest.

 

[isher1992]

Indeed, it's I've seen some ridiculous car audio(and house wiring, actually) jobs. And even when it's done right, I think the designers of those multi-plugs in car audio are secretly laughing at all the installers out there: "MUAHAHAH! Let them try and declip this connector without my patented 16 prong, 32 axis declipper!! I WILL RULE THE WORLD! And the funny part is, my declipper won't fit under the dash of any known vehicle!"




Yeah, it shouldn't take 10 minutes. Well, maybe for your iron to heat up, but soldering itself is a 3 second or less affair. Wait until the iron is hot. Tip should be shiny, fresh solder from the spool should liquify instantly on contact.
With wire to wire connections, make sure things are making good contact mechanically(before any solder is applied). Touch the tip for ~1 second or so to heat the wire some. Then touch the solder briefly to the tip, this creates a solder bridge which transfers heat more efficiently. Then you should be able to move and feed the solder to the rest of the area being soldered.
Remove the iron and solder when the pieces are coated, but not drowning. Big globs aren't better.
Solder should flow smoothly, like water and fill in gaps. If not, your iron isn't hot enough and you won't get good contacts. You also tend to, counterintuitively, put more heat into surrounding pieces that can't handle it. The only are this SHOULD be a problem are when connecting the pots which are big hunks of metal that act as heat sinks and keep the joint from reaching proper temp. Even this, tho, isn't hard w/ a decent iron and proper solder bridging.
If the solder instantly liquifies, but doesn't stick, the surface was contaminated and you should clean it first. Often, solder has flux-core so pre-cleaning isn't necessary on decent condition parts. However, finger oils, smoke and other evidence of gigging, as well as new components(sometimes coated w/ oil) can be stubborn. You can buy standalone flux to clean things. YOu can usually do well enough w/ a swab of denatured alcohol, or even just a hard rubbing w/ a clean cloth. the flux-core solder will do the rest.

^ What this guy said.

The only thing I would add is something I've discovered about Alpha pots--the back of the pot has some sort of coating on it that solder refuses to stick to. My guess is it's something for anti-corrosion, but just roughing a spot up with a file/sandpaper/knife edge fixes that problem.

 

[isher1992]

Indeed, it's I've seen some ridiculous car audio(and house wiring, actually) jobs. And even when it's done right, I think the designers of those multi-plugs in car audio are secretly laughing at all the installers out there: "MUAHAHAH! Let them try and declip this connector without my patented 16 prong, 32 axis declipper!! I WILL RULE THE WORLD! And the funny part is, my declipper won't fit under the dash of any known vehicle!"

Fords are the worst. Pulling a stereo out of an F-150 and finding 4 different plugs with wires and only being able to have ONE connector from the stereo about gave me a heart attack...Then found out the truck doesn't even have the features the rest of the harness is even for...like a CD changer, factory subwoofer and volume adjusting to vehicle speed blah blah. Then again, mid-90's Hondas and GM vehicles with their keyless entry wired into the stereo might be even worse.

 

[SirMjac28]

You need a cheaper version of this http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2012/06/18/bob-daisley-debuts-black-beauty-signature-series-bass/

 

[yodedude2]

You need a cheaper version of this http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2012/06/18/bob-daisley-debuts-black-beauty-signature-series-bass/

love it! posts 32 and 68.

 

[bassbenj]

Better in that case with a system where you can change the pickups from the back of the bass. Just drop in through the body.

Yeah this gets close. You'd have to have a large hole from the neck to the bridge where you could put in pickups and slide them to various positions. The tone (like stingray etc.) often depends a lot on the location as well as the way the pickup is made.

But as far as I'm concerned this is just one of those ideas that sounds good but is way more trouble than it's worth. It's just a larger variation on the sliding pickup idea that comes up every so often and then dies. The problem is that the tonal difference between pickups or positioning is just too subtle and many of the differences just don't work. So it turns out better to pick out a few good ones and build something out of that rather than to try to have them all where most aren't interesting anyway.

For example a bass that switched between fretted and fretless would be far more useful than one that you could switch pickups or slide them around. The tonal difference would be much greater.

 

[FretNoMore]

...
For example a bass that switched between fretted and fretless would be far more useful than one that you could switch pickups or slide them around. The tonal difference would be much greater.

Novatone and Kramer has tried that, another innovation that's interesting but has no market.

 

[odin70]

What's wrong with this idea?

Its a bit to complicated. I just want to be able to switch pickups on my p-bass without the hassle of soldering etc. Im happy with the pickup that i use now, but once in a while i think that it would have been nice to use my old e.g QP again. In imho it should be way easier to switch. No soldering and no screws. I do not want to have 10 different p-basses, but 10 different pickups to choose from ..would be jolly nice.

 

[isher1992]

Its a bit to complicated. I just want to be able to switch pickups on my p-bass without the hassle of soldering etc. Im happy with the pickup that i use now, but once in a while i think that it would have been nice to use my old e.g QP again. In imho it should be way easier to switch. No soldering and no screws. I do not want to have 10 different p-basses, but 10 different pickups to choose from ..would be jolly nice.

You're not gonna get out of no screws, otherwise there's no way to mount them to your body besides something like 3M double-sided mounting tape, but then you can't adjust height. Maybe consider pre-wiring pickguards with different pickups?

 

[odin70]

You're not gonna get out of no screws, otherwise there's no way to mount them to your body

I think it can be done. Maybe magnets or something like the way you insert cartridges in printers or computer games, could work.

 

[isher1992]

I think it can be done. Maybe magnets or something like the way you insert cartridges in printers or computer games, could work.

I would think magnets would interrupt/disturb the fielding of pickups.

 

[J Posega]

If you really want to do it, get a bass and route out all the space between the neck and the bridge. Then invest in every pickup you want to try. Get some sort of quick connectors and attach them to your pickups and pots. Try your pickups out with the screws and strings at first, and figure out how high you want them. Then make wood blocks to go under each pickup to hold them at the right height. Put velcro on the bottom of the pickups and top of your wood blocks to hold everything in place.

Seems like a waste of time.