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7.25 jazz neck users help needed

gjooro

gjooro

Mar 27, 2006
671
32
Croatia
#1
It's just impossible to set it up correctly, isn't it?
E and G strings are always gonna be closer to pickups and therefore louder. The fretboard has small radius and the pickups are flat. The biggest problem is slapping, the difference in volume is too big
How do you deal with this?
the only thing that comes to my mind is using a compressor :hmm:
 
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#3
My Jazzes' pickups aren't flat. The center two sets of pole pieces are longer, providing the compensation for the radius. I've had no problem with differences in volume in either my low-action summer setup or their current higher-action winter setup. But these are not entry level Jazzes, either, and I don't know what comes on the other models.
 
#5
Someone ought to break out a calculator and figure out the difference in height between the inner and outer strings with a 7.25" and a 9.5" radius. I'll bet the difference in the difference is something like 1/16" -- which is not much, and probably negligible.

In other words, if you don't hear a volume drop with the common 9.5" radius, you probably won't hear it with a 7.25" radius either -- unless you hear with your eyes that is.
 
#6
Koki said:
It's just impossible to set it up correctly, isn't it?
E and G strings are always gonna be closer to pickups and therefore louder. The fretboard has small radius and the pickups are flat. The biggest problem is slapping, the difference in volume is too big
How do you deal with this?
the only thing that comes to my mind is using a compressor :hmm:
Click to expand...

Adjust them so that the E and G strings are higher, by about 1/64". So at the 17th fret, measured from fret top to string bottom, a good medium low setup would be something like 6/64" for the E and G and 5/64" for the A and D. Works like a charm and it feels great.
 
#7
RoboChrist said:
Adjust them so that the E and G strings are higher, by about 1/64". So at the 17th fret, measured from fret top to string bottom, a good medium low setup would be something like 6/64" for the E and G and 5/64" for the A and D. Works like a charm and it feels great.
Click to expand...

I know that but I don't want my g and e strings to be higher than others. I don't want to sacrifice playability
Kipaste said:
I love to have a real big arch on strings too so that they follow the fingerboard curve. With flatpole pickups the volume is indeed a problem, so your best bet is to go with pickups that have staggered/ adjustable polepieces.
Click to expand...
what pickups have adjustable polepieces?
I have a road worn jazz and I love the sound. I would maybe upgrade to nordstrand or fralin but I don't think they have adjustable polepieces
 
#10
PSPookie said:
He's only talking about 1/64". Does 1/64" really make that much of a difference to you?
Click to expand...

sure. The strings are about 1.5mm from 12th fret. 1/64 is about 0.4mm so the g would be almost 2mm from fretboard
RoboChrist said:
Try it. Then get back to me in this thread.
Click to expand...

That was probably the first thing I did but I don't like the feel. To compensate the volume difference G needs to be a lot higher than D. Now my G string is a bit higher than D (same with E and A) and the difference in volume is still here
 
#11
Koki said:
sure. The strings are about 1.5mm from 12th fret. 1/64 is about 0.4mm so the g would be almost 2mm from fretboard

That was probably the first thing I did but I don't like the feel. To compensate the volume difference G needs to be a lot higher than D. Now my G string is a bit higher than D (same with E and A) and the difference in volume is still here
Click to expand...

Hmm....and your pickup height? Maybe the poles are too close on the G string side...I'll throw some more numbers at you:

Measured from string bottom to pole top, on E and G strings, with last fret depressed, both pickups:

E = 1/8"
G = 3/16"

These are the heights recommended from Fender, and they work quite well.
 
#12
RoboChrist said:
Hmm....and your pickup height? Maybe the poles are too close on the G string side...I'll throw some more numbers at you:

Measured from string bottom to pole top, on E and G strings, with last fret depressed, both pickups:

E = 1/8"
G = 3/16"

These are the heights recommended from Fender, and they work quite well.
Click to expand...

I'll try to measure it tomorrow. The problem is, both E and G are louder than A and D so I don't think it will make any difference.
 
#13
Okay, I ran some numbers.

These are the total arch due to various fingerboard radii calculated at the front pickup of a Jazz bass:

12" radius, arch is 0.047" (~3/64")

9.5" radius, arch is 0.060" (~1/16")

7.25" radius, arch is 0.078" (~5/64")

The difference between 7.25" and the common Fender 9.5" is about 1/64".

The difference between 7.25" and the nearly flat Gibson 12" is about 1/32".

These are very small differences. It seems doubtful that they would be the cause of string to string volume differences.

Formulas here if anyone wants to doublecheck me:

http://www.mathopenref.com/chord.html
 
#14
Funny - on some basses I don't notice a big imbalance. But on my '51 reissue, the uneven response from a non-radiused picukp was really bugging me.

In this case, I was able to fix it, myself. I used a hammer and a drift punch and supported the bobbin on the other end as close as I could to the pole that was getting tapped on. I took the middle poles up, just shy of 2mm.

I was very pleased with the result - IMO the bass feels MUCH better to play when the strings respond more evenly.

I accepted that there might be a risk of ruining the pickup. (Apparently some designs would be much easier to damage.)

Some pickup builders will match your fingerboard radius. From now on whenever I order a new set, I'll definitely be doing that.
 
#15
P bass with split coils or adjustable pole pickups on a J.

I have a '51 P bass RI with a SD/QP and I found that if I lower the pickup it evens out the response of the E/G strings and alleviates some of the aggressiveness.
 
#16
What's interesting is that there's only 1/64" of difference between the 9.5" and 7.25" radius, yet you only see the string-to-string volume issue brought up with regards to the 7.25" radius.

It's the same deal in the guitar world. There's only 1/32" difference between the 12" Gibson radius and the 7.5" vintage Fender radius, yet no one ever complains about the string-to-string balance on their humbuckers. It's only the Fender guys, and more than that, it's only the 7.25" radius guys.

I wonder why that is?

It's like there's this cliff: you're good from flat up to 9.5", but as soon as you go to 7.25", somehow that extra 64th of an inch totally screws up your string balance.

For instance, I just found this on a pickup builder's FAQ. He expresses the conventional wisdom perfectly:

"Flat poles are great for guitars with radii equal/greater than 9.5. Staggered magnets are great for the curved radius, 7.25."

Invalid Link Removed

It's just interesting how only the 7.25" radius is perceived as curved when the actual difference in the arch is so small.
 
#17
Tusec said:
Someone ought to break out a calculator and figure out the difference in height between the inner and outer strings with a 7.25" and a 9.5" radius. I'll bet the difference in the difference is something like 1/16" -- which is not much, and probably negligible.

In other words, if you don't hear a volume drop with the common 9.5" radius, you probably won't hear it with a 7.25" radius either -- unless you hear with your eyes that is.
Click to expand...

I actually disagree. I admit that I exaggerate the arch by a bit, maybe a another 1/32", but the difference in volume is big, especially when recording. I can actually hear it with my eyes too while recording, as every time I play the E, the visual representation shows a big peak. So while searching for good staggered pickups, I've had to compensate by raising the strings. And I don't like it. I'd like cello like feel on the neck and maybe even a smaller radius than 7,25"

Koki said:
I know that but I don't want my g and e strings to be higher than others. I don't want to sacrifice playability

what pickups have adjustable polepieces?
I have a road worn jazz and I love the sound. I would maybe upgrade to nordstrand or fralin but I don't think they have adjustable polepieces
Click to expand...

I think you might be able to get custom nordstrands with adjustable polepieces. I asked this question back in the pickups forum and this is the answer I got. I haven't yet confirmed this as the nordstrand pages ask for customers to contact nordy dealers and the two places in Europe that I have contacted have pretty crappy customer service as they both pretty much replied "these are the models we carry..."
 
#18
Tusec said:
It's like there's this cliff: you're good from flat up to 9.5", but as soon as you go to 7.25", somehow that extra 64th of an inch totally screws up your string balance.
Click to expand...

well I went from nearly flat fretboard with pickups that follow the curve to 7.25 with flat pickups so the difference is noticeable . It's most noticeable when playing slap with a drummer. E and G are loud but D and A get lost in the drum noise
 
#20
Kipaste said:
I actually disagree. I admit that I exaggerate the arch by a bit, maybe a another 1/32", but the difference in volume is big, especially when recording. I can actually hear it with my eyes too while recording, as every time I play the E, the visual representation shows a big peak. So while searching for good staggered pickups, I've had to compensate by raising the strings. And I don't like it. I'd like cello like feel on the neck and maybe even a smaller radius than 7,25"
Click to expand...

Well, the E string is big and energetic with lots of excursion, so it seems natural that it would show up bigger on your meters. But this doesn't really seem like an issue that would be unique to 7.25" radius necks.
 

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