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Zoom B3 / MS-60B as custom overdrive
- Thread starter ticol07
- Start date
I made a try of this patch during my last gig :
1: Para Eq - F1 = 1.2kHz / Q1 = 4 / G1 = 13 - F2 = 4.5kHz / Q2 = 4 / G2 =6
2: SVT - B = 0 / Mid = -8 / T = 4 / MidF= 1.2kHz / Gain = 100 / L=32 / Ultra off / Mix 0
3: AcBsPre - G=50 / Depth = 10 / L=100 / B=0 / L-Mid=250/L-Mid=0 /Mid=2 / H-Mid=4 / T=-8
Total Bal = 38
I had to set the tone more than half cut on my jazz because of the big amount of highs of the patch, and the result was really pleasant. Big fat overdriven tone, perfect for some kind of QOTSA tone.
And I tried another one which was only the SVT sim without speaker sim, Bass, Mids and Treble at 0, gain at 55 with a patch balance of 50%, and it was perfect to give some hair to my clean tone without changing its tonality and keeping a good clarity.
1: Para Eq - F1 = 1.2kHz / Q1 = 4 / G1 = 13 - F2 = 4.5kHz / Q2 = 4 / G2 =6
2: SVT - B = 0 / Mid = -8 / T = 4 / MidF= 1.2kHz / Gain = 100 / L=32 / Ultra off / Mix 0
3: AcBsPre - G=50 / Depth = 10 / L=100 / B=0 / L-Mid=250/L-Mid=0 /Mid=2 / H-Mid=4 / T=-8
Total Bal = 38
I had to set the tone more than half cut on my jazz because of the big amount of highs of the patch, and the result was really pleasant. Big fat overdriven tone, perfect for some kind of QOTSA tone.
And I tried another one which was only the SVT sim without speaker sim, Bass, Mids and Treble at 0, gain at 55 with a patch balance of 50%, and it was perfect to give some hair to my clean tone without changing its tonality and keeping a good clarity.
I have some fuzz sound clips and patches for download on my Zoom B3 page. Check my signature below for the link.
I have a pretty good gated patch using the v-synth as the fuzz. I'll go check my settings in a minute.
Nice !
I found a new nice overdrive setting, in the spirit of the previous ones I tried but a nicer top end (because I find it difficult with the B3 to get a nice natural overdriven top end).
Here we go :
1- ZNR
Thrsld : 16 - EfxIn - 10
2- Overdrive
Gain : 0 - Tone : 69 - Level : 58 - Bal : 36
3- SVT
Bass : 0 - Mids : 4 - Treble : -4 - Mid F : 400Hz - Gain : 98 - Level :17 - Off - Mix : 0
Total Balance : 62
The idea is to use the SVT sim to get a good saturated tone on the lows and the mids and use another dirt pedal which is more focused on the highs to get a more natural saturated top end.
I had to reduce the highs on the SVT sim to get something more balanced.
And I feel that the small boost at 400Hz on the SVT sim helps to gain some clarity.
By the way, the DS-1 seems to work well instead of the Overdrive model. Different flavour but it may work too.
I found a new nice overdrive setting, in the spirit of the previous ones I tried but a nicer top end (because I find it difficult with the B3 to get a nice natural overdriven top end).
Here we go :
1- ZNR
Thrsld : 16 - EfxIn - 10
2- Overdrive
Gain : 0 - Tone : 69 - Level : 58 - Bal : 36
3- SVT
Bass : 0 - Mids : 4 - Treble : -4 - Mid F : 400Hz - Gain : 98 - Level :17 - Off - Mix : 0
Total Balance : 62
The idea is to use the SVT sim to get a good saturated tone on the lows and the mids and use another dirt pedal which is more focused on the highs to get a more natural saturated top end.
I had to reduce the highs on the SVT sim to get something more balanced.
And I feel that the small boost at 400Hz on the SVT sim helps to gain some clarity.
By the way, the DS-1 seems to work well instead of the Overdrive model. Different flavour but it may work too.
Last edited:
That's very synthy.
On an unrelated note....
Overall Balance - 50
Squeak - Gain 28, tone 40, level 90, balance 100 (same settings for the fuzz face and the two muffs)
AcBs Pre - Gain 60, depth 9, level 100, LM-F 800hz (but whatever your preference for the mids)
bass 0, LM 2, Mid 3, HM -5, Treb -10
Quite a growly, dirty tone (using my VM Jazz, slight bridge PU bias and tone at half, with La bella DT flats, so adjust to taste), slightly warmer for the fuzzes, more of a vintage vibe.
These settings on the AcBs Pre seem to make any of the dirt sims sound much better to my ears, getting rid of that horrible, fizzy, digital top end (as long as you keep the tone on the sim to around 50 or less).
These have only been played through decent headphones so far, I haven't had a chance to test them in a band situation yet, but I think from my experience they should hold up well.
I like to use the AcBsPre too to shape my tone after some dirt. Very good tool !
And I agree with you regarding this synthy effect on the top end with the B3. This is why I tried to use a combination of dirts.
I still struggle to find a very smooth but heavy (if it makes sense) overdrive. I think it could be called "creamy".
It sounds like there are not so many kinds of overdrives in the B3 : they seems to act on the signal the same way but with a different eqs.
By the way I'll give a try to your patch which seems to be nice.
I just don't understand the meaning of "bias" when you write slight bridge PU bias : it means a slight cut ?
And I agree with you regarding this synthy effect on the top end with the B3. This is why I tried to use a combination of dirts.
I still struggle to find a very smooth but heavy (if it makes sense) overdrive. I think it could be called "creamy".
It sounds like there are not so many kinds of overdrives in the B3 : they seems to act on the signal the same way but with a different eqs.
By the way I'll give a try to your patch which seems to be nice.
I just don't understand the meaning of "bias" when you write slight bridge PU bias : it means a slight cut ?
Bias is a favouring towards one thing rather then another, préférence pour, in this instance.
However it can aslo mean préjugé if you are biased against.
So I use a little more bridge Pick up then neck pick up.
I was trying to get a 'creamy' fuzz sound from the fuzz face and the two muffs. The Bass Muff and fuzz face is slightly warmer and creamier, a little smoother, with the Great Muff being a little more aggressive.
The BB with maxed gain gives a nice thick, smooth sound with the AcBs Pre settings above.
For a heavier sound I add in some octave from slot 1 with the mids set higher then the bass, and with the HPF from the AcBs Pre the lower octave isn't too strong so it just beefs up the sound.
I think your right about the dirts being very similar, it seems to be more eq based then anything. I started using additional pedals for my dirt and the B3 for just effects, but I found that in my bands I only really use distortion, so I thought I would make one on the B3 that I like.
Thanks for the english lesson
I gave a try to your AcBsPre setting with the Squeak or the BB before it, and it does the trick very well ! I tend to prefer the tone of the BB.
It's funny because I spent a lot of time with the AcBsPre to use it as a highs reducer and my attempts were not as good as your one. Very nice !
I hear too that it should work well with a band. I'll try tomorrow.
I, on my own, mainly use dirts as effects. And since I don't have the funds to give a try to as many pedals as I'd like, I decided to use the B3 for that purpose. I like the fact that I can set many patches in advance and then try them all quickly with my band.
At the end of my chain I have a VT bass set on a clean tone : it helps a lot to get nicer dirts.
Off Topic :
I saw on your profile that, as me, you're an illustrator too. That's fun !
Thanks for the english lesson
I gave a try to your AcBsPre setting with the Squeak or the BB before it, and it does the trick very well ! I tend to prefer the tone of the BB.
It's funny because I spent a lot of time with the AcBsPre to use it as a highs reducer and my attempts were not as good as your one. Very nice !
I hear too that it should work well with a band. I'll try tomorrow.
I, on my own, mainly use dirts as effects. And since I don't have the funds to give a try to as many pedals as I'd like, I decided to use the B3 for that purpose. I like the fact that I can set many patches in advance and then try them all quickly with my band.
At the end of my chain I have a VT bass set on a clean tone : it helps a lot to get nicer dirts.
Off Topic :
I saw on your profile that, as me, you're an illustrator too. That's fun !
Cool, glad you like it. I'm liking the BB and the Fuzzface the most at the moment, I was aiming for a stoner rock-kind-of tone, not sure I've got it but it still sounds good. I was running a marshall guv'nor+ or Ibanez PhatHed for dirt and a MXR DI+ in the same way to your VT but it was just to much to carry around Paris without really using it.
The AcBs Pre boosts the mids as well as reducing the highs so it's probably the single best tool to shape the dirt pedals. When I tried using an amp sim instead but my sound seems to get lost and muffled (speaker sim on about 20), but I like the sound of the Bassman and Superbass through headphones.
What do you illustrate? Got any links?
I'm a prof de anglais so the english lesson is starting to become second nature.
You're a better "prof d'anglais" than Reverso, because the translation of bias wasn't very clear for me
Regarding the fact of using the VT at the end of my chain, its bigger interest is to act as an almost flat speaker sim : I mean a cut in the ultra lows + a cut after 5 kHz, with the possibility to have some kind of flat eq (a thing that is impossible with the B3 speaker sims). And it adds nice harmonics to the signal. Most of the dirts that I tried sounded better through it.
I'm still asking myself if I shouldn't a Deluxe version to have multiple possibilities as I need some clean tone and dirty tones in my band. But I need the B3 for some other effects and I don't want to enlarge my pedal board which is today very simple.
Like you, I'm trying to find some kind of stoner tone for some tunes. And it's not easy to get this fat tone distorded tone without piercing highs, but still a cutting through tone.
My first patch wasn't perfect but worked in an interesting manner.
You should give a try to the SVT model without speaker sim as an overdrive. It doesn't sound as good as the VT pedal but it's not so far.
I send you a PM if you want to talk about illustrations as it is a little bit off topic
Regarding the fact of using the VT at the end of my chain, its bigger interest is to act as an almost flat speaker sim : I mean a cut in the ultra lows + a cut after 5 kHz, with the possibility to have some kind of flat eq (a thing that is impossible with the B3 speaker sims). And it adds nice harmonics to the signal. Most of the dirts that I tried sounded better through it.
I'm still asking myself if I shouldn't a Deluxe version to have multiple possibilities as I need some clean tone and dirty tones in my band. But I need the B3 for some other effects and I don't want to enlarge my pedal board which is today very simple.
Like you, I'm trying to find some kind of stoner tone for some tunes. And it's not easy to get this fat tone distorded tone without piercing highs, but still a cutting through tone.
My first patch wasn't perfect but worked in an interesting manner.
You should give a try to the SVT model without speaker sim as an overdrive. It doesn't sound as good as the VT pedal but it's not so far.
I send you a PM if you want to talk about illustrations as it is a little bit off topic
Hi guys, I'm following closely your discussions and trials with the B3 as a custom OD.
I don't actually have a B3 but a B1Xon and I experimented with the different setups you give above.
Very interesting sound shaping options with both the SVT and OD together + the EQ at the end.
I'm trying to emulate the sound of "Royal Blood" band. Just a bass and a drummer, the bass is played through a bass and a guitar gear in parallel.
One of the key effect in that sound is the pitch shifter (octave up).
You can listen it here:
Unfortunately the bass pitch or other pitch effects on the B1Xon (same on B3) are not sounding as good as the real pedals... there is a small pre-delay that makes it annoying and generates a sort of resonating sound that is not very nice.
Other prob is that even with 5 effects possible on the B1Xon it's reaching processing limit after 4 as I'm using pitch + SVT + OD + AcBs Pre...
I've managed to get something sounding quite close but not really satisfied.
Any of you have tried to get that kind of sound?
I don't actually have a B3 but a B1Xon and I experimented with the different setups you give above.
Very interesting sound shaping options with both the SVT and OD together + the EQ at the end.
I'm trying to emulate the sound of "Royal Blood" band. Just a bass and a drummer, the bass is played through a bass and a guitar gear in parallel.
One of the key effect in that sound is the pitch shifter (octave up).
You can listen it here:
Unfortunately the bass pitch or other pitch effects on the B1Xon (same on B3) are not sounding as good as the real pedals... there is a small pre-delay that makes it annoying and generates a sort of resonating sound that is not very nice.
Other prob is that even with 5 effects possible on the B1Xon it's reaching processing limit after 4 as I'm using pitch + SVT + OD + AcBs Pre...
I've managed to get something sounding quite close but not really satisfied.
Any of you have tried to get that kind of sound?
You're a better "prof d'anglais" than Reverso, because the translation of bias wasn't very clear for me
Regarding the fact of using the VT at the end of my chain, its bigger interest is to act as an almost flat speaker sim : I mean a cut in the ultra lows + a cut after 5 kHz, with the possibility to have some kind of flat eq (a thing that is impossible with the B3 speaker sims). And it adds nice harmonics to the signal. Most of the dirts that I tried sounded better through it.
I'm still asking myself if I shouldn't a Deluxe version to have multiple possibilities as I need some clean tone and dirty tones in my band. But I need the B3 for some other effects and I don't want to enlarge my pedal board which is today very simple.
Like you, I'm trying to find some kind of stoner tone for some tunes. And it's not easy to get this fat tone distorded tone without piercing highs, but still a cutting through tone.
My first patch wasn't perfect but worked in an interesting manner.
You should give a try to the SVT model without speaker sim as an overdrive. It doesn't sound as good as the VT pedal but it's not so far.
I send you a PM if you want to talk about illustrations as it is a little bit off topic
I struggled with the SVT as distortion, it sounded super compressed and seemed like it lost some of the power and didin't sound like I think a driven SVT should. I'll have to try again as a lot of people seem to be having some luck with it.
Perhaps having the B1Xon running close to it's processing capacity is causing the delay type problem.
Also he only distorts the higher octave leaving the lower one clean. I'm not familiar with the full settings of the B1Xon but what I would do ...
Set the overall balance at 50, therefore only half of your signal is being effected giving you the clean lower octave.
Set the pitch shift to octave up and dial out the original signal so you only have the octave up.
Add the distortion of your choice, the DS1 or Rat sim would be best, then apply the AcBs Pre to tame the fizzy highs and boost mids.
I would leave it at that so not to push the processor, however you could replace the AcBs Pre with the SVT or MonoTone for a more amp like tone.
Thank you jking you've put the light on something I didn't figured out before... there is no global balance on the B1Xon.
You can blend some of the dry signal in each of the effects but it's not the same thing at the end as what is called "dry" is the output of the previous effect in the chain.
However as I have an EBS microbass2 as a preamp I'll use the B1 in the effects loop only for octave up, dist and EQ and blend it to the original bass signal.
The only drawback is that I cannot cut the bass and keep only the high octave part for some parts of the songs unless I play with the blend button.
I would need an LS-2 to some point anyway....
You can blend some of the dry signal in each of the effects but it's not the same thing at the end as what is called "dry" is the output of the previous effect in the chain.
However as I have an EBS microbass2 as a preamp I'll use the B1 in the effects loop only for octave up, dist and EQ and blend it to the original bass signal.
The only drawback is that I cannot cut the bass and keep only the high octave part for some parts of the songs unless I play with the blend button.
I would need an LS-2 to some point anyway....
From my experience I've only reach the limit whenever using any of the amp sims. To reach the full limit I would say take out the amp sims. The downside is the amp sims on each preset is what really gives the player the true tone shaping awesomeness of the pedal. So unless necessary on those patches where you want to chain as many effects as possible, try not to use any amp sims and see if it works.
Hello, coming back to this thread after a few monthes
I had some other ideas to use the B3/MS-60B as a nicer overdrive/distorsion stompbox.
I have to say that I also use a VT Bass or a Joyo/Harley Benton as preamp, but it works without them, because if I use one of them I set it to something almost clean. It just gives a little more character to the dry tone.
After some tries, I decided to put these pedals before my B3, my goal being to make some kind of double rig flavor :
- clean rig = clean preamp before the B3
- dirty rig = the B3
And then I searched some good overdiven tones on my B3, using the 3 lots (one being used by the ZNR to reduce the noise generated by the drives).
First tries :
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- SQUEAK : Gain : 25 - Tone : 67 - Level : 122 - Bal : 10
3- SVT : Bass : 0 - Mid : 6 - Treble : 0 - Mid-F : 630 Hz - Gain : 100 - Level : 31 - Ultra : Off - Cab ORGN - Mix : 70
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 52
and
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- BB : Gain : 46 - Bass : -1 - Treble : -3 - Blend : 39 - Level : 78
3- SVT : Bass : 0 - Mid : 6 - Treble : 0 - Mid-F : 630 Hz - Gain : 100 - Level : 31 - Ultra : Off - Cab ORGN - Mix : 70
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 70
As you can notice, I use the Total Balance of each patch to get some dry signal mixed to it. It helps me to work only on the overdriven tone and then mix it with the clean one.
That way, it's possible to use the SVT drive flavor with a blend.
The combination of the SVT drive and the another dirt is sonically interesting and gives a sound less artificial to my ears.
Playing with the amount of cab mix helps to give the overdrive a more or less fat tone.
Another combination that sounds nice for the overdriven tone is by using the AcBsPre but in a more drastic way that JKing138.
I was inspired by the new Tech 21 Dug amp on which there already some threads. The principle of this new amp is to mix to channels, one simulating a clean bass rig, the other, a dirty guitar rig, with the help of HPF and LPF.
So I tried to use the AcBsPre that way, setting the Depht to remove a lot of lows on my overdiven patch. That way, the mixed signal remains very clean on the lows.
Here we go :
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- Bass BB : Gain : 84 - Bass 3 - Treble : 1 - Blend : 100 - Level : 70
3- AcBsPre : Gain : 50 - Depth 0 (cuts everything below 200 Hz) - Level : 100 - Bass : 0 - L- Mid : 5 - LM_F : 100Hz - Mid : 2 - H-Mid : 2 - Trebl : -10 => like that the overdive is more focused : no muddying lows and no fizzy highs. The Eq is also useful to tailor completly the overdiven tone.
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 50 -> the interesting parameter to keep some dry signal and maintaining clean nice lows
The values I used are not supposed to be perfect and work for everybody.
I mostly want to share the principle of creating flexible overdriven tones.
I have better results by using my VT Bass or my american sound combined to that patches, but if I bypass them, the results sound nice too.
To test this patches, I usually put an empty patch before or after the patch I want to try, like that I can alternate between the clean tone alone and the mix of the clean + dirty. It's more easy to hear the tone changes to check if lows are stille present, and what kind of frequencies are pushed in front with the overdriven channel.
If some of you want to make some tries and give me their feelings.
I had some other ideas to use the B3/MS-60B as a nicer overdrive/distorsion stompbox.
I have to say that I also use a VT Bass or a Joyo/Harley Benton as preamp, but it works without them, because if I use one of them I set it to something almost clean. It just gives a little more character to the dry tone.
After some tries, I decided to put these pedals before my B3, my goal being to make some kind of double rig flavor :
- clean rig = clean preamp before the B3
- dirty rig = the B3
And then I searched some good overdiven tones on my B3, using the 3 lots (one being used by the ZNR to reduce the noise generated by the drives).
First tries :
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- SQUEAK : Gain : 25 - Tone : 67 - Level : 122 - Bal : 10
3- SVT : Bass : 0 - Mid : 6 - Treble : 0 - Mid-F : 630 Hz - Gain : 100 - Level : 31 - Ultra : Off - Cab ORGN - Mix : 70
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 52
and
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- BB : Gain : 46 - Bass : -1 - Treble : -3 - Blend : 39 - Level : 78
3- SVT : Bass : 0 - Mid : 6 - Treble : 0 - Mid-F : 630 Hz - Gain : 100 - Level : 31 - Ultra : Off - Cab ORGN - Mix : 70
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 70
As you can notice, I use the Total Balance of each patch to get some dry signal mixed to it. It helps me to work only on the overdriven tone and then mix it with the clean one.
That way, it's possible to use the SVT drive flavor with a blend.
The combination of the SVT drive and the another dirt is sonically interesting and gives a sound less artificial to my ears.
Playing with the amount of cab mix helps to give the overdrive a more or less fat tone.
Another combination that sounds nice for the overdriven tone is by using the AcBsPre but in a more drastic way that JKing138.
I was inspired by the new Tech 21 Dug amp on which there already some threads. The principle of this new amp is to mix to channels, one simulating a clean bass rig, the other, a dirty guitar rig, with the help of HPF and LPF.
So I tried to use the AcBsPre that way, setting the Depht to remove a lot of lows on my overdiven patch. That way, the mixed signal remains very clean on the lows.
Here we go :
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- Bass BB : Gain : 84 - Bass 3 - Treble : 1 - Blend : 100 - Level : 70
3- AcBsPre : Gain : 50 - Depth 0 (cuts everything below 200 Hz) - Level : 100 - Bass : 0 - L- Mid : 5 - LM_F : 100Hz - Mid : 2 - H-Mid : 2 - Trebl : -10 => like that the overdive is more focused : no muddying lows and no fizzy highs. The Eq is also useful to tailor completly the overdiven tone.
Total : Level : 100 - Bal : 50 -> the interesting parameter to keep some dry signal and maintaining clean nice lows
The values I used are not supposed to be perfect and work for everybody.
I mostly want to share the principle of creating flexible overdriven tones.
I have better results by using my VT Bass or my american sound combined to that patches, but if I bypass them, the results sound nice too.
To test this patches, I usually put an empty patch before or after the patch I want to try, like that I can alternate between the clean tone alone and the mix of the clean + dirty. It's more easy to hear the tone changes to check if lows are stille present, and what kind of frequencies are pushed in front with the overdriven channel.
If some of you want to make some tries and give me their feelings.
Another fuzzy kind of overdrive :
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- DI+ : Bass : 3 - Mid : 2 - Trebl : 1 - Gain : 80 - Blend 100 - Level : 120 - Color : Off - Dist : On
3- Bass Drive : Bass : 2 - Treb : -2 - pres : -2 - Gain : 43 - Blend : 50 - Level : 66 - Mid : 4
Total : Bal : 50
1- ZNR : Thrsh : 10 - DETCT : EfxIn - Level :100
2- DI+ : Bass : 3 - Mid : 2 - Trebl : 1 - Gain : 80 - Blend 100 - Level : 120 - Color : Off - Dist : On
3- Bass Drive : Bass : 2 - Treb : -2 - pres : -2 - Gain : 43 - Blend : 50 - Level : 66 - Mid : 4
Total : Bal : 50
I've just tried the parametric before SVT sim and got very near to the tones achieved through a VT Bass DI, all I did was boost with frequencies around 800-2khz then knock the same frequencies back in the SVT sim. I always thought the new Zooms were missing the VT sound/sim, but not anymore. Great advice and ideas in here, cheers.
