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Would you play this gig?

#21
Played a place, South Shore Massachusetts. Supposed to get a buck for everyone through the door. Musta been 300 people that night. They gave us $25(all 300 were "regulars". Then they asked us to come back and do New Years :)


...wonder if they had a band at all on the 31st?
 
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#23
Write a contract. Specify everything from who counts the door, and verification of head count (my old band used to have our own guy at the door with a counter, when we had to play venues that were notorious for undercounting the door). How much the band gets paid, how, and when. And in a personal responsibility clause (there are sneaky ways of writing these) and a"loser pays legals fees, in case of legal cation require to get paid, and have the venue sign it. Tell the venue that the contract (title it "agreement to perform") is there to make sure there is no confusion about the band's appearance, time the band is to play, etc. And if the venue won't sign it, then there is your answer. Then you can tell your friends the venue and the band couldn't agree on terms of a performance contract. No slagging, no shade thrown, just business.
 
#25
Bass'd on a true story said:
So my band has a gig at a venue in DC coming up this week. Pretty standard fare upon first look. We get a cut of the door, we play our set, we leave. I was thinking about inviting a lot of my friends to this gig, as it's a good night for everyone and a lot of my buddies are off. Before I invite people, I always read reviews about the venue, to make sure it's not a dump.

Here are some paraphrases from reviews I read:
1. The entire place reeks of piss.
2. The staff is really rude.
3. The management is worse than the staff.
4. (Saw this one from no less than 10 different musicians posting) They didn't pay us.

I've never bombed on a gig before, but I've never seen even one musician say they were screwed in the Yelp/Google/Facebook reviews. This had at least 5 musicians complaining on each review site I went to. Some of them even saying stuff like "I can't wait till they eff the wrong musician and get what's coming to them..."

What would you do in this situation? Should I just play the gig and expect it to be exposure only, despite it supposedly being a filthy venue with bad service? Should I call the venue ahead and express my concerns? Should I talk to the BL about potentially backing out of this one? I've never encountered this situation before.
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As long as the gig isn't going to cost you a ton of money (gas to drive there and so on) I would go ahead and just do it. If it's a bad experience then don't book another show there. Personally i never expect to make much money playing any venue for the first time unless it's in our hometown where we draw decently. I think a lot of bands are unrealistic with pay and that could be part of the problem with the venue. In my area for example cover bands in particular want to make a set amount. Originals bands play for the door. When cover bands and tribute bands try to play the original band venues they often don't draw well, have to share the bill with other bands and don't make much money and aren't happy. Originals bands that can make additional money at these shows selling their own merch don't mind as much. But come on. Let's be honest. There's a ton of musicians who think they are worth more than they are. From the venues perspective it makes absolutely no sense for them to pay you hundreds of dollars in guaranteed money to play for a tiny crowd. Now if you're packing the place out and not getting paid decently then Yeah I can see a problem but having several friends who own live music venues I've seen both sides of it.
 
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#28
Nephilymbass said:
Now if you're packing the place out and not getting laid decently then Yeah I can see a problem but having several friends who own live music venues I've seen both sides of it.
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You must have some negotiation skills, my friend!

As to cover bands having unrealistic ideas about their worth, I am in one such band. We're in an area where currently, EUR 250 is the going rate for a 90 - 120 minute set of covers. My band charges EUR 450 / 500 because "we have a full PA and a sound man who also needs to get paid". He is the guitarist's brother. Guess what ? We do not need a full PA nor a sound man when playing some bar for 30 people ... And they wonder why the gig offers are just not coming in ...

Back on topic, I once booked a gig and got a last-minute cancelation from the venue owner. Vague reasons were given and I was pissed. I looked on her site and warned the bands who were booked a few months later. Told them: "For what it's worth, we got cancelled without proper explanation." They weren't, and they got paid. Had they based themselves purely on my own experience, they would have missed out on a gig.
 
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#31
EddiePlaysBass said:
You must have some negotiation skills, my friend!

As to cover bands having unrealistic ideas about their worth, I am in one such band. We're in an area where currently, EUR 250 is the going rate for a 90 - 120 minute set of covers. My band charges EUR 450 / 500 because "we have a full PA and a sound man who also needs to get paid". He is the guitarist's brother. Guess what ? We do not need a full PA nor a sound man when playing some bar for 30 people ... And they wonder why the gig offers are just not coming in ...

Back on topic, I once booked a gig and got a last-minute cancelation from the venue owner. Vague reasons were given and I was pissed. I looked on her site and warned the bands who were booked a few months later. Told them: "For what it's worth, we got cancelled without proper explanation." They weren't, and they got paid. Had they based themselves purely on my own experience, they would have missed out on a gig.
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Lol laid, paid lol
 
#33
We have a venue in St. Pete called The State Theatre. I love that place and have seen some amazing bands there. National acts, not just locals. Here's a quick rundown: the bathrooms all reek of piss (men's/women's), the bouncers are cool but the bartenders can be pretty rude at times, very little lighting or fluorescent tape on stage so getting up the stairs can be a challenge, the floor for the audience is always sticky since people tend to throw beer there, and the backstage area for the bands is about the size of a small U-Haul trailer. That said, I would gig there every night if I could. I absolutely love it there. You never know, OP; you might love this place, too.
 
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#34
Nephilymbass said:
As long as the gig isn't going to cost you a ton of money (gas to drive there and so on) I would go ahead and just do it. If it's a bad experience then don't book another show there. Personally i never expect to make much money playing any venue for the first time unless it's in our hometown where we draw decently. I think a lot of bands are unrealistic with pay and that could be part of the problem with the venue. In my area for example cover bands in particular want to make a set amount. Originals bands play for the door. When cover bands and tribute bands try to play the original band venues they often don't draw well, have to share the bill with other bands and don't make much money and aren't happy. Originals bands that can make additional money at these shows selling their own merch don't mind as much. But come on. Let's be honest. There's a ton of musicians who think they are worth more than they are. From the venues perspective it makes absolutely no sense for them to pay you hundreds of dollars in guaranteed money to play for a tiny crowd. Now if you're packing the place out and not getting paid decently then Yeah I can see a problem but having several friends who own live music venues I've seen both sides of it.
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Cover bands have no business playing original venues. It is their own fault for doing the show. The original world and the cover band world are two, completely different sets of circumstances, and are not comparable in a monetary way.

Don't hate a cover band for wanting compensation for a six hour professional commitment.

Don't hate an original band for playing for pennies and beer, while slugging it out in the trenches to achieve their artistic dreams.

They are two different worlds.





OP-. Good for you for doing the gig! Can't wait to see the report!
 
#36
I would never agree to a gig without a signed contract. Our standard back in the 80's was $200 vs. half the gate, whichever is larger. Our man, not theirs, counts the gate. They don't sign ten days before the gig, we don't play.

One club manager tried to renegotiate ten minutes before we went on because it was raining and he expected a low gate. We spent 3/4 of an hour "tuning up" before he finally decided to honor the contract.

We also had a security rider in our contract, as we often played high school gigs. One time there was not a security man in sight as we started (and I, for one, had argued against even starting). A drunken brawl started during our third song, which ended up with our keyboard player being knocked out by a flying bottle. We ended the gig right there. Spent four years in court with the promoter, ultimately winning our fee, plus damages and our keyboard player's medical bills - she still has a noticeable scar on her forehead as a souvenir from that show.
 
#39
Most music venues don't smell very good.

Bar staff is never really that friendly anywhere.

Bar/Restaurant managers are a special breed and most have so much on their plate that getting the time of day from them is already asking a lot.

BUT... not coming through on a business arrangement (paying the band) is a big red flag for me. I would try to reach out to the venue with eagerness to play but with concerns of non-payment.

You should still play the gig though, backing out would be unprofessional.
 

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