American Dream or Great Depression?

[hbarcat]

Sure... you'd just need to get the majority of people to get off their apathetic butts and do something.

Good luck.

+1

The government does what the voters want and if the majority of citizens can't be bothered to peel their butts off the couch for ten minutes to go vote, and the few citizens who do vote mostly vote based on bumper sticker slogans, then why is it the politicians' fault for the American Dream going bad?

 

[jwbassman]

Yeah, stupid capitalism.

We should switch to a better alternative........

No need for a better alternative. If more people would save money and invest and take advantage of capitalism then they'd cash in on the bottom line.

 

[ModulusFan]

That goes along with the current mortgage debacle. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Most people were paying their mortgages on time. That of course draws no attention.

Yep!!!!!!

Quick question.......how do you feel about the bailouts being imposed to lenders? How about the proposed $15k rebate to new home buyers?

I'm opposed to both. Like you said, most people paid their mortgages as agreed. Where's the reward for those who bought responsibly? There isn't any, just bailouts for the ones who weren't, and incentives for people to do more of the same. Screw that, I busted balls to earn and save my money to own a home, so should everyone else. Just let the market hit bottom on its own already, and let it rebound instead of trying to delay it with a bunch of bs.

 

[ModulusFan]

This Is the best statement I have seen on this thread so far.
ya, they only care about one thing. MONEY! Any bodies can see it with eyes. Just like stock, revolving around the true evil.
In this time, people cannot be happy and thankful for what they possess and some will kill for what they believe. With a mindset that what they think is right, not even considering the possibility that some may have different opinions.
Just like all the soldiers who tool for these masters, holding the name of god as they kill. Being just as guilty as a murderer.
When those in charge are the one who cause the conflict.
Then they make us fund the wars, with taxes.
The people should not be punished for the greed of those in power.
I am unemployed and I will never work. I play bass, and i love it.
Gigs are all i need to survive so far...I pay rent by it and live well to.
But no gig is certain. And i will gladly sleep outside, if i ever lose.
lol oh yea I don't pay taxes either. Income tax is another BS thing, and i won't even begin on how much i think the psychiatry industry keeps our people druged.
Not to sound like a herbalist either, but hemp is one of the greatest plants. It has proteins in it which can aid survival,it can make rope, cloths, houses and even a car was built from hemp resin in like 1940 or something. I think it even ran on hemp and was biodegradable.
Oh yea, there are also 25,000 known uses for it.

Even though your closing note is unrelated, why am I not surprised to see as much coming from you? You, and people with like attitudes ARE the problem. You chose your username wisely.

 

[jomahu]

There are a LOT more people here now than there were, and the boom in population the last few years has been fueled in large part by illegal migration of people who have been told they can bilk the system. Many of them do, indeed, qualify for "food stamps," no questions asked.

So, no. No, things aren't as bad as they'd like you to think.

uhhh, no. undocumented folks are not eligible for social programs. unless you're a permanent resident or citizen, you can't get any benefits.

things may not be as bad as all that, but it ain't rosy.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Yep!!!!!!

Quick question.......how do you feel about the bailouts being imposed to lenders? How about the proposed $15k rebate to new home buyers?

I'm opposed to both. Like you said, most people paid their mortgages as agreed. Where's the reward for those who bought responsibly? There isn't any, just bailouts for the ones who weren't, and incentives for people to do more of the same. Screw that, I busted balls to earn and save my money to own a home, so should everyone else. Just let the market hit bottom on its own already, and let it rebound instead of trying to delay it with a bunch of bs.

Unfortunately, like other recent events, you get into a ___storm and right or wrong, there's no easy way out. On the one hand bailouts can reward those who were intentionally financially irresponsible, on the other if home prices go in the toilet... so does yours. I'm in the mortgage business (on the wholesale side) and it didn't take a genius to see that the rapid appreciation that occured in the previous five or so years couldn't continue... but obviously many believed that.

IMO you don't buy up to the limit you can afford, knowing anything approaching a worse case scenario will wipe you out.

Mortgage guidelines have already tightened drastically over the last year. The loans that are defaulting now and going forward are under the looser, older guidelines for the most part. Everyone wasn't lied to about negative amortization on option ARMs... like many things, they largely ignored the fact that if they made only the minimum payment, their principle would go up. In many cases people are looking at homes that have lost tens or maybe hundreds of thousands of dollars on paper and decide to walk away rather than make the payment. That happened to a surprising degree in Florida where investment property buyers were having a field day.

People have ARMs adjusting and can't afford the payment, when in many cases they could've locked into a fixed rate for maybe 1 percent more that they could've afforded but didn't want to pay the extra money when they got the loan. That kind of short-sighted thinking got a lot of people in trouble. And not paying their bills got a lot of people into credit trouble, some for legit reasons but if I had a dime for every time I looked at a loan application and someone made ~$24k/yr and had a $500 car payment. That's just stupid.

So how do I feel about the buyouts? I don't like it. I still need to see the details. Given that, I'd still rather be in the situation I'm in, paying my bills on time and not needing to be bailed out.

 

[hbarcat]

...most people paid their mortgages as agreed. Where's the reward for those who bought responsibly? There isn't any, just bailouts for the ones who weren't, and incentives for people to do more of the same. Screw that, I busted balls to earn and save my money to own a home, so should everyone else. Just let the market hit bottom on its own already, and let it rebound instead of trying to delay it with a bunch of bs.

+1

 

[Fool]

Even though your closing note is unrelated, why am I not surprised to see as much coming from you? You, and people with like attitudes ARE the problem. You chose your username wisely.

haha ok

Why are people like me the problem if you don't mind me asking.
There is no doubt in my mind the path i am taking is wrong...
perhaps since your so enlightened on these matters, Help me become a better person at least instead of judging me ya?

Really I see us all as the The Fool, We are all just trying to find our place in life...and be happy in the process. I don't know if there is some Deity,
But i feel like these things people revolve themselves around is wrong, and not really what Life is about.

Like I said, Im a student in this life...MAybe we are here just to serve the man, And work for the rest of our lives. And Follow the leaders and believe everything they have to say. And follow them to our own demise and that of innocent people.

And I think Hemp is a large problem here in the US. And I find it to relate to the topic American Dream or great depression.
Perhaps you don't. Our economy could be way better.
I listed many reasons why i think it would help prevent such a depression.
It's ok though man, I respect your position on this matter.
A least I was wise by picking a damn username as you put it.
hahaha
Such a wise decision lolol a username.....

On just another note, No wisdom was really involved.
My people are always like, whatsup fool. It just sortof became a nickname. But In your perception it was a wise decision lol

Obviously you put some thought into your own username. For whatever reasons. Why would you think others do?
some say the way you view the world is a reflection of your personality. The way you think is the way you'll see things.
But I like how you recognized the process in which I chose my username. Perhaps My wise decision will bring myself something one day.

You kinda sounded like some wise man indian to me lololol
Sorry i might just be foolin around though.

"you chose your username wisely"

Anyways I dunno why you weren't surprised, Hey YOU saw my username. It means SO much. lol, You Typed asif you were expecting something from me over an internet forum.

You cracked me up, with your expressionism. I mean I have never even held a conversation with you. I probably would have thought you were chill to hang out with but obviously you one of those "YOUR WRONG AND IM RIGHT" types. I like OPEN minded people, more than those who think they know everything.

Ok I do not plan on returning to this thread, and I am interested in learning. So please PM or something, You can more than likely teach me some things. It's not like the real world problems are shown in the media.

Hel! there is a chance Im just some confused guy, and All the things I see when I walk around LA or watch the news are just acted out by some people and shown just to scare us into thinking there are issues when theres not. It's hard to know whats true, So many lies.

After all, we live in a world where everything is exactly how it seems.

 

[Spoiled Grape]

IBTL.

 

[Hawaii Islander]

Things are not looking so great in paradise.

Housing prices are dropping and the building boom is over.

Aloha Airlines just went belly up. :scowl:

I think things are going to get much worse before it gets better.

I also saw on MSNBC.com that 200,000 banking industry workers are about to be layed off.

Anyone looking at music gear websites recently will have noticed drastic increases in prices. It's weird to see prices going up before your very eyes.

Regular unleaded gas is $3.61 per gallon on the island of Hawaii. More in other parts of the state.

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

Yeah, stupid capitalism.

We should switch to a better alternative........

Well in a way this was what surprised me - so if the government is supporting that many people and keeping them afloat - then you are actually circumventing Capitalism and cushioning its effects.

You are saying that Capitalism is wrong/not working and we don't accept its natural consequences - we can't accept people starving or suffering, we are going to help those who are needy.

I don't want to get political and am talking from a purely philosophical/theoretical point of view - but this is the basis of Socialism?

 

[Illbay]

... then you are actually circumventing Capitalism and cushioning its effects.

Yes, and that's a Bad Thing.

However, since the Roosevelt years, it is considered "proper" for government to "do something" so that people won't be sad.

The net result, as we see in Europe, is a stagnant, slow-growth economy with high unemployment and little incentive for creation of capital.

But that suits politicians just fine, since increased dependency means increased power for them.

"For the children."

 

[Illbay]

Really I see us all as the The Fool, We are all just trying to find our place in life...

I use your username on some forums as well, and for the same reason.

Interesting how arrogant many people are, though. They don't seem to understand that we're all "fools" to a very great degree.

 

[WRBass]

Again, we are all negative about the economy now because of the media and it's an election year. The real GDP growth in the US economy was 3.2%. Not great, but better than most of the western countries and close to the average over the last 20 years. It's better than in 2003 (2.45%) and 2004 (3.1%). In 2003 and 2004 we were not all running around like Chicken Littles worrying about a recession or depression.

People need to do a little research a stop listening to CNN, MSNBC, ABC, and the politicians.

 

[jomahu]

Again, we are all negative about the economy now because of the media and it's an election year. The real GDP growth in the US economy was 3.2%. Not great, but better than most of the western countries and close to the average over the last 20 years. It's better than in 2003 (2.45%) and 2004 (3.1%). In 2003 and 2004 we were not all running around like Chicken Littles worrying about a recession or depression.

People need to do a little research a stop listening to CNN, MSNBC, ABC, and the politicians.

well, in 2003 and 2004, people were more preoccupied with the gays ruining humanity than with, say, a dreadful war or the price of gas.
it works both ways. but paying $3.12 for gas and trillions of dollars on war is still rather outrageous.

i guess it all depends on the context. if comparing the US to the world (which is a big place), things are alrite. if comparing the US to the US, then....i dunno, it's bad and getting worse for a lot of people.

 

[txbasschik]

I've been where you are. All I can say is that it's great now when you're young, but the system, unfortunately is bigger than you. It will beat you down. You will conform. Sad to say that this the truth.

Ayup. Very sad, but very true.

When I was young, I was full of political and moral fire, and I believed that if enough people acted on that same fire, we'd change things.

But the system has beaten me. Its just too big. All I can do is the little things, and abide by my own morality, and resist what I see as wrong in society as much as possible.

It seems to be that way for everyone. We do what we can, but as you age, you can't go around angry all the time. It wears you out. Just do what we can, every day. That's it.

Cherie

 

[ModulusFan]

haha ok

Why are people like me the problem if you don't mind me asking.
There is no doubt in my mind the path i am taking is wrong...

Sounds like I don't need to explain anything.

Tax evasion will put you in the big house. Not bothering to join the rest of the employed world puts you without health insurance, putting the burden on everyone else.

 

[Illbay]

Again, we are all negative about the economy now because of the media and it's an election year.

+10

 

[ModulusFan]

Or maybe the trillion we owe china? Or maybe the dollar being on a race to the bottom with the peso?

As skilled labor goes, I can tell you first hand that it's been on a solid and steady decline for the past 10 years, and is currently at its worst.

 

[Illbay]

...people were more preoccupied with the gays ruining humanity...

In your mind, maybe.

I find remarks like this to be precious. The referenda that you speak of were sparked, not by some popular uprising of concerned Christians, but in reaction to an outrageous decision of a state supreme court in Vermont, that would have FORCED all other states to recognize an institution that the people therein did not want.

So when people said "hey, we'd better do something proactively about this," people like YOU bellyached about it.

Here's a clue: tell your activist judge friends to stop dictating law to the people of this country, and then maybe the people of this country won't have to remind you how dreadfully in the minority your views are.

(But of course some people LOVE to be "dreadfully in the minority." It makes them feel morally superior).