Double Bass Yamahiko: Single sensor too hot!

[fasternak]

You don’t need the HPFpre. But you have asked.

It doesn’t matter if you use a box with two jacks or build it into a short extension cable. I just thought the short extension cable is the cheapest and easiest way for something removable.

You can even solder the capacitor into your normal cable on either side.

Depending on the type of capacitor it might not fit into the jack/plug, then you might need a box.

The capacitor goes from tip (hot) to sleeve (ground) anywhere on the way to your amp. Do you really need a schematic for that?

You nailed it, DoubleMidi !!! And I was too ignorant to realize it. Put a capacitor in a cable. It sounded just a little too simple to be legit. I am sorry.

I wrote to Yamahiko last night. They sent me the solution this morning.

Kiyohiko at Yamahiko writes:

The output level of the pickup can be reduced in the following way.
The easiest way is to make an attenuator cable.
Connecting the film capacitor C between hot and cold of the cable connecting the pickup and the amplifier can reduce the output level by ATTdB.
C=3300pF, ATT=12.5dB
C=4700pF, ATT=15dB
Please Note,
Install the capacitor inside the metal shell of the 1/4 phone plug.
Please refer attached PDF document.
Use a 50V film type capacitor.
I think the film type capacitor makes the best sound.

 

[fasternak]

 

[Ben Rolston]

as a person with a yamahiko, but no soldering iron -- any advice about who to take this to? a guitar repair shop?

 

[fasternak]

as a person with a yamahiko, but no soldering iron -- any advice about who to take this to? a guitar repair shop?

Hi Ben - Shame to pay that much for something you or a friend with an iron can do for maybe no more than 25 cents. What makes you think you need a this? My Yama is mind blowingly loud with anything more than a sliver of gain and titch more volume. I mean whoppingly loud. You’re having the same problem? If not, than you don’t need the cable mod. I can balance gain/vol. But it’s tiresome working with so little nob. I’m looking forward to turning the gain all the way to 10 or 11 o’clock. I am working in the range of 6:30 to 7:30 now, if you can picture this. It’s do-able but tiresome.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

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You might want to put some isolation foil around that type of capacitor to avoid a short.

 

[DaveAceofBass]

I just bought a single sensor Yamahiko and installed it on my bass that had a Full Circle. My initial test on my amp was great. I can hear it’s louder and maybe it’s prone to clip amps, but I wanted a hotter more responsive pickup so I’m super happy! Big gig tomorrow where I’ll really put it to the test. If it works great I’ll get another one or maybe the pair for my fully carved bass.

 

[fdeck]

I like the idea of putting the capacitor in a cable. It's a pretty non invasive way to try it out. Different pickups have different capacitance, so it might take a bit of experimenting to get a capacitor value that works for your pickup.

 

[Don Hergert]

Hi- My Yamahiko single is too hot to manage easily via gain staging.

I like the idea of putting the capacitor in a cable

Speaking of which, have you tried one of these?
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I had the opposite problem as the OP, my mic was not hot enough. The CP8201 fixed it for me, I've been told mostly likely through impedance bridging.

I'm not at all an electronics person, but would the AT8202 be able to do what the OP is wanting? It sounds from the description like it is targeting input overload.

 

[Ben Rolston]

Hi Ben - Shame to pay that much for something you or a friend with an iron can do for maybe no more than 25 cents. What makes you think you need a this? My Yama is mind blowingly loud with anything more than a sliver of gain and titch more volume. I mean whoppingly loud. You’re having the same problem? If not, than you don’t need the cable mod. I can balance gain/vol. But it’s tiresome working with so little nob. I’m looking forward to turning the gain all the way to 10 or 11 o’clock. I am working in the range of 6:30 to 7:30 now, if you can picture this. It’s do-able but tiresome.

Yes mine is too hot- Like 20- 30% clipping gain at 0 on my preamp. I don't have a soldering iron, nor do I have any friends who have one-- at least not in NY yet. I've contemplated having my preamp sent back to the factory for a gain adjustment, but this seems like a better solution / cheaper even at a guitar shop.

 

[DaveAceofBass]

Yes mine is too hot- Like 20- 30% clipping gain at 0 on my preamp. I don't have a soldering iron, nor do I have any friends who have one-- at least not in NY yet. I've contemplated having my preamp sent back to the factory for a gain adjustment, but this seems like a better solution / cheaper even at a guitar shop.

What kind of amp? The AI Clarus has internal jumper you can modify to give -6db input gain

 

[Ben Rolston]

What kind of amp? The AI Clarus has internal jumper you can modify to give -6db input gain

Felix preamp. It has a jumper to add gain, but not reduce

 

[fasternak]

Speaking of which, have you tried one of these?
Invalid Link Removed
Invalid Link Removed

I had the opposite problem as the OP, my mic was not hot enough. The CP8201 fixed it for me, I've been told mostly likely through impedance bridging.

I'm not at all an electronics person, but would the AT8202 be able to do what the OP is wanting? It sounds from the description like it is targeting input overload.

I have not tried these. But will look into ‘em if the cable mod doesn’t work. Thanks!

 

[fasternak]

You might want to put some isolation foil around that type of capacitor to avoid a short.

I ordered a bag of 50v 3300pf film capacitors ($6) and half doz 1/4” jacks from a diy stomp pedal retailer yesterday. Plan to put the cap between two jacks inside of a short piece of pvc tubing. I’ll use it with a short patch cable. Couldn’t be easier to assemble or cheaper to build. Wondering how it might change the quality of sound though. I’ll post my conclusions here shortly in case you or any one else here is interested.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

BTW, if you make more than one the capacitance will add if you use more than one of these adapters/cables.

If you use PVC tube, make sure to shield and ground it if you want to use the adapters regularly or on stage.

 

[DaveAceofBass]

Update...just sound checked and no clipping issues from what I can tell. My impression of the Yamahiko vs. the Full Circle so far is that the Yamahiko has a bit more output and also a tad more midrange. I felt like the Full Circle would reach a threshold with response to a harder attack, the Yamahiko seems to give me more back of what I’m throwing at it. That said, it sounds similar to the Full Circle.

 

[fasternak]

Update...just sound checked and no clipping issues from what I can tell. My impression of the Yamahiko vs. the Full Circle so far is that the Yamahiko has a bit more output and also a tad more midrange. I felt like the Full Circle would reach a threshold with response to a harder attack, the Yamahiko seems to give me more back of what I’m throwing at it. That said, it sounds similar to the Full Circle.

The difference between what I’ve owned and used in the past - Underwood, Realist, FC - and my current single Yama is huge. I have to wonder why we don’t all have a scream’n Yamahiko. My normal experience with common pickups is all pretty much the same. And I have often wished I could get more out of em. As I mentioned before, my Yamahiko is usable but it leaves me with very little to work with in terms of staging. If for example, I set the gain at 9 o’clock on my Clarus SL-2 w/ volume boost off, I might be able to dial in one degree of volume. Whereas, I am accustomed to 11 to 1 o’clock gain and maybe rolling volume to max on occasion sans distortion. My Yama is scream’n. Maybe I have a defective sensor. BTW, the email I got from Yamahiko does say ‘some’ (not all) single sensor owners report having this issue. Which is presumably why they were so quick to send me what looks like a stock solution with a photo of the modified cable. I don’t imagine they put this solution together exclusively for me overnight. In fact, no one I’ve spoken to about this outside of Yamahiko even believes this is possible.

 

[DaveAceofBass]

The difference between what I’ve owned and used in the past - Underwood, Realist, FC - and my current single Yama is huge. I have to wonder why we don’t all have a scream’n Yamahiko. My normal experience with common pickups is all pretty much the same. And I have often wished I could get more out of em. As I mentioned before, my Yamahiko is usable but it leaves me with very little to work with in terms of staging. If for example, I set the gain at 9 o’clock on my Clarus SL-2 w/ volume boost off, I might be able to dial in one degree of volume. Whereas, I am accustomed to 11 to 1 o’clock gain and maybe rolling volume to max on occasion sans distortion. My Yama is scream’n. Maybe I have a defective sensor. BTW, the email I got from Yamahiko does say ‘some’ (not all) single sensor owners report having this issue. Which is presumably why they were so quick to send me what looks like a stock solution with a photo of the modified cable. I don’t imagine they put this solution together exclusively for me overnight. In fact, no one I’ve spoken to about this outside of Yamahiko even believes this is possible.

I believe you. My experience has been less than 24 hours. I installed it last night, played on my amp 5-10 minutes and now I’m at a big concert gig I have. No issues with sound. FWIW I was using a Clarus Series 4 Plus head into Barefaced Super Midget cab, and now I’m playing through an Ampeg 8x10 cab and matching head (backlined). Sounds great to me!

 

[fasternak]

One 3300pf 50v 2% ECQ-P Polypropylene Film Capacitor and two 1/4” jacks in a PVC pipe did the trick. Still have greater than average input voltage (which I like) but staging is far more manageable. No need for shielding it seems. I know nothing about electronics, if this isn’t obvious to anyone. But this is pretty simple work if you’ve got a soldering iron.

 

[flatback]

Hey Just wondering if you are sure to have a little space between the adjuster and the bridge? If there is no space the pickup can have a weird sound maybe too hot? but there should be a little space...you prolly have it but just in case ...

 

[Ric Vice]

The advantage of the FDeck is that it handles input impedance, High Pass Filtering, and volume control all with one little inexpensive box, that only
adds a 2DB increase to the boost the signal just enough to make up for the loss it creates when you put it into the signal chain. If I recall correctly,
the boost added by the Fishman is a lot hotter and may just be adding to much gain in ahead of the pre amp on the Clarius SL2. If you're having the same
issue just plugging into the Clarius SL2 then as everyone has stated above you may need to modify a cable to lower the Yamahiko's output. Alternatively,
David Gage sells a cable for the Realist that does this as well, unfortunately it's not cheap, so if you can do it yourself, you'll be saving a good bit of money.
You can find it on the David Gage Shop site.

I discovered this cable I found the Realist was to hot for the old Headway EDB-1