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A purchase with issues
- Thread starter thomasjbass
- Start date
I haven't left any feedback. I am giving the seller 24 hours to respond how he see's fit and then move forward from there. Thank you again for everyone's opinion.
I've been on both sides of this equation. I had a shipment where there was damage and also received a product that was not as stated. In both cases we worked out a solution within the week. I don't know how you miss a cracked fretboard in a $2600 bass. If this was a lower end bass, it might be understandable. Additionally, with an instrument in this range, the manufacturer should show up somewhere in the conversation.
An instrument at this price point used shouldn't have a problem unless it was abused prior to shipment.
An instrument at this price point used shouldn't have a problem unless it was abused prior to shipment.
Just a quick FYI also, the seller said that he talked with the luthier and that he would replace the entire fretboard (which was not what I asked for, I actually asked for a refund). I got an email back from the manufacturer today after he has offered to look at the bass to make a diagnosis. Keep in mind I explained that the seller told me he talked with the luthier about the situation and that the luthier had already agreed to replace the complete fretboard.
Here is what I was told:
"Our customers love to promise that Tim (luthier) will do all kinds of outlandish
things, which is why he doesn't talk to anyone anymore. At this point
a year ago, we had seven basses sent back from various customers
because they changed their minds regarding what type of fingerboard
woods they wanted AFTER the basses were completed and delivered.
Making necks is involved work and takes time, I'm almost certian that
your bass needs nothing more than a simple fix, if warranted Tim will
make a new one ASAP, but we are backed up pending another paint issue
regarding the current backlog. Worst case scenario if it needs a new
neck: We'll fix what you have (temporary) and send the bass right
back then send a duplicate neck and pay for Jimmy to swap it out when
it's done. That bass originally shipped with Nordstrand series DC's,
not sure why the Armstrongs were dropped in there."
Just a little insight.
Here is what I was told:
"Our customers love to promise that Tim (luthier) will do all kinds of outlandish
things, which is why he doesn't talk to anyone anymore. At this point
a year ago, we had seven basses sent back from various customers
because they changed their minds regarding what type of fingerboard
woods they wanted AFTER the basses were completed and delivered.
Making necks is involved work and takes time, I'm almost certian that
your bass needs nothing more than a simple fix, if warranted Tim will
make a new one ASAP, but we are backed up pending another paint issue
regarding the current backlog. Worst case scenario if it needs a new
neck: We'll fix what you have (temporary) and send the bass right
back then send a duplicate neck and pay for Jimmy to swap it out when
it's done. That bass originally shipped with Nordstrand series DC's,
not sure why the Armstrongs were dropped in there."
Just a little insight.
I won't ask who the manufacturer is in a public forum, but their response concerns me more than the seller. If changing fretboards is somewhat regular, there are definitely some quality control issues. Hope you can get out of this OK.
From the way the email reads it sounds like it was more of a non-structural change of heart post-build, i.e. fickle-minded customers. Tim and the folks at Callowhill make solid, quality basses.
This is why I rarely buy used online anymore. A seller should offer 100% refunds if item recieved is broken, dented, etc.
JAUQO III-X
Inactive
I don't blame him.
Pickebass I know the luthier and he is a stand up guy. And most guys here have no clue how he was bombarded with all kinds of trivial requests. He, like any talented luthier feel that his skills are best served in the shop not talking on the phone every other day with a bunch of customers crying about what they want to change every time the wind blows. And how so many customers want progress pics.
And it's not about issues with the quality of his necks or fingerboards it's the issue of customers wanting to change an entire neck or fingerboard because they have super rock star attitudes, diva mentality, I payed you so you do what I say attitude, etc.
Thank Jaquo, I took your advice and it looks like it is going to work out with Tim and the guys. However, not so much with the seller. Per his email he is seeking legal council. Not really sure what for, but looks like I might have to go the same route.
At this point, the folks that made this beautiful instrument have been so cool and understanding. They have really tried to help me with an understanding of the materials that were used, some potential remote diagnosis, and have even offered to look at the bass.
I am not sure what is going to happen between the seller and I. But I will say that next time I will most likely buy one of these basses direct from this particular manufacturer because they have been such an understanding and helpful group.
At this point, the folks that made this beautiful instrument have been so cool and understanding. They have really tried to help me with an understanding of the materials that were used, some potential remote diagnosis, and have even offered to look at the bass.
I am not sure what is going to happen between the seller and I. But I will say that next time I will most likely buy one of these basses direct from this particular manufacturer because they have been such an understanding and helpful group.
This is a tough post. I feel for both buyer and seller. I understand that a simple repair would make it "good as new", but this is a $$$ bass. If it was a cheaper bass, I'd roll with the repair. Now, the buyer is stuck with this bass. If he decides to sell it in the future, he will be forced to disclose the crack, and ultimately take a hit in the price, or not sell it at all. The buyer definitely should've asked a ton of questions. I ask a ton of questions for most used items I buy. I think he'd have a much better leg to stand on if he questioned the bass head to toe. I think its wrong of the seller for not insuring the purchase price of the instrument. However, I would've asked the seller this question. It doesn't matter at this point, I guess. Dying to know the outcome. This thread makes me 
I don't disagree but I would think I would want progress pics and stuff like that at that price point, wouldn't you? Stuff like that comes with the business I would think. However, i've never bought a custom bass so I have no idea what is common practice. I do know if i would have a custom car built for a hefty price the maker should take my questions, stupid or not.
A couple of points imho/ime:
1. These types of issues are best handled in private. The original post asking for general opinions was probably OK until the link to the for sale thread was included - at that point it became "personal."
2. Totally believable that a bass can show up with issues that were not there when it was shipped. Stuff happens.
3. Items should be insured for whatever the replacement value is. There is no excuse for under-insuring, and the seller is assuming the risk for the balance at that point. That cost should be figured into the selling price.
4. The OP should not be disclosing comments made to him by the seller via PM or email.
1. These types of issues are best handled in private. The original post asking for general opinions was probably OK until the link to the for sale thread was included - at that point it became "personal."
2. Totally believable that a bass can show up with issues that were not there when it was shipped. Stuff happens.
3. Items should be insured for whatever the replacement value is. There is no excuse for under-insuring, and the seller is assuming the risk for the balance at that point. That cost should be figured into the selling price.
4. The OP should not be disclosing comments made to him by the seller via PM or email.
JAUQO III-X
Inactive
You have no idea at all how many customers were bombarding this luthier with pics request. And other time wasting bs. It got to the point that he was spending more time on the phone.
And the day of wanting progress pics is of a new customer culture that really amounts to nothing.
At the end of the day do you want a flawless bass coming from the luthier whom you've given your money to? Or time being taken away from getting your bass out to you in a timely manner? Obviously one would have to have trusted the luthier in the first place to give up the money to get things going.
There's nothing wrong with a pic here and there but at the end of the day luthiers should not offer progress pics.
And no I'm not being sarcastic.
Fully agree with this. What purpose do the pictures serve? You want the builder to take pictures, upload them to his PC, and email them to you at different stages, and then do that for every other customer he has? How do you think things will get done? Do you think you will spot an issue that the builder will not?
The only thing I've ever had custom made were my EarCandy cabs. I had a ton of communication with Tim the builder before we proceeded with the build. Once I was confident he knew what I expected of him, the only communication I really had with him during the build process was the periodic status update, and then I received an amazing product. However this is rather off topic...
From what the OP posted as a response from Callowhill, they sound like an amazing company with stellar customer service. Can you imagine what the response would be if this was a Fender?
I didn't read to the point where the luthier was mentioned. It's ashamed it had to come to this. I have heard great things about Callowhill and is on my short list for my next bass (Alleva-Coppolo, Callowhilll or Pavel). You do quite often come up with the Diva attitude.
However, from a purely business standpoint, you have to find the happy medium to please customers and not have anyone see too many changes/returns with the products. It can have a long term negative effect and cause unwanted conversations about the product.
No doubt a competent builder and sorry if I offended the builder.
Note to self....don't spend $ 2600 on a used bass without meticulously inspecting if first....otherwise risk extreme disappointment and the runaround.
You should meticulously inspect every bass you buy regardless of the cost and whether or not it's used or new
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