Sounds like what some bands would say about CBGB. But IMO, I loved every show I played there, paid or not. Depends what your band needs to get out of the gig!
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Would you play this gig?
- Thread starter Bass'd on a true story
- Start date
Yup. We played a place in DC where we got all the door. Place was freaking packed. $10 cover. Turns out the guy at the door, who worked for the house, was a local and let in all his buds for free. He collected a total of $200 bucks. Not playing there again.
/thread right here. Go check the place out and give it the sniff (ha ha) test. You will be able to sense what kind of joint it is and if you should bail or not. Having said that, I probably wouldn't bail unless it was REALLY bad but you know, self preservation is a virtue.
I've read that CBGB used to have a newsletter which included a recurring column by the owner's dog. He wrote about what a hole the place was, plus there was poop everywhere.
To the OP, let us know how the gig goes. I don't put any stock in customer reviews. Only two kinds of people write them; the owners of the venue to try to make themselves look good under a pseudonym, and people who want to complain. Happy real customers don't bother. Anyway, I've played places that are pretty grimy dives that wouldn't get good reviews, but they're also neighborhood watering holes with enthusiastic crowds who love live music. Bands saying the place stiffed them is more concerning. I would contact them to get the whole story, and if you're concerned, see about getting a deposit or something.
It's been rare, I try hard to be a good soldier and take it on the chin for the sake of "exposure," but I have been in that situation a few times where I really did not want to wallow in the dysfunction and set myself and the band up for a horrible experience. I've had band leaders suggest a few places like this, and after I researched these rooms and actually visited them, smelled the piss and got a whiff of the bad attitudes from the surly staff and regular patrons, I told the band leader or booking person "sorry, this is a really bad idea, let's wait for something just a little better to come along."
My rule is, if it's so bad it would embarrass me to invite my friends and family and have them experience it, it's questionable at best.
Yes, talk to the band leader and diplomatically share your concerns. With any luck, he'll take your intuition into consideration. If not, go with the flow and if it goes south you can say "told you so" and have a little leverage with picking more appropriate rooms in the future. Some musicians have to actually experience the gutter to find their dignity and be more selective.
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invite some older folks who already are wearing their Depends ... they'll never notice .. ! and Yes , i live in a 55+ gated golf community ...
but really , i'd cancel the gig ... not paying up would be a mistake with my previous bands, that where full of military types that had gone on to be docs/lawyers ...
but really , i'd cancel the gig ... not paying up would be a mistake with my previous bands, that where full of military types that had gone on to be docs/lawyers ...
If you signed on for it, you should play it. Doing research on a venue should be something you do before agreeing to a gig, not after...due diligence and all that.
Be real careful with "part of the door" gigs. Get it in writing (contract!) along with any exceptions to the door count they will claim such as, "these are regulars who'd be coming in here even if you weren't playing", or "this many people left before midnight so they didn't drink much and don't count". Got burned badly by a well-known spot in Southwest Virginia and will only play for set pay now because of it. We were smart enough to have our own guy at the door counting paying customers as they came in so we got something out of it, but not nearly what was expected.
So, a couple of things to consider:
• If you go in expecting to just get the exposure, you won't be disappointed by the pay.
• If you invite all your acquaintances to the place and it really is a dive and smells like piss, most of them will NOT show up when you invite them again.
Needless to say, we never played that location again.
So, a couple of things to consider:
• If you go in expecting to just get the exposure, you won't be disappointed by the pay.
• If you invite all your acquaintances to the place and it really is a dive and smells like piss, most of them will NOT show up when you invite them again.
Needless to say, we never played that location again.
In NYC, there are musicians that support themselves specifically by going to the place that reeks the most of piss, and busking there!
slobake
resident ... something
Make sure it's free first, the club might charge the band for drinks.
I had a club charge me for SODA once. I never thought to negotiate free soft drinks!
That's good, since you agreed to do it previously.
I would do two things in advance of the gig - communicate with the bar that "regulars" don't get a free pass, period. Other than the agreed to number of folks on the guest-list every body walking through the door counts towards your fee, regardless of whether the doorman charges them and 2. Make sure you have one of your people count the door next to their door guy.
One of those little click-counter things is a good incentive for the bar to be honest.
I don't even think my local bar charges me for soda!
jive1
Commercial User
The venue the OP describes reminds me of the Cricket on the Hill in Denver. I did a gig there many moons ago, and to be honest, it really wasn't worth it. The pay was crap, the other bands on the bill were marginal, the management or staff wasn't really nice to us, the soundman took a cut, and the crowd was hit or miss.
jive1
Commercial User
My concern would be the place having a reputation for stiffing musicians. If it's matter paying bands less than what they expect for the turnout, that's one thing. But, if the place flat out stiffs bands, then that's enough reason to avoid playing the place. I just don't want to support a place that would do that in any fashion.
That's cool you've played there. The Cricket has kind of cleaned up its act a bit, but I'm sure there was a day when it was sketchy. Last time I said "no" was with a bar that shall remain unnamed near the DU campus. The whole place literally smelled like an unflushed urinal and black floors, walls, and ceilings just added to the mystery. I would think this would be a more common problem with some campus bars.
Getting stiffed on pay is the ultimate insult, but I'm just as concerned about this effect:
That starts happening, and you're going to have trouble with those bar owners who expect to see a table or two of your friends and family when they book you.
If you play the gig and all goes well/as expected, leave a good review to balance out the bad. Most people only leave reviews to bitch.
