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1969 SVT restoration project

glad that you got it sorted Jimmy! a vintage SVT is certainly something to behold. i would tend to agree with your tech about not using the tube relay. there's probably a reason why the ones built shortly after yours don't have it (besides the expense). i don't think that any of my SVT's ever had one.

BTW, if you find out that it has a noisey 12AX7 tube, let me know and if you want, i'll send you one of them (an Amperex, GE, or RCA). i may have a few vintage 12DW7's around here as well.

my old '69 SVT was converted to 6550's long before i got it, and it sounds great, but now you're making me want to put it back to stock with 6146B's.
 
Wow, look at everyone getting along now! That's cool...I like all involved very much, so even though I like to see people throw out a few tweaks here and there, I see no need to take it seriously.

Anyway, here's the report after getting it back...

I wish there was a "poop your pants" icon. Yeah, that's the sound! Holy cow, that's the sound! Never have I heard an SVT that sounds so good! That 6550 in there was killing it tonally. It sounds amazing! Birddog replaced all the caps, replaced all the plate wires for the 6146B's, installed a modern AC cord with receptacle, and fixed a grounding problem, and now it works as good as new. Almost...I think I may need to replace the 12AX7 in channel 2's preamp, which is a pain. But it's got crackling that's either a dirty pot or a bad 12AX7. Sounds great when it's not crackling. Not a big deal, but I'm surprised he didn't catch it.

Now for the "bad news"...he didn't use the tube relay. His explanation made sense...they're prone to going bad, and when they go bad, they lock up the whole amp. It's not a big deal, I guess, but I did pay $22 for it and I thought it was one of the cooler things about it. I also was a bit bummed that he didn't replace any pots that were non-standard. I thought I had asked him about that, but maybe I didn't.

Anyway, it still looks like crap cosmetically, but boy does it sound good! I'll post pics when I can but this is a bad 2-week stretch for me. It really doesn't look any different ;)


Well hey Jimmy, I don't want to upset one of your threads. Like I said, you, PBG, and most others are pretty cool, and we have a good time-why let anybody else ruin the fun?

I even deleted a couple of my posts towards Johnk 10 that I thought were harsh, and unneccessary-I guess he doesn't appreciate that, but hey, whatever.............

Can't wait to see those pictures! Now, you just gotta convince Bowser to hook you up with private transportation for you and that SVT-if he can stand to finally hear you lol! Does he even know how you sound? Lmao!!!

Be cool Jimmy-thanks for always being a good, and down to earth guy. People like you make this place worthwhile. :hyper:
 
Hey Beef, nope, Bowzer doesn't care how I sound, as long as he can't hear me ;)

Welp, it's off to WalMart for me to get some fuses. Yep, blew my first one. Don't know why, though. It was working fine, all of a sudden it made a little crackly noise and stopped working. Hopefully it was a fluke.

Also, the crackling in channel 2 was the 12AX7. I pulled it and I see that the tube that was in it was not the 12AX7 it came with, but a JJ ECC83. I pulled out all the tubes and he also replaced a 12DW7 with a JJ ECC832, I'm pretty sure it was for one of the tone switches. So I pulled out a tube from my Super and put it in and the crackle's gone. John, you should have a PM waiting shortly... ;)

Once I got the tube thing sorted, I AB'd the channels with both electric and upright. Channel one is much louder and much more bassy, even with the bass switch off. But channel two is perfect for upright. Channel one made the upright howl with feedback and low end. Channel two was perfect. I'll probably still use my Microbass II as a switcher and run both to channel one, but I'm going to have to roll off some serious low end on the Microbass.

Anyway, off to WalMart.
 
Whilst I wait for my laundry to dry, I'll tell you about ABing my SVT with my Little Mark II earlier today.

First off, this cab is severely underrated at 250w RMS. I had my SVT well into the red and had the LMII as loud as I could before clipping and the cab was fine. This was also the first time I could actually hear the limiter kick in on the LMII. Interesting...more noticeable than I thought it would be, but pretty musical nonetheless. Just a little too squashy for my tastes, though. I would never play that loud at a gig so it's a moot point for me, but I found it interesting that I could notice it. However, I could get the LMII a shade louder than I could the SVT before distortion kicked in. Not by much at all, just a little (EDIT: Duh...the LMII is 500w at 4 ohms...that's a small detail I forgot about...no wonder it's a little louder).

When I played both at my normal gigging volume (gain at 1 o'clock and master at 9 o'clock on the LMII, 9:45 on the volume knob on the SVT in the normal channel, both amps set flat), if you blindfolded me, honest to God I don't think I could tell the difference. However, the sound I had with the LMII pretty much stayed the same regardless of how loud or quiet I had the master. The SVT, surprisingly, sounded much better at volumes below my usual gigging volume than I remember. Even when running really low, it wasn't bad at all. But when I turned up past normal gigging volume, this amp opened up much more than the LMII. Treble sounded treblier, mids sounded middier, and bass sounded bassier. Both amps sounded great, but man, those tubes running at a good clip just get that sound, you know? The LMII behaves much more uniformly at different volumes by comparison. And those 6146B's? Never ever heard another SVT open up like that one.

So for my uses, which don't involve a lot of high volume, I could probably do just as well with an LMII. Again, to my ears, it captures a lot of what an SVT can do, and I still say it's the most SVT-like SS amp I've ever heard. But if you're more into higher volumes, crank the SVT and you'll see what separates the men from the boys. You don't get an SS amp to open up like THAT!!!

Sedan Dad, call your tech and bug him every day until it's done!
 
I was just directed to this thread by a friend on another message forum. Several days back I won an auction on eBay for a '69 SVT blueline ($860 including flight case!!), and just two days ago received the amp. The auction description said that the amp was blowing fuses and had been taken to a tech who estimated something like $700 for a complete retube and conversion to 6550s. Lucky for me I do my own tech work so I wasn't scared off by that; I think that's the reason the auction ended so low, well that and the economy.

First thing I did was pull the amp apart and have a look at everything. Two of the rectifier diodes were cracked apart, one of them leaving a nice big char mark on the PCB. Also, every one of the paper electrolytics had a nice little glob of that battery-acid-looking stuff that leaks out of old caps when they go south. To me, these were great signs, as they might explain the blowing of fuses and lead me to believe the transformers are alright.

I tested out all of the tubes on both my Eico667 and Hickok6000A, and to my surprise, every single one tested stronger than new, with one exception-- one of the 6146Bs shows a short (on both testers) from the grid to cathode. So it's sort of funny to me that the seller's tech was calling for a complete retube when it needs nothing of the sort. The output tubes are all Westinghouse 6146B Made in USA with 88-12 stamped above the Westinghouse logo.

My plan moving forward is to order the new cap kit from Fliptops and pick up a bunch of 6146B's-- found a seller on eBay who sells matched sets (matched at lower than SVT voltages, but hey, who actually sells 6146Bs matched at SVT voltages?) and is willing to hook me up with a large quantity of tubes that are "matched" by his standards. I'm thinking if I get 12 or 14 that should be enough that I'll not have to think about output tubes for this amp ever again. Just need to save up the cash to pull it off.

In doing my research on the 'net, I found out that this amp appears to be from that original production run. First off, it has an unpainted chassis, which from what I read was a characteristic of that first run. Second, it has the relay socket, though like the one in JimmyM's amp, this amp has a plugin piece that hard-wires it for operation, and it's got a standby switch on the back plate. The naming on the back plate reads "The Ampeg Company, Inc -- Linden, N.J. USA".

All of the amp components and solder joints appear original, with a couple exceptions. First, the power cord... the amp has what appears to be a receptacle where a power cord could have plugged in, but it's been filled in with expoxy. I haven't tried to pull the epoxy out and doubt that I will. I'll put a grounded power cord on, but other than that will leave that aspect as-is. The second thing that I doubt to be original is the speaker wire, which isn't the four-conductor like you'd expect (I actually have a Neutrik 4-pin-to-1/4" adaptor that someone gave me with a B25B I bought a few years back, which I apparently still don't need) but rather has a standard 1/4" termination. The cable is awfully short, and it's quite likely I'll switch it to a standard 1/4" output jack so I can use my own speaker cable - the EV 2x15" cab I usually use for bass has the receptacle down near the bottom, so the speaker cable needs to be fairly long.

The tolex is in non-mint but very nice shape, and the faceplate is frighteningly perfect. From the photos in the eBay auction I was worried it was a repro, but it's not, it's just in great shape. I won't do anything to it as far as cosmetics go, since I think it looks great as-is and there's no need to de-vintage it.

This is only going to be the second SVT I've worked on. The first is a '73 that I picked up on eBay a couple years ago and recapped and retubed. It will be really nice to have both of them at the practice space at the same time and A/B them to see if the 6146 version performs any differently to my ears.

One thing I'm intending to do and would love to hear feedback on is to switch the screen grid resistors to 1K 5W ceramics. My '73 came stock with diodes paralleled across the screen resistors which from what I understand was a bad solution for an annoying problem. Anyone see any issue with using 1K 5W resistors as screen grid stops?

I'll take some before and after pics when the cap kit arrives. She's a beauty.

And in case anyone is interested, I don't even remember who directed me to it, but I have a copy of the mother of all SVT schematics, it's 15 pages and has every preamp and power amp variation I've ever seen, including both of the 6146B versions.

http://toomanyhelicopters.com/schems/svt.pdf

There are a whole bunch of other schems in that directory, feel free to poke around. The only one that's there that you couldn't find anywhere else (as far as I know) is a scan of a Traynor YBA-3A with some hand-written power supply modifications that I scanned from one of my 3A's. Other than that, they're all schems that you could find in other places if you do enough searching- that's where I got them!
 
That's great that yours still has 6146's. Looks like you really know what you're doing. Got nothing to add except 6146W's are even a little cheaper than 6146B's and they're mil spec. If I had it to do over again, I'd have gotten them instead, but this set I got in here seems to be working out well after 6 months. Anyway, they're so cheap now that it seems crazy to mod them for 6550's. I think that of all the upsides for having an old Blue Line, the 6146's being so cheap is the biggest.