All about Fret Sprout

[marchone]

I have two basses that have enough fret sprout to warrant correction. But 20 minutes in all? I’d spend that time on each end of all of them. That’s why I haven’t done it yet.

 

[micguy]

All my basses (except one) Have Warmoth roasted necks. Roasting stabilizes the wood considerably. In a dozen builds (for myself and others), in over a decade, not a single neck has developed fret sprout.

My other bass has a Mighty Mite neck. It also has absolutely no issues with fret sprout. Then again, that may be because it’s fretless.

 

[andare]

I have two basses that have enough fret sprout to warrant correction. But 20 minutes in all? I’d spend that time on each end of all of them. That’s why I haven’t done it yet.

It took me longer the first time but I did it on a cheap instrument. That gave me the confidence to work on my main instruments.
It's important to note that I use a very fine file - it takes a bit longer to file the frets but it doesn't leave deep gouges so the polishing is very swift.

 

[Larry Legend]

Hi Turnaround, thanks for the wonderful write up and photos/drawings!

After reading your tutorial, I ordered a 6” fine single cut Nicholson file for this purpose.

I noticed that when I hold the file as shown, the grooves facing me are nearly parallel to the neck, as you described. But the way the two-sided file is cut, the grooves on the side in contact with the fretboard are more or less perpendicular to the neck. It still doesn’t seem to be beating up the wood too much though.

Are the sides of your file cut differently, or is it possible that the grooves doing the work are actually perpendicular to the neck?

Your illustrations appear to show that with your technique, the file is only in contact with one fret at a time. Is that correct? If so, do you go back-and-forth on only one fret at a time, or do you traverse over several frets with each stroke of the file?

Thanks for all of your help!

 

[StayLow]

What about painted or gloss necks that have the gloss(?) over the edge of a fretboard and the fret ends.

I’ve seen this on rosewood boards. Unsure if it applies to maple or other woods.

The fret sprout can be enough to chip up and off slivers of the gloss. Wouldn’t running a file along that edge chew up all the gloss too?

 

[andare]

What about painted or gloss necks that have the gloss(?) over the edge of a fretboard and the fret ends.

I’ve seen this on rosewood boards. Unsure if it applies to maple or other woods.

The fret sprout can be enough to chip up and off slivers of the gloss. Wouldn’t running a file along that edge chew up all the gloss too?

I've filed fret sprout on one piece maple necks that were glossy all over. If the file is fine enough, like a #4, it will skate over the protruding fret ends and tangs and it won't really mar the finish. However you do want to kiss the finish if you really want to file the frets flush.

Micro mesh pads will restore the gloss and smoothness. It won't be as shiny as before but you will never see it. The feel is the same. We're talking the thickness of a fret slot after all. Of course I taped the neck below that line.

If you knock down the gloss on the back of the neck because it gets sticky, like I did, then this will be even less of a concern.

It's really no different than with a rosewood fretboard. Those often have glossy backs and sides too.

 

[Turnaround]

Hi Turnaround, thanks for the wonderful write up and photos/drawings!

After reading your tutorial, I ordered a 6” fine single cut Nicholson file for this purpose.

I noticed that when I hold the file as shown, the grooves facing me are nearly parallel to the neck, as you described. But the way the two-sided file is cut, the grooves on the side in contact with the fretboard are more or less perpendicular to the neck. It still doesn’t seem to be beating up the wood too much though.

Are the sides of your file cut differently, or is it possible that the grooves doing the work are actually perpendicular to the neck?

Your illustrations appear to show that with your technique, the file is only in contact with one fret at a time. Is that correct? If so, do you go back-and-forth on only one fret at a time, or do you traverse over several frets with each stroke of the file?

Thanks for all of your help!

The grooves should be at a slight angle to the neck, either slanted to the right or left. The path of the file stroke should be parallel to the neck. You can use longer strokes to cover more frets or simply attack one fret at a time. The key is to keep the file flat on the surface and use light pressure to avoid digging into the fretboard or finish.

 

[Turnaround]

What about painted or gloss necks that have the gloss(?) over the edge of a fretboard and the fret ends.

I’ve seen this on rosewood boards. Unsure if it applies to maple or other woods.

The fret sprout can be enough to chip up and off slivers of the gloss. Wouldn’t running a file along that edge chew up all the gloss too?

With light pressure an a good sharp file, the gloss may get a bit scratched, but not chewed up. A polish with super fine sandpaper and some buffing compound will remove the scratches.

 

[StayLow]

I've filed fret sprout on one piece maple necks that were glossy all over. If the file is fine enough, like a #4, it will skate over the protruding fret ends and tangs and it won't really mar the finish. However you do want to kiss the finish if you really want to file the frets flush.

Micro mesh pads will restore the gloss and smoothness. It won't be as shiny as before but you will never see it. The feel is the same. We're talking the thickness of a fret slot after all. Of course I taped the neck below that line.

If you knock down the gloss on the back of the neck because it gets sticky, like I did, then this will be even less of a concern.

It's really no different than with a rosewood fretboard. Those often have glossy backs and sides too.

With light pressure an a good sharp file, the gloss may get a bit scratched, but not chewed up. A polish with super fine sandpaper and some buffing compound will remove the scratches.

Thank you both. What I’m trying to describe isn’t the gloss being scarred or dulled. More so it flaking off like bits of an eggshell on a hard-boiled egg. Or it lifts up a bit - best way I can describe it - looking discolored as a result (on rosewood).

 

[Larry Legend]

The grooves should be at a slight angle to the neck, either slanted to the right or left. The path of the file stroke should be parallel to the neck. You can use longer strokes to cover more frets or simply attack one fret at a time. The key is to keep the file flat on the surface and use light pressure to avoid digging into the fretboard or finish.

Got it. Thank you Turnaround!

 

[Turnaround]

Thank you both. What I’m trying to describe isn’t the gloss being scarred or dulled. More so it flaking off like bits of an eggshell on a hard-boiled egg. Or it lifts up a bit - best way I can describe it - looking discolored as a result (on rosewood).

If it's chipping along the edge of the fretboard, it's going to chip if you file it or not. You can drop fill the areas that are chipped away, or remove the finish on the fretboard edge. If you do that you can refinish the edge or leave it unfinished. For myself I tend to leave the edges of a rosewood board unfinished, but apply finish to maple edges. For clients, it's their choice.

 

[StayLow]

If it's chipping along the edge of the fretboard, it's going to chip if you file it or not. You can drop fill the areas that are chipped away, or remove the finish on the fretboard edge. If you do that you can refinish the edge or leave it unfinished. For myself I tend to leave the edges of a rosewood board unfinished, but apply finish to maple edges. For clients, it's their choice.

Thanks very much.

I’d prefer unfinished.

If you care to explain “drop fill” and how to remove finish on the fretboard edge, that’d be much appreciated.

Also, does it change anything if it’s a panted neck?

 

[Turnaround]

Drop fill -


You can sand off the finish on the fretboard edge, or use a scraper. Feather the finish on the neck into the bare edge of the fretboard.

A painted neck is done the same way.

 

[Bent77]

I just wanted to give a shout out to @Turnaround for the info here. This method is quick and simple, and effective.
Thanks

 

[odarellmc]

OK on to the treatment of fret sprout. There are two basic ways to treat the condition:

1. Trim the protruding fret ends
2. Re-hydrate the fretboard so it expands back to its original dimension.

Working on the principle of the least intrusive solution, it would seem that item 2 would be best. It alters nothing on the instrument and allows conditions to return to "normal" with no drastic measures. And indeed it may be the best solution, but only if you keep the instrument in a humidity controlled environment. For many of us that's not really feasible. So we are left with treatment #1 - trimming the fret ends. It's not a bad solution. If done when the condition is at its worst, it will only need to be done once in the life of the instrument. we trim the frets when the fretboard has shrunk as far as it will, then as the seasons change and the fretboard expands again the frets wil be slightly behind the edge of the board. When it gets dry again the board shrinks back to its worst-case width and we've already dealt with that, so all is good.

But there seem to be a lot of suggestions on how to trim the fret ends properly. There may be several valid ways to do it, but here I will describe the way I think is best. First let's look at the condition:

View attachment 3363208

It's pretty easy to see that the tang if the fret is protruding a bit. Trimming this is done with a file. But what file? And that's where you will get a lot of differing opinion.

First off, the file needs to be a fine one, generally the finer the better. We want to trim the fret without damaging the surrounding wood and/or finish. It's also particularly useful if the file is single cut. We'll get into the why a bit later.

Next, the file needs to be run along the edge of the fretboard. This pic from Fender is the way to do it:

View attachment 3363215

This is NOT the way to do it:

View attachment 3363217

Why is this not a good way? First it's far too easy to tilt the file a bit and consequently cut a groove in the fretboard edge. Secondly, the tape on the edge of the fretboard will leave the fret end proud of the edge of the board by the thickness of the tape. It may be better than when you started, but it still will not be flush the way it should be.

But without taping the fretboard edge, how do you keep the file from scarring wood or finish? Well, you don't. But you keep it to a minimum and polish it out afterward. Keeping the scratching to a minimum is a matter of using the right tool and utilizing the right technique, bolstered by a good deal of practice. I already mentioned that the file should be fine and single cut. Here's a single cut file on the left and a double-cut on the right:

View attachment 3363221

Notice that the teeth run at one angle on the single-cut file. If we orient those teeth so that the grooves are nearly parallel to the length of the fretboard as we file we can keep the abrasion of the wood to a minimum. The file should be angled like this:

View attachment 3363249

You can see that the file teeth are not exactly parallel to the direction of the neck, just slightly angled. You slide the file along the edge of the fretboard parallel to the neck:

View attachment 3363260

Now if the file is fine and sharp, and if you are applying only light pressure, the file will skip along the wood with barely a scratch but will grab and cut on the fret ends. Keep the file flat on the edge of the fretboard and follow the small radius on the edge of the board. Any scratches left on the wood can be polished off with 1200 grit or finer wet-and-dry sandpaper or buffing pads. At the same time that polishing will remove minor file marks from the ends of the frets.

Some advocate using this kind of a rig to dress the fret ends:

View attachment 3364011

This is not the right tool for the job - it is for putting the bevel on the ends of the frets and will not trim the tangs. There is a variation of this tools where the file is held perpendicular rather than at an angle. It will trim the fret tangs, but is rather a clumsy tool for a job that requires a delicate touch.

And there are a number of files that are sold as fret end dressing files that are the wrong tool for this job, though the name of the file suggests it's what is needed. These files are narrow files meant to round the fret ends:

View attachment 3363286

They are used to take a fret from this state

View attachment 3363288

to this state:

View attachment 3363289

They are not useful for trimming the tangs at all. Even for their designed purpose, they require a good deal of skill to use. Here's an example of some fret end dressing that was done badly using the wrong tool:

View attachment 3363792


Enough for now. More later.

Now I'm too scared to take to any except you, lol. How would you assess if a luthier is using the right tools?

 

[Turnaround]

Now I'm too scared to take to any except you, lol. How would you assess if a luthier is using the right tools?

Only 2 ways I can think of - ask, or watch him do the work.

 

[MaxSpinrun]

Thank you so much for this information. Where can I order the appropriate fine cut file? I want to approach this very slowly.

 

[Turnaround]

Thank you so much for this information. Where can I order the appropriate fine cut file? I want to approach this very slowly.

A decent tool supplier... I don't know what's available in your area.

 

[MaxSpinrun]

Went to Ace Hardware, and purchased Nicholson single cut file 6 inch file. it was the finest one that they had. thank you for the reply.

 

[Turnaround]

Went to Ace Hardware, and purchased Nicholson single cut file 6 inch file. it was the finest one that they had. thank you for the reply.

Good. A new file will be nice and sharp. If you use it the way I specified with light pressure, the sharp teeth will catch the fret ends and cut them down while skidding over the finish.