Active/passive what's the difference.

[A9X]

I have to concede both points on further consideration. I'm embarassed to admit in both cases I was just repeating things I had read here on TB, without analyzing them for truth.

That said, EMG and Schaller make "active pickups", therefore they exist.
http://www.google.com/search?q=active+pickups

Cheers Bongo.
No doubt about actives existing. I have EMG's and some old SD's that are active. I'm sure there are others, whether current or past production.
WRT input Z, some stompboxes can sound different with different source Z's by some accounts I've read. No personal experience, but as they are usually designed to 'effect' the sound, this may be a part of the design.

 

[bongomania]

WRT input Z, some stompboxes can sound different with different source Z's by some accounts I've read. No personal experience, but as they are usually designed to 'effect' the sound, this may be a part of the design.

This is certainly true, and it's something we discuss regularly in the Effects forum. Certain old transistor designs actually form an interactive relationship with passive pickups, responding "organically" to the EM activity of the coils and the volume knob on the bass. The buffer of an active bass blocks that interaction from occurring.

Come to think of it, that is probably the basis for the passive bass + tube amp concept I was describing, without knowing exactly what I meant. I'll have to look into it further.

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

Use the same preamp, such as a Aguilar 3 band... A,B,C three diferent basses with same preamp... ALL the same sounds. The settings may be different slightly, IMO due to pickups, placement, string height, etc... no high browing fellas. I've done the Pepsi challenge with several "high-end" basses.

 

[bongomania]

I say this sincerely and with no negative intention: Have you been to an ear doctor? Your hearing may be damaged by loud bass, it happens to a LOT of us without realizing it.

 

[A9X]

Use the same preamp, such as a Aguilar 3 band... A,B,C three diferent basses with same preamp... ALL the same sounds. The settings may be different slightly, IMO due to pickups, placement, string height, etc... no high browing fellas. I've done the Pepsi challenge with several "high-end" basses.

So have I, and my experience totally contradicts yours.

 

[spade2you]

A good bass is a good bass. I tend to prefer active because all of my basses have an active option, which kinda allows me to shape my EQ whenever I want and boost my signal when I want to stand out or correct the sound man.

Some people say that active pickups sound sterile, but the active piezo pickup is one of the warmest sounds you're gonna get. Some sound clanky, but that's the friggin point!!!!

 

[bongomania]

Use the same preamp, such as a Aguilar 3 band... A,B,C three diferent basses with same preamp... ALL the same sounds. The settings may be different slightly, IMO due to pickups, placement, string height, etc... no high browing fellas. I've done the Pepsi challenge with several "high-end" basses.

Let me ask you this: When you plug a variety of different passive basses into your amp, can you hear the difference between them? After all, they are all going through a preamp.

 

[nastyn8c]

I feel like interjecting a little something. I'm a fan of actives for the tone control, though I like the "clarity" of passive. Reason for the quotes: CHEAP preamps color the sound.

Now, I'm not as familiar with wiring as I'd like to be. Sheldon Dingwall wires his active basses to have a useful passive setting, where the passive setting is just as loud as the active setting, if all tones are set flat. My point: I have an OBP-3 in my ABII, and the difference in tone between active set flat and passive is negligible. There IS a difference, but not that much.

So...
I definitely have to go with bongo on this one. To say that there's NO difference in tone between active basses with identical preamps is ignorant. There is certainly LESS of a difference. Matt, you have the right idea, but you've taken it too far.

 

[69nites]

Bongo, your words are usually worth gold to me, but you said it all... "preamp built into"... so passive pickups are all there are. And yes, active circuitry bypasses wood tone and the "actual" pickup... all you hearing is the preamp... sorry... it is fact, and it's the only logical conclusion.

This is completely false.

"Active pickups" are also much lower output than a standard passive pickup resulting in the clarity of a low output pickup and the output of a higher output pickup..

there's a very large difference between an active pickup and active electronics.

I'm not even going to address the "all you hear is the preamp not the pickups or wood" as there happens to be a preamp section in (almost) every amplifier made today. Does the Pre in your amp cause you to not be able to hear the different pickups? I didn't think so.

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

I feel like interjecting a little something. I'm a fan of actives for the tone control, though I like the "clarity" of passive. Reason for the quotes: CHEAP preamps color the sound.

Now, I'm not as familiar with wiring as I'd like to be. Sheldon Dingwall wires his active basses to have a useful passive setting, where the passive setting is just as loud as the active setting, if all tones are set flat. My point: I have an OBP-3 in my ABII, and the difference in tone between active set flat and passive is negligible. There IS a difference, but not that much.

So...
I definitely have to go with bongo on this one. To say that there's NO difference in tone between active basses with identical preamps is ignorant. There is certainly LESS of a difference. Matt, you have the right idea, but you've taken it too far.

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

All I'm saying is.. same preamp on board with same amp rig, you get same sound/tones, regardless of the bass.

 

[Maj. Lee FUBAR]

Sheesh, take it outside guys.

I was an active guy early on, but I am currently digging the thumpy organic sound of passive pickups. Both have value depending on what you are trying to accomplish, and what particular bass you are working with. Just my 2 cents.

MLF

 

[69nites]

All I'm saying is.. same preamp on board with same amp rig, you get same sound/tones, regardless of the bass.

right....

strings, pickups, wood choices have nothing to do with it.

I should have known better than to read a thread like this outside the luither's forum.

 

[A9X]

All I'm saying is.. same preamp on board with same amp rig, you get same sound/tones, regardless of the bass.

Nope.

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

Yes... kinda... once an onboard preamp takes over the signal, wood tone equals squaduesh... you're hearing the preamp. Thats all i'm saying...

 

[69nites]

Yes... kinda... once an onboard preamp takes over the signal, wood tone equals squaduesh... you're hearing the preamp. Thats all i'm saying...

so once the signal hits the preamp section of you're amp the wood tones go away right?

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

Nope.

LOL... Okay, but i won't agree to disagree... i won't even do that for my wife...

 

[A9X]

Yes... kinda... once an onboard preamp takes over the signal, wood tone equals squaduesh... you're hearing the preamp. Thats all i'm saying...

Nope, definitely not my experience and I've been designing and working on audio electronics since before I was a teen. Even crap preamps will not so totally colour the sound that the inherent qualities of the instrument are lost.

 

[A9X]

LOL... Okay, but i won't agree to disagree... i won't even do that for my wife...

Great. I have no issue with differeing opinions, but blanket statements that are contrary to my experience and knowledge are usually challenged. Cheers.

 

[bongomania]

Matt, your position has no logical basis at all. So now you're reduced to posting funny pictures because you have nothing intelligent to say to back up your statements.

ALL electric basses, passive or active, go through a preamp. Bar none, no exceptions. So if what you said was true, then nobody would ever hear any difference of the wood or pickups from one bass to the next. An "active bass" just has a preamp on one end of the cord, while a passive bass relies on the preamp on the other end of the cord.

If your experience is that you can't hear any of those tonal qualities through an onboard preamp, then either (a) you didn't like that specific preamp, which is perfectly legitimate; or (b) your ability to hear any differences is reduced by either your ears or your amp/speakers/headphones.