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Wood Nut

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#21
mikeyswood said:
Also, both Ebony and Bloodwood are will splinter from the strings. Once you have discovered Lignum Vitae you will see why it is used for things like this and even car axles.
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I've always wanted to play around with Lignum Vitae. That's the famous self lubricating wood, no?

Where would I go about getting a bit of the stuff?

EDIT: Er, never mind. I need to learn to read to the end of the thread before I post...
 
#22
Maybe this is goofy: would "saturating" the wood (I have no idea how saturated you could realistically get wood this way) with very thin superglue give any significant additional strength to the wood? Would something like Danish oil be just as good (which, per project, would surely be cheaper)? Has anyone used snakewood for a nut?

Thanks all!

ltt
 
#23
dblbass said:
:rollno:

danish oil (what i use) penetrates and then dries inside the wood so that there isnt any significant build up on top but the wood itself gets harder. It doesn't work as well on a hard oily wood such as cocobola but it works great on walnut or something similar. it takes a lot of coats and some drying time but the outcome is great. 220 works great as far as my boss myself and the other guys at the shop i work at are concerned (and many other wood workers too) so maybe you, the grand master luthier should go ask some questions instead running your mouth.
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My PhD is in synthetic organic chemistry with focus on estherification, so perhaps your shop knowledge supersedes the study of fatty acids. Perhaps you can also explain where the additional coats of oil are going.:rollno: :scowl:

The linseed oil is not cross linking with the oils of Cocobolo which is why you are not getting linseed oil to dry. If you strip oils in the Cocobolo with acetone first you will be able get oil to dry.

lethargytartare said:
Maybe this is goofy: would "saturating" the wood (I have no idea how saturated you could realistically get wood this way) with very thin superglue give any significant additional strength to the wood? Would something like Danish oil be just as good (which, per project, would surely be cheaper)? Has anyone used snakewood for a nut?

Thanks all!

ltt
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Larry at GalleryHardwoods.com is acrylizing wood for the purpose that you mention. Danish oil will take years to reach the hardness of cyanoacrylate. Snakewood is a high risk for checking which would cause a loss of a lot of time should (when) it break(s).
 
#25
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#28
mikeyswood said:
Also, both Ebony and Bloodwood are will splinter from the strings. Once you have discovered Lignum Vitae you will see why it is used for things like this and even car axles.
Click to expand...
Oh wow. Someone should tell double bass luthiers about this! My nut is in danger of breaking! And so is, oh wait, EVERYONE ELSES!!, oh right, ebony has been used for hundreds on pretty much every part of a double bass, the nut, the finger board, the tail piece, the saddle, all of which is under more pressure that the strings on an electric cause, so no, i SERIOUSLY doubt that ebony would be a problem.:eyebrow:
 
#29
I have not seen many upright players with roundwounds....

I have not seen those said roundwounds being changed as frequently...

I have not seen uprights with the same string pressure...

I have seen the old growth timbers that the classical instruments are made from. I have not seen those said old growth timbers on today's market...

Double bass and electric bass are only similar in octave.

I strongly encourage the use of Lignum Vitae due to not only strength but also lubrication.

Rockman said:
oh right, ebony has been used for hundreds on pretty much every part of a double bass, the nut, the finger board, the tail piece, the saddle, all of which is under more pressure that the strings on an electric cause
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Next time you are in your bass shop ask about Lignum Vitae. They won't have it for two reasons: They have never heard of it or "that is the way its always been done." The Ebony pieces you mention are just scraps from the off falls of the fingerboard and bridge.
 
#34
http://www.woodworking.com/wwtimes_oilfinish.cfm

and read the description of it here.

http://www.woodnshop.com/Watco_danish_oil.htm

http://benchmark.20m.com/articles/Finishing/woodfinishing.html

these websites seem to agree with me. hm...

Wow you're lucky...where can i get a PhD in oil finishes? Maybe you should spend some more time in a shop doing these things and maybe you'll actually learn something. And no my knowledge doesn't supersede the study of fatty acids. i just know what im talking about. unlike you.
 
#35
With no offense to any participants, and not laying any blame or judgment -- can the bickering be taken off this thread? I'm seeing some fascinating and really practical info here and don't want to see this thread get locked!

I think respectful arguments and disagreements over issues are VERY good for the observers and newbies, so you all don't have to AGREE, but please try to keep it from getting so heated that the mods shut down the thread.

Cheers all!!

ltt
 
#37
Another possibility would be to use acrylized wood. Rockler sells pen blanks of this, I have never turned them but I belive they are pretty tough. The ones Rockler sells are box elder (similar to birdseye maple) and are available dyed several colors or natural. I have seen pens made of this and they are quite eye-catching. I can also be polished with micro mesh, no oil needed.;)
 
#38
dblbass said:
these websites seem to agree with me. hm...
Click to expand...


If you are not smart enough to put down the shovel then I will not show sympathy.

If you are ignorant enough to search for chemical advice from people other than chemists I can only hope that you do not fall off the end of the Earth while searching for them.

Technical Content: Polymerization of Linseed Oil
Invalid Link Removed

Layman Content: From a woodworker no less. Why were you not able to find this one?
Invalid Link Removed

Wiki if you did not understand the first two:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linseed_oil


dblbass said:
where can i get a PhD in oil finishes?
Click to expand...

Study Organic Chemistry and focus on polyunsaturated hydrocarbons.

dblbass said:
And no my knowledge doesn't supersede the study of fatty acids. i just know what im talking about. unlike you.
Click to expand...

Take a bow. Your ignorance is surpassed by only your ego.
 
#39
mikeyswood said:
I have not seen uprights with the same string pressure...
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From my experience uprights have much higher string tension.

mikeyswood said:
Double bass and electric bass are only similar in octave.
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Agreed but thats not being discussed.

mikeyswood said:
Next time you are in your bass shop ask about Lignum Vitae. They won't have it for two reasons: They have never heard of it or "that is the way its always been done." The Ebony pieces you mention are just scraps from the off falls of the fingerboard and bridge.
Click to expand...
I'd believe that for the saddle and the nut, the fingerboard obviously is the largest piece, then the tailpiece, but it doesnt really matter if they are scraps, what matters is the fact that I have never seen any part of an upright bass (talking about fingerboard, nut, saddle, tailpiece) crack under the pressure. I'm sorry but you saying that an ebony nut will crack under the pressure of the strings on a bass guitar is just erroneous.Yes, maybe lignum vitae would be better for its lubricating qualities, but the bottom line is ebony works, and has worked for longer than anyone on this forum has been alive
 
#40
The tension of the string is self contained per Young's modulus. The pressure that the string puts on the contact points is not the same.

Pay attention. My statement is that Ebony is a fissile material and will splinter out under pressure. A good debate requires you to pay attention.
 
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