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Your top setup tips

#41
251 said:
Appled math; Circumference is Pi (3.14) times the diameter. If the tuning post is 3/8th inch diameter, each wrap is a little more than 1 inch long. I cut my strings 3.5 inches longer than the distance to the center of the post, to get 3 wraps & Yes, I use a ruler. 8-)
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I'll be honest, I shut down at math :) But I used to measure 3-4" past the post, but I got lazy and tried eyeballing it and I kept screwing it up, so using the posts help as a consistent reference.
 
#42
buchananbass said:
It's just something I like to do because it's theoretically easier on the neck when the rod isn't having to fight string tension to get the neck where it needs to be.
I'll usually go a bit over my target point with the string tension off and then back it off a bit once it's in tune.
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It is physically impossible for the neck to maintain the same relief from strung to unstrung. The strings pull on the neck, therefore they have just as much influence on relief as the truss rod. If you adjust the rod without strings, then it will be completely thrown of when the string tension is applied. If the neck or rod can't handle fighting the strings while moving, it'll break when you tighten them up. Basic physics.
 
#44
96tbird said:
Just go to YouTube and search Carl Pedigo, head luthier of Lakland basses. He doesn't loosen strings, if it is good enough for him...... ;)

Really, how can you expect a satisfactory result when you remove an important variable: ie. string tension.
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Well unfortunately some necks require you to remove the neck. The Fender Geddy Lee comes to mind and some 70's Fenders, unless I'm mistaken.
 
#45
M0ses said:
If the neck or rod can't handle fighting the strings while moving, it'll break when you tighten them up. Basic physics.
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that's not always true, there are truss rods that are strong enough to hold a neck at a particular curve, but aren't strong enough to get it there un-assisted.

rickenbackers are the primary example; even with two rods it's standard practice to "help" the neck into backbow while tightening them.

the other case is problem rods, where they're already close to their maximum tightness.

being impatient, rather than slacking the strings i sometimes just prop the neck under the middle and push down the headstock, lifting the body in the air; the weight of the body gives me a little backbow assistance, enough to get the rod where i want.
 
#46
honestly, I do not see setup as being something too difficult or challenging... But to be fair, I was a machinist for 17 years, so I am used to being meticulous, and working with very precise measurements...

One day I just decided that I was going to try doing my own setups. I took a cheap bass apart. I measured, cleaned and inspected each and every single piece. Then I put it back together. I intentionally set it up poorly so I had a basis to work from. Then one by one I corrected the mistakes. Then I read everything I could find, and corrected the mistakes I did not know I had made.
After I had done it a few times, I started having people ask me to set theirs up the same way I had done my own
 
#47
walterw said:
that's not always true, there are truss rods that are strong enough to hold a neck at a particular curve, but aren't strong enough to get it there un-assisted.

rickenbackers are the primary example; even with two rods it's standard practice to "help" the neck into backbow while tightening them.
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You don't "help" a guitar into back bow. That is the opposite of what you want. You want neck relief, forward bow, or a "concave" appearance. Although with Ric's you are more aiming towards zero relief. Either way, dual truss rod Ric's don't require any assistance to achieve relief. I'm not sure where you are getting your information but it's incorrect.
 
#48
Lee H said:
honestly, I do not see setup as being something too difficult or challenging... But to be fair, I was a machinist for 17 years, so I am used to being meticulous, and working with very precise measurements...

One day I just decided that I was going to try doing my own setups. I took a cheap bass apart. I measured, cleaned and inspected each and every single piece. Then I put it back together. I intentionally set it up poorly so I had a basis to work from. Then one by one I corrected the mistakes. Then I read everything I could find, and corrected the mistakes I did not know I had made.
After I had done it a few times, I started having people ask me to set theirs up the same way I had done my own
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It's not difficult. This is all very basic. Just read a little bit and you will be far ahead of many other people.

Dam
 
#49
Rather than seeing 'setup' and 'playing' as two different things, Keep an eye on how your setup is working for you all the time while playing. Every time you think your bass isn't quite working for you as it might, have a little tweak and see if you can make it better...
 
#50
I used to agonize over setting the relief, until I read Sadowsky's setup tips: flatten the neck until the strings buzz at the first fret. Then, back it off a little bit. Done.

If it's good enough for Sadowsky, it's good enough for me. :)

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#51
M0ses said:
It is physically impossible for the neck to maintain the same relief from strung to unstrung. The strings pull on the neck, therefore they have just as much influence on relief as the truss rod. If you adjust the rod without strings, then it will be completely thrown of when the string tension is applied. If the neck or rod can't handle fighting the strings while moving, it'll break when you tighten them up. Basic physics.
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I believe there may have been a bit of misunderstanding going on here so to clarify;

The idea is to go over your target point with the string tension off that way when the bass is back in tune the string tension will bring it to where it needs to be or as often is the case with a bit more back bow (or less relief) then is desired.
Then you just simply back off the tension of the rod until it is correct, retune a third time (adding relief will make it flat) and then recheck.

Also in the countless number of basses I have setup I've never broken a rod from string tension nor have I ever herd of such a thing happening.

On most basses I will do my best to go over on my first adjustment so I can loosen the rod with the string tension on to get it there, rather then having to tighten it.

Now if it is a bass that requires neck removal to adjust, I try a bit more to go for the appropriate amount of tension the first time, because if I can get it right the first time I won't have to re remove the neck to tweak it in.

In this case it boils down to guess work, guess work that generally becomes better with experience.
Although some times you have ones that just don't like to cooperate.
For example I had a jazz a couple weeks ago that took four tries before I got the right relief.
willsellout said:
You don't "help" a guitar into back bow. That is the opposite of what you want. You want neck relief, forward bow, or a "concave" appearance. Although with Ric's you are more aiming towards zero relief. Either way, dual truss rod Ric's don't require any assistance to achieve relief. I'm not sure where you are getting your information but it's incorrect.
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Honestly I've only setup a handful of ric basses and I never tried tightening the rods with the tension on so I can't say for sure if it wouldn't work,
but I can say that I've heard from countless sources that ric recommends doing so and since that's how I operate anyways that's how I have done it.

Now last but not least, I'd like to mention that this isn't just some technique I've come up with all by myself.
I've been working on guitars for well over a decade, I went to a luthier school in 2003 and have worked with countless luthiers, read countless books, articles and seen a countless number of videos on the subject. I do things the way I do them through what I have been taught and concluded to be the best of my teachings.
And yes there are professionals out there with more experience then myself doing things differently but there are also professionals out there doing it the same.
Apples or oranges? ;)
 
#52
OK, so you aren't putting the bass back bow, you are simply physically removing the tension of the strings and adjusting the rod and then letting the neck settle. That was definitely a miscommunication on my part. I've seen that done by quite a few people. I believe in letting the rods do the work though, that's why they are there, to hold and adjust tension.

As far as Ric's go. I've never seen a Ric have problems with their truss rod adjustments. Ric's have one of the more flexible necks out there and they are more than capable of being adjusted by a simple turn of the rod(s). That was the only point of contention. I don't want people having yet another reason to complain about them (there's plenty already:D)
 
#53
john grey said:
When cutting a nut create an angle at the tuning peg side of the nut so that the string tree (or pegs) have all the opportunity to allow the string to angle downward. I like to use a "V" cut rather than a "U" cut so that differing size strings don't bind in the cuts, etc.
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One possible problem I see with this is that on bone nuts with slots on the low side, I could see a V cut making a cracked nut more likely...


- georgestrings
 
#54
georgestrings said:
One possible problem I see with this is that on bone nuts with slots on the low side, I could see a V cut making a cracked nut more likely...


- georgestrings
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Agreed. I frankly don't like bone nuts a great deal due to the inconsistency of the organic product. It's too easy to have density variances unnoticed by human eye. However understand that the "V" is mostly not a simple cut but a shaped angular opening, often with a bottom (on E & A certainly). To rid the nut of confines of not being able to move up or down in string size I will gladly lower witness point overall through reducing nut height. But if slack tuned two steps I doubt I would maintain that cut.
 
#55
251 said:
If the neck bears the weight of the bass, by resting the head on a bench or block, that will add relief that disappears when the bass is picked up. Wearing the bass is one way to avoid this.
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i get that. (to me) its just way more convenient and comfortable to do it sitting down with the bass in playing position on your leg.
 
#57
OK, I'm an amateur and I set up my own basses. I don't use a radius gauge. Tell me why I need to do this?

Thanks

buchananbass said:
Use a radius gauge!
I all to often see basses that where supposedly setup that don't have the strings set to the proper radius.

When you adjust your truss rod always remove the string tension.

If you have a bass that requires you to remove the neck in order to adjust the truss rod, tie off the strings at the headstock with something elastic. (I use my old hair ties)
That way you can loosen the strings completely, remove the neck, adjust and then bolt it back with out ever having to remove the strings be careful though as it can be quite tricky the first few times you do it.
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#60
Well you don't NEED radius gauges. You can set the radius when you setup your action by measuring the distance from the bottom of each string to the 12th fret (or whichever fret you want above the 12th) From E to G the distance will usually decrease a bit. So you are using the fret top as a radius gauge and don't have to buy a set of gauges. Dollar saved, dollar earned.
 

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