I had never heard of that before; but after Googling it, whatever respect I had for him as a person just took a nosedive.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Wisdom on Prince from Gene Simmons
- Thread starter basschanges
- Start date
I had never heard of that before; but after Googling it, whatever respect I had for him as a person just took a nosedive.
This is my thought as well.
Jimi Hendrix and a few other musicians of his era died because British doctors were prescribing dangerous sleeping pills to overworked and exhausted musicians, probably without giving proper warnings about usage. Next thing you know, they can't wake up even when vomiting.
Michael Jackson had who knows how many doctors in a parasitical relationship, prescribing who knows what.
So Prince could just be another in a long line of musicians that are trying to treat work-related ailments. Many self-medicate with illegal drugs and alcohol, but these individuals all had professional drug-pushers in their corner. There is a real issue here that Gene could have focused on, instead of linking them to the rock n' roll party lifestyle. Who knows, maybe if these talented musicians had avoided doctors and turned to illegal substance abuse they could have lived as long as Ozzy Osbourne or Keith Richards!
We don't know that Prince had a drug problem. We do know that he was in his fifties, and very physically active on stage, and the human body can only sustain so much of that for so long.
I know two ballet dancers whose bodies deteriorated to the point of quitting before age 25. They were professional touring dancers. The one who is now in her 50's has severe back and leg problems and pain. Prince carried on 30+ years beyond the two dancers I know.
Everyone's body is different but I will presume he had to deal with pain. If you take pain meds regularly, your body will build a resistance and they will stop working. Then you have to switch your regimen. Even doing this under a doctors care can be fatal.
I know two ballet dancers whose bodies deteriorated to the point of quitting before age 25. They were professional touring dancers. The one who is now in her 50's has severe back and leg problems and pain. Prince carried on 30+ years beyond the two dancers I know.
Everyone's body is different but I will presume he had to deal with pain. If you take pain meds regularly, your body will build a resistance and they will stop working. Then you have to switch your regimen. Even doing this under a doctors care can be fatal.
I thought this was a revealing quote: "When we all start out and we have these big dreams and you finally get your wish — you have more money than God and fame..."
Simmons was, and is, always all about the money. He's a businessman, and like a lot of American businessmen, he cannot fathom people who are motivated by anything other than profit.
As for the manner of Prince's death, doesn't it seem odd to anyone that a person of his means apparently wasn't getting timely medical care? As best I can tell, this had nothing to do with his beliefs as a Jehovah's Witness. Their religion has a prohibition against blood transfusion, but as one of their sites says "We seek medical help for ourselves and our families, and we trust that the trained medical professionals will have our best interests at heart. We do not believe that a person's health should be left to faith or prayers alone as some religions teach. But when we get sick, we are encouraged to go seek medical help."
Simmons was, and is, always all about the money. He's a businessman, and like a lot of American businessmen, he cannot fathom people who are motivated by anything other than profit.
As for the manner of Prince's death, doesn't it seem odd to anyone that a person of his means apparently wasn't getting timely medical care? As best I can tell, this had nothing to do with his beliefs as a Jehovah's Witness. Their religion has a prohibition against blood transfusion, but as one of their sites says "We seek medical help for ourselves and our families, and we trust that the trained medical professionals will have our best interests at heart. We do not believe that a person's health should be left to faith or prayers alone as some religions teach. But when we get sick, we are encouraged to go seek medical help."
That doesn't sound at all like what I found: In Dick Move, Prince Smashes Other Guy’s Guitar on ‘Fallon’ | SPIN
And regardless, just because Prince had bundles of money to pay for his misdeeds doesn't mean what he did was okay.
Furthermore, Prince trashed an axe that that guy can never get back.
Is Gene Simmons classless? Yip. Was his style what we want this soon after the death? Nope.
That being said, all of this "understanding" we have shown for decades has resulted in nothing but more talented people leaving us too soon. All of this open minded crap has resulted in friends and family fading away from us way too soon. If my brother became addicted to drugs I would stop what I was doing and drag him physically to seek help. If that didn't work I would drag him out into the woods and tie him to a tree until that crap left his system. I would not show understanding and kindness. I would kick his @$$. THEN I would would wrap my arms around him and help. But not until I kicked his @$$.
Abusing drugs is stupid. Drugs for fun...... drugs for pain...... drugs for escape from emotional pain....... It matters not to me. Abusing them is stupid. It is also selfish. It harms everyone around you. You may as well pull the trigger on a gun to your head. In many cases that would be easier to deal with for your loved ones because they can move on quickly. Dragging things out and forcing your fans and loved ones watch you deteriorate into nothing is selfish.
Both of my grandfathers drank themselves to death. I loved them. But screw them. If I had been an adult at the time I would have raised hell at my family for not doing anything about it. They ALLOWED them to die. They passive aggressively justified their inaction.
As a society we are no different. How many famous musicians do we know of RIGHT NOW who are abusing drugs. Do we buy the albums? Do we go on social media and BEG their loved ones to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT? Nope. We show "understanding" and "empathy". A fat lot of good that does.
Does Gene have a huge ego? Yep. Can he be a jerk? Yep.
Was Prince selfish in his acts as well? Yep. Did his loved ones and inner circle drop the ball? Absolutely.
That being said, all of this "understanding" we have shown for decades has resulted in nothing but more talented people leaving us too soon. All of this open minded crap has resulted in friends and family fading away from us way too soon. If my brother became addicted to drugs I would stop what I was doing and drag him physically to seek help. If that didn't work I would drag him out into the woods and tie him to a tree until that crap left his system. I would not show understanding and kindness. I would kick his @$$. THEN I would would wrap my arms around him and help. But not until I kicked his @$$.
Abusing drugs is stupid. Drugs for fun...... drugs for pain...... drugs for escape from emotional pain....... It matters not to me. Abusing them is stupid. It is also selfish. It harms everyone around you. You may as well pull the trigger on a gun to your head. In many cases that would be easier to deal with for your loved ones because they can move on quickly. Dragging things out and forcing your fans and loved ones watch you deteriorate into nothing is selfish.
Both of my grandfathers drank themselves to death. I loved them. But screw them. If I had been an adult at the time I would have raised hell at my family for not doing anything about it. They ALLOWED them to die. They passive aggressively justified their inaction.
As a society we are no different. How many famous musicians do we know of RIGHT NOW who are abusing drugs. Do we buy the albums? Do we go on social media and BEG their loved ones to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT? Nope. We show "understanding" and "empathy". A fat lot of good that does.
Does Gene have a huge ego? Yep. Can he be a jerk? Yep.
Was Prince selfish in his acts as well? Yep. Did his loved ones and inner circle drop the ball? Absolutely.
If the CLOWN even had some bass chops I wouldn't piss on him. He's a boob whose only claim to fame is makeup.
I've never liked Gene. His ego is soooo big it seems to overshadow and ruin most of the good about the guy (if there is any). I remember watching one episode of his family show and in it he was shocked and insulted that a security guard never heard of him or Kiss and would not let him pass a gate into a studio because of it. He then went on to try to make her feel stupid for not just knowing.
I think most who dwell on this incident did not like Prince, any it provides ammunition for that attitude. I think Prince could be a diva. He was also very gracious and supportive of lots of artists and causes. Short of Jesus, Buddha, your God of choice, people have great sides, and times when they come up short.
I personally never had anything against him. I enjoyed his music, very much respected his abilities, always thought he was a little odd as a person, but it didn't go much further than that.
To trash someone's prized possession goes further than "coming up short," IMO. Maybe he was so wasted out of his mind that he didn't grasp what he was doing at the time, but that was a major jerk move.
It's easy to judge addicts, especially if you've never been one. Prince's addiction may have been painkillers, Gene Simmons' is being a self absorbed ass-hat. Either way it's very difficult to change without some serious help, and it sounds like Prince may have been trying to get help. I don't know how to cure an addict, or make them want to change. It is a choice, but at a certain point that addiction is what's running the show. There's no reason to point fingers after the fact, it changes nothing.
- Oct 7, 2000
- 18,619
- 38,939
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Musicman basses
You can knock Gene Simmons all you want because he's alive. Don't dare knock Prince. He's dead.
I have issues around this stuff I need to resolve
.
I have issues around this stuff I need to resolve
.
Someone once said that most of could not bear to be judged by our worst fifteen minutes. I also know that it is wise to try to walk in someone else's shoes.
At the time of the SG icide, Prince had been a major star for over thirty years, he had done the guitar toss countless times. When I first heard about it, I was mad because I know how hard it is for me to buy a guitar. For some perspective, Captain is doing damn good by the standards or working musicians, and Prince was a very rich man. Prince compensated Kirk and apologized, which is all anyone can do.
In this thread I am seeing a staggering lack of understanding as to what drug addiction really is and how it works.
First and biggest misunderstanding: addicted people don't do this for "kicks" or fun. They do it because they have to. That's the difference between addiction and "partying".
Second: Well upwards of 95% of all opioid addiction cases in the US started with a legitimate doctor's prescription for a legitimate medical problem. In Prince's case, and I'm surprised nobody mentioned this, he had both hips replaced. You're not going to "tough that out" without help from painkillers.
Third: Modern painkillers, especially Oxycontin, were designed to be addictive. The manufacturers are making a lot of money off of them. The LA times ran a great piece about the development of that last week. Well worth your time to read.
I've lost one friend to opioids and all the experience taught me is that it's probably not a solvable problem as long as we need them for the relief of pain - and right now, they're the only tool we have. But they also turned a great young woman with everything to live for - a winner, achiever, and great person with a loving family and lots of friends - into a crawling, degraded liar, thief, and all-around mess that I can say is not the person I knew. Literally felt like someone stole her soul and replaced it with someone else. Haven't spoken to her or seen her since 2008 and frankly hope never to again.
First and biggest misunderstanding: addicted people don't do this for "kicks" or fun. They do it because they have to. That's the difference between addiction and "partying".
Second: Well upwards of 95% of all opioid addiction cases in the US started with a legitimate doctor's prescription for a legitimate medical problem. In Prince's case, and I'm surprised nobody mentioned this, he had both hips replaced. You're not going to "tough that out" without help from painkillers.
Third: Modern painkillers, especially Oxycontin, were designed to be addictive. The manufacturers are making a lot of money off of them. The LA times ran a great piece about the development of that last week. Well worth your time to read.
I've lost one friend to opioids and all the experience taught me is that it's probably not a solvable problem as long as we need them for the relief of pain - and right now, they're the only tool we have. But they also turned a great young woman with everything to live for - a winner, achiever, and great person with a loving family and lots of friends - into a crawling, degraded liar, thief, and all-around mess that I can say is not the person I knew. Literally felt like someone stole her soul and replaced it with someone else. Haven't spoken to her or seen her since 2008 and frankly hope never to again.
You can knock Gene Simmons all you want because he's alive. Don't dare knock Prince. He's dead.
I have issues around this stuff I need to resolve
It goes beyond being alive or dead. Prince was not a serial a-hole, and Simmons is. I suspect being a douche is an act for Simmons, but he could achieve his ends without dumping on a fondly remembered, recently departed person.
devnulljp
Supporting Member
