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A lesson for the elitists:

#2
If nobody in your household speaks "the language" then trying to learn it on your own will be futile. If your parents were proficient in "the language" and conversed with you all the time using "the language" then of course you'd pick it up naturally. But if everyone in your household speaks Spanish and you want to learn Chinese, well . . .
 
#7
Really funny how he says all that, but is still a very learned player who can read and write music and knows a whole lot about theory.

Sorry, ain't buying it. And I'm getting really tired of those who argue against learning how to read and learning theory "elitists." You don't have to spend much money on learning it at all. My wife taught herself how to read treble and bass clef within a week after getting a cheap electronic piano and a method book. So knock off the "elitist" nonsense. All it takes is a little effort and patience.
 
#8
I love Victori Wooten but I agree, him saying that learning theory and how to read music isn't important is totally and utterly hypocritical. That said, it's also completely normal for guys at that level, who learned all their bucket loads of theory years ago, to always say to people "Nah mann, it's all about your soul mann, you gotta play with feel mann, you just gotta let it flow through you and let it all be natural, you can't force it". Well, I'm sorry but you have to force yourself to practise because it requires discipline, and there isn't anything nlantantly "natural" about sitting in a room playing along to scribbles, but you have to do it to get good.
 
#9
I learned more about music and became much more proficient at my instrument in one year of being thrown into the fire playing open-mic improv sessions with regular gigging pros than I ever did in 6 years of music classes with learned music professors, so I can agree with Vic's mindset totally.
 
#10
Well of course the jamming helps immensely, but I'd say in rebuttal that it's very possible you never would have made it to that stage without learning what you learned.
 
#11
JimmyM said:
Well of course the jamming helps immensely, but I'd say in rebuttal that it's very possible you never would have made it to that stage without learning what you learned.
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You're right, but I will say that after awhile my previous education and practice routines began to hold me back since my classical training pushed me to be absolutely perfect. It wouldn't allow me to fail in order to learn from my mistakes, rather it led me to play 'within the rules', which is fine but for me it was too safe and boring, I might even say emotionless. Playing those open mic sessions allowed me to take more chances especially during solos and made my playing much more organic and natural and less rigid. But you're right, I had to have some knowledge beforehand to be able to fumble through in order to eventually feel my way through instead of having to think about what I was playing.

Although, for the record, I will say that there's nothing wrong with being an 'elitist'. They have musical knowledge that I may never know, so though I don't wish to be one, I respect them.
 
#12
Sure, you will learn a lot from playing in real contexts, and especially with people who will challenge you. And you can begin that at a very young age (or any age), and it's cool to make mistakes along the way 'cos that's a major part of learning.

Does that mean learning some theory and some useful skills like reading won't make you a much better musician? No, of course not. And I don't think that's what Vic was saying.
 
#13
Blue_Whistle88 said:
I love Victori Wooten but I agree, him saying that learning theory and how to read music isn't important is totally and utterly hypocritical. That said, it's also completely normal for guys at that level, who learned all their bucket loads of theory years ago, to always say to people "Nah mann, it's all about your soul mann, you gotta play with feel mann, you just gotta let it flow through you and let it all be natural, you can't force it". Well, I'm sorry but you have to force yourself to practise because it requires discipline, and there isn't anything nlantantly "natural" about sitting in a room playing along to scribbles, but you have to do it to get good.
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Where did you get that? I didn't hear him say "reading and theory are unimportant". His point, which I thought he made very clearly, was that the rules of the language - reading and theory - can come later, after the language itself has been absorbed and learned. My kids were talking in coherent phrases well before they knew the alphabet or how to spell the words they were using. They made plenty of mistakes, too. My 5 year old is just learning how to read, but he can carry on a very intelligent conversation.

I don't know how anyone could take what Wooten said and twist it around in such a way as to then accuse him of being a hypocrite or elitist or anything else. The whole point, made very clearly, was that music is a language just like any other and immersion in that language is the fastest way to really learn how to converse in that language.

Or maybe we all just hear what we want to hear and he didn't really say anything.
 
#15
Not sure it was a lesson for elitist. I think it was just a lesson on a different perspective to approach learning music and developing the craft behind playing it. I know a few newbies that like following the books and it's easier for them than other ways. @OP: Thank you for posting the video link, I absolutely enjoyed that and would have never found it otherwise. However, I don't think you needed to write the extra stuff. "To each their own." I say. We're all bass players here - that makes everyone of us "Elite" in our own rights!

Cheers! :)
 
#16
Nice sentiment in the video, but keep it in context, language is a communication skill, but can be used for artistic purposes, music is art.
What he says about learning is true and great to remember that we do indeed learn more from our mistakes, and making them is not bad, we need to be encouraged not to fear making mistakes, making mistakes means you tried.
 
#17
Victor knows loads of theory and can read music? Since when? He talks about how he knows very little in the groove workshop dvd. He plays some chords at one point and doesnt know their names. Has he been hitting the books the last few years or something?
 
#18
Victor started playing by age 3, so of course he is fluent in music. I agree with the general sentiment that music is a language. Theory and that stuff is like the scaffolding of a building. You don't need it to make a small building but if you want to build a skyscraper you better have it. It's ugly on its own but necessary, and when you're completed, it shouldn't be visible.
 
#19
To summarize:

1. Don't just practice. Play.
2. Don't let fear of failure stop you from attempting things that are beyond your current ability.
3. Play with people who are better than you.
4. Don't wait until you understand theory before you begin to play.

All of which sounds pretty uncontroversial.
 
#20
puddin tame said:
Victor knows loads of theory and can read music? Since when? He talks about how he knows very little in the groove workshop dvd. He plays some chords at one point and doesnt know their names. Has he been hitting the books the last few years or something?
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I'd be completely shocked to hear that Vic doesn't know how to read music. His buddy Ant Wellington does. I imagine he doesn't work off of sheet music very often, but he's got to know at least the basics of it to hang with the company he keeps.

But assuming he doesn't, try to remember that you and I ain't Vic ;)
 

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