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Ampeg Rocket Bass Combos

#201
rodl2005 said:
Passive P mostly, but I woulda used my Stingray 5 and Alleva-Copollo EUT5 jazz 5 which are both active
Click to expand...

Although Bass Players are, as we all know, the Highest Form of Human Existence, many of us aren't very good at communicating. :) We often expect that what WE know about certain things, the person we're "texting to" knows as well. That, unfortunately, is often not the case. :(

In your case I respectfully offer the following: Are you padding the input on your amp when using active basses? Are you using high quality cables...both line and speaker? I can't begin to tell you how many players, young and old have spoken about "Crappy Gear" only to discover that they're using lamp cord for line applications....quite often between pedals.

I often see entire backlines all plugged into a single 20 amp AC circuit....and the band wondering why their gear sounds horrid. :)

I'll never make fun of that because as a young bass player I used stretch line cables as Speaker cables......cuz I was Stupid....a Total Idiot !! Nobody wants to look like a Jerk in front of a hundred other guys online.....so from what I often see, very few REALLY helpful answers are given in Forums cuz very few Players want to appear to be idiots.

I think the Very Best Bass Amp on the planet is a Sunn 200S. Why? Cuz it only has three knobs on it. It's almost impossible to screw up. Does my Active MM Bongo sound Bassilicious through it? Incredible!! How about my Passive Cunneto Custom Shop Jazz? Fabulous. The Key to success??......a 20 year old AXE DI which has variable input AND output levels and a Furman Power Conditioner which tells me EXACTLY how much AC my Amp is getting. I've been on stages which had 30 amp circuits....and I was getting less than 10 amps. I'd run an extension cord 50' to a separate circuit. Problem instantly Solved! :)

Your Music Man is one of my Favorite Basses and packs a Hell of a Whallop to the front end of Pedals or an Amp plugged in directly .... I'd suggest that taking it down to the bare minimum-plugging your Basses directly into the front end of the amp-will solve any potential problems. Have a line out and in put into any amp you love that doesn't have one and use THAT circuit to drive any pedals you might use. I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know how you make out. :) The Very best to You. RB
 
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#202
R Briere said:
Although Bass Players are, as we all know, the Highest Form of Human Existence, many of us aren't very good at communicating. :) We often expect that what WE know about certain things, the person we're "texting to" knows as well. That, unfortunately, is often not the case. :(

In your case I respectfully offer the following: Are you padding the input on your amp when using active basses? Are you using high quality cables...both line and speaker? I can't begin to tell you how many players, young and old have spoken about "Crappy Gear" only to discover that they're using lamp cord for line applications....quite often between pedals.

I often see entire backlines all plugged into a single 20 amp AC circuit....and the band wondering why their gear sounds horrid. :)

I'll never make fun of that because as a young bass player I used stretch line cables as Speaker cables......cuz I was Stupid....a Total Idiot !! Nobody wants to look like a Jerk in front of a hundred other guys online.....so from what I often see, very few REALLY helpful answers are given in Forums cuz very few Players want to appear to be idiots.

I think the Very Best Bass Amp on the planet is a Sunn 200S. Why? Cuz it only has three knobs on it. It's almost impossible to screw up. Does my Active MM Bongo sound Bassilicious through it? Incredible!! How about my Passive Cunneto Custom Shop Jazz? Fabulous. The Key to success??......a 20 year old AXE DI which has variable input AND output levels and a Furman Power Conditioner which tells me EXACTLY how much AC my Amp is getting. I've been on stages which had 30 amp circuits....and I was getting less than 10 amps. I'd run an extension cord 50' to a separate circuit. Problem instantly Solved! :)

Your Music Man is one of my Favorite Basses and packs a Hell of a Whallop to the front end of Pedals or an Amp plugged in directly .... I'd suggest that taking it down to the bare minimum-plugging your Basses directly into the front end of the amp-will solve any potential problems. Have a line out and in put into any amp you love that doesn't have one and use THAT circuit to drive any pedals you might use. I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know how you make out. :) The Very best to You. RB
Click to expand...

All good points.

I've been playing since I was 12 ('76), and while I've done things as such long ago, the experiences I spoke of with my, now gone PF115HE's... I had 2, liked the tone, not so much the power handling.... and, also long gone, Rumble 500C, were at home, at gigs and at rehearsals.
I use mostly Bergantino cabs, apart from my Fender Bassman Pro Neo 115.. and this 115, seems, to me at least, to handle more power without fartness happening
Coulda been particular to the Rumble 500C and PF115HEs I had I s'pose.
Never the less, I moved both on and am happy with what I've got now
 
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#212
R Briere said:
In your case I respectfully offer the following: Are you padding the input on your amp when using active basses? Are you using high quality cables...both line and speaker? I can't begin to tell you how many players, young and old have spoken about "Crappy Gear" only to discover that they're using lamp cord for line applications....quite often between pedals.
Click to expand...

Many active basses do not require the use of a padded input since the levels are very much the same as a passive bass (some even have level trim controls that allow for trimming the level to match the other basses being used). In fact, there are passive basses that have a higher level than a typical active bass. Padded or active inputs are intended for hotter than average active basses that can overdrive the "passive" input. There are some (less than 2% IME) active basses with stupid-hot levels, these can benefit from a padded input but they are the exception to the rule. Bass amp designers have adapted and their products generally handle higher input levels than in "the good 'ol days".

In the last 20 years of supporting bass amps/cabinets, this scenario of using "lamp cord" for ANY application has come up so infrequently that it's quite rare. This is especially true for manufacturers that have incorporated modern features like SpeakOn connectors. Also, bass players, IME, have become pretty savvy regarding interconnections, the level of knowledge is much greater and better appreciated than in the "good 'ol days".

R Briere said:
I often see entire backlines all plugged into a single 20 amp AC circuit....and the band wondering why their gear sounds horrid. :)
Click to expand...

For the average band, provided that the 20 amp circuit is really that, it will be plenty fine. For example, due to increases in efficiency, an 800 watt bass amp (the largest draw on a stage typically) will draw <6 amps (even an SVT draws about that. A couple of guitar amps will draw an average of 3 amps each, a keyboard rig will draw a couple of amps and you are well under 15 amps worst case.

R Briere said:
II'll never make fun of that because as a young bass player I used stretch line cables as Speaker cables......cuz I was Stupid....a Total Idiot !! Nobody wants to look like a Jerk in front of a hundred other guys online.....so from what I often see, very few REALLY helpful answers are given in Forums cuz very few Players want to appear to be idiots.
Click to expand...

I think you would do everybody a favor here and spend a little bit of time learning about this forum, and appreciate the level of GOOD information and help offered by many qualified members here.

R Briere said:
IThe Key to success??......a 20 year old AXE DI which has variable input AND output levels and a Furman Power Conditioner which tells me EXACTLY how much AC my Amp is getting. I've been on stages which had 30 amp circuits....and I was getting less than 10 amps. I'd run an extension cord 50' to a separate circuit. Problem instantly Solved! :)
Click to expand...

While ridiculing many of us here as not understanding or appreciating the fine points of your knowledge, You are showing your lack of understanding and knowledge her because the Furman power conditioners (both the PL and M series) do not tell you how many AMPS (current) you are "getting", they display VOLTAGE. The CURRENT that is delivered to the load (the amplifier) depends on many factors including the signal level, the speaker load connected, and to a minor extent the AC voltage. The current is not displayed, nor is it practical to display because it will vary by as much as 10:1 between steady state quiescent and dynamic loading typical of a music load.

In case you were unaware, the electrical code limits the maximum AC CURRENT to a standard duplex (NEMA 5-20) receptacle to 20 amps. Any 30 amp duplex receptacle would not be code compliant, nor would it be something encountered without questioning everything else associated with the claim. In the past 20 years, this sort of thing has been enforced pretty effectively based on my (extensive) touring experience as a sound company and power distro supplier.
 
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#213
agedhorse said:
Many active basses do not require the use of a padded input since the levels are very much the same as a passive bass (some even have level trim controls that allow for trimming the level to match the other basses being used). In fact, there are passive basses that have a higher level than a typical active bass. Padded or active inputs are intended for hotter than average active basses that can overdrive the "passive" input. There are some (less than 2% IME) active basses with stupid-hot levels, these can benefit from a padded input but they are the exception to the rule. Bass amp designers have adapted and their products generally handle higher input levels than in "the good 'ol days".

In the last 20 years of supporting bass amps/cabinets, this scenario of using "lamp cord" for ANY application has come up so infrequently that it's quite rare. This is especially true for manufacturers that have incorporated modern features like SpeakOn connectors. Also, bass players, IME, have become pretty savvy regarding interconnections, the level of knowledge is much greater and better appreciated than in the "good 'ol days".



For the average band, provided that the 20 amp circuit is really that, it will be plenty fine. For example, due to increases in efficiency, an 800 watt bass amp (the largest draw on a stage typically) will draw <6 amps (even an SVT draws about that. A couple of guitar amps will draw an average of 3 amps each, a keyboard rig will draw a couple of amps and you are well under 15 amps worst case.



I think you would do everybody a favor here and spend a little bit of time learning about this forum, and appreciate the level of GOOD information and help offered by many qualified members here.



While ridiculing many of us here as not understanding or appreciating the fine points of your knowledge, You are showing your lack of understanding and knowledge her because the Furman power conditioners (both the PL and M series) do not tell you how many AMPS (current) you are "getting", they display VOLTAGE. The CURRENT that is delivered to the load (the amplifier) depends on many factors including the signal level, the speaker load connected, and to a minor extent the AC voltage. The current is not displayed, nor is it practical to display because it will vary by as much as 10:1 between steady state quiescent and dynamic loading typical of a music load.

In case you were unaware, the electrical code limits the maximum AC CURRENT to a standard duplex (NEMA 5-20) receptacle to 20 amps. Any 30 amp duplex receptacle would not be code compliant, nor would it be something encountered without questioning everything else associated with the claim. In the past 20 years, this sort of thing has been enforced pretty effectively based on my (extensive) touring experience as a sound company and power distro supplier.
Click to expand...
I'm not going to kid you, a local Mesa retailer had a lamp cord speaker cord. I walked out.
Came back the next day with my cords and bass. The look on their face when, SURPRISE, it sounded better. I took my business elsewhere(got my WD800 later and not from them) because who knows what kind of abuse the cabs or amp took. it was a SMDH moment.
 
#214
redstrand said:
I'm not going to kid you, a local Mesa retailer had a lamp cord speaker cord. I walked out.
Came back the next day with my cords and bass. The look on their face when, SURPRISE, it sounded better. I took my business elsewhere(got my WD800 later and not from them) because who knows what kind of abuse the cabs or amp took. it was a SMDH moment.
Click to expand...

Not wishing to sound ignorant or open up a can of worms, but I would be interested to hear a compelling technical argument against using lamp cord for speaker cable.
 
#216
And by sounded like crap, the lack of shielding produced a nice hum, it sounded horrible, pile of mud. The ends were at best just screwed together and not taped well. Moved it a little and POOF, no signal. Just spend a couple of bucks on the right thing and you'll be happy. Lamp cord, sheesh. Can't imagine reaching behind the amp and not getting electrocuted.
Like I said, brought my stuff and clear, quiet deep bass tone magically appeared!
 
#217
redstrand said:
And by sounded like crap, the lack of shielding produced a nice hum, it sounded horrible, pile of mud. The ends were at best just screwed together and not taped well. Moved it a little and POOF, no signal. Just spend a couple of bucks on the right thing and you'll be happy. Lamp cord, sheesh. Can't imagine reaching behind the amp and not getting electrocuted.
Like I said, brought my stuff and clear, quiet deep bass tone magically appeared!
Click to expand...

That just sounds like a badly-made cable, which can happen no what cord is used. Btw there is generally no shielding in speaker cables.
 
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#218
Hold on a minute, speaker cables are not shielded and can’t be the cause of hum.

The main problem with “zip cord)” is the difficulty in strain relieving the terminals, and if the manufacturer is willing to use zip cord to save a few pennies, where else are they doing this (hint... connectors and assembly labor)
 
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#219
ficelles said:
That just sounds like a badly-made cable, which can happen no what cord is used. Btw there is generally no shielding in speaker cables.
Click to expand...
True, but whatever leftover cord they used was horrid and ruined whatever they were trying to sell. Technically it’s just a black and white wire set. Still, just spend a couple of bucks so you know you’re getting the right thing. I make my own instrument cables and still use quality cables and ends, dead quiet and sound great. Tried the lamp cord thing once, once. Absolutely nasty. Very happy with the cords I have, bullet proof and just work.
 

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